It really amazes me how different people's reactions to domestic abuse are when there is a video compared to when there is not. I know the video serves as evidence but so do the bruises, contusions, blood, concussions, etc. that the woman has. How is it less bad without a video? Like a local sports radio commentator said after the Rice incident, the Ravens didn't cut him because they saw the video - they cut him because the world saw it. That incident was probably not much worse than the 50+ such incidents in the NFL over the past decade (including some Steelers) but unlike those couldn't be swept under the rug because of the video. Just because there isn't a (known) video of Voynov beating his wife doesn't mean that it isn't as bad or even worse than the Rice incident. And all but the the most callous Ravens fans agreed with dumping Rice.

Hockey is my favorite sport to watch for a variety of reasons including the blend of speed, skill, strategy, and physicality it has. I also like the fact that the guys who play it seem like good, normal people for the most part. Incidents like Voynov's are rare among NHL players. In the NFL, they were routine until the Rice incident. If it were not for the fact that the players of the NFL were playing professional football half of them would likely be in prison. This has caused me to lose interest in the game, including in the Steelers. Baseball and Basketball are too boring for me.

I do agree with you that there is no way that the Pens will be able to unload Scuderi and I don't think the Kings need Martin, even if they lose Voynov for the season. There are some teams that could probably use Martin but I would rather the Pens just keep him .
- PghPens668771

Kind of makes you wonder if P. Kane's taxi incident happened now what would happen?

I love the idea of Simmonds on the Pens...
- j.boyd919

Well, if you're cool with giving up Olli Maata, I think we can start talking.

I get that Kings fans love Voynov and that he is a very good hockey player, but the dude chose the wrong time to slap a women around because after Ray Rice people rightfully started caring. Not you, of course, as you've made your love of "Freeing Slava!" clear, whatever that means.

I maintain that if the Kings wanted to they could likley void his contract under the NHL morality clause if they so chose. Likely, as I haven't been able to find an exact NHL morals clause language. At this point who knows if he'll be convicted of a felony or not, but in a civil case he's very likley done more than enough for the Kings to easily prove that he has damaged their reputation. Just Google "Voynov" and "Domestice Abuse;" You'll see that the words "LA Kings" appear before in every article. Unless you think the Kings want to be associated with domestic above, then its clear they have at least some cause under any standard morality clause to cut ties.
- s0rcerer1984

Are you saying there is a right or better time to beat up a woman?

Well, if you're cool with giving up Olli Maata, I think we can start talking.
- jmatchett383

Personally... I don't think I would be opposed to that. I don't see him going anywhere, but that is one trade I might be ok with.....

I'd pass on that from Colorado's perspective. How do you feel about our current regimes foreign policy and if you wouldn't mind please talk to me a little about religion.
- dbell646

That deal was close to fair.

I was hoping for business ethics, but foreign policy is blah blah blah oil and religion is blah blah blah oil. Take that.

I just remembered this and I can't believe no one had brought it up but for those who are worried about losing Martins experience and the lack thereof with our prospects just remember that last year we basically had all of them up for quite a while during another injury plagued season. It's another reason why I'm comfortable and confident in trading Martin++ for our needs. Maatta and some of the others were playing huge minutes. Either way I wouldn't move him if it was just a rental swap or for picks.

I just remembered this and I can't believe no one had brought it up but for those who are worried about losing Martins experience and the lack thereof with our prospects just remember that last year we basically had all of them up for quite a while during another injury plagued season. It's another reason why I'm comfortable and confident in trading Martin++ for our needs. Maatta and some of the others were playing huge minutes. Either way I wouldn't move him if it was just a rental swap or for picks.
- ImScore71

Experience is overrated, imho.

Are you saying there is a right or better time to beat up a woman?
- jmatchett383

No, of course not. I'm saying that the type of incident that Voynov seems to be invovled in has occured many, many, many times across sports and the US in general without the general public to caring one bit or the athlete at issue suffering any consequences. However, after the Ray Rice incident it does seem to appear that the issue is gaining the appropriate response as to the perpetrator suffering consequences instead of being let off due to being good at a sport.

In short, what I am saying is that if this incident occured 10yrs, 5yrs or even 1 yr ago I doubt that the NHL would have taken such swift and decisive action as the public response would not have occured.

I still say unless one of the young D just totally proves himself worthy of top 4 minutes, Pens hold onto Martin and ride him out for the year in search of a Cup.

You have a quality PMD at a decent cap hit.

Even if the Kings traded for PMart with the intent of extending him, what would they realistically give up? Not going to be Justin Williams. Not Tifolli. Its going to be Nolan or King + a pick or two.

If GMJR turns Martin into a top 6 winger who isn't a rental, I'd be thrilled with that. I just don't see that deal out there to be made.

I forget who reported it, but yes that seems to be "rumor" out there. Plus, he was also "rumored" to be unhappy with the changes in the organization. He's a good player, but if he was somehow happy with the spectacular failures of the last regime, I say don't let the door hit you in the ass.
- madmike71

an organization that, even if the moves were warrented, severly mishandled the situation? If I was any player except crosby or malkin I would have been unhappy with how they handled the situation.

I still say unless one of the young D just totally proves himself worthy of top 4 minutes, Pens hold onto Martin and ride him out for the year in search of a Cup.

You have a quality PMD at a decent cap hit.

Even if the Kings traded for PMart with the intent of extending him, what would they realistically give up? Not going to be Justin Williams. Not Tifolli. Its going to be Nolan or King + a pick or two.

If GMJR turns Martin into a top 6 winger who isn't a rental, I'd be thrilled with that. I just don't see that deal out there to be made.
- 87_71_11_29

How do you feel about not getting anything in return for Orpik, Nisky? (serious question, not being an ass)

Experience is overrated, imho.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Look how much experience Scuds has...2 cup rings, 3 finals, 10+years...I'll go with young and hungry.

How do you feel about not getting anything in return for Orpik, Nisky? (serious question, not being an ass)
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Orpik, nothing.

Nisk, would have like to have gotten a lower pick for his rights, but we will live.

How do you feel about not getting anything in return for Orpik, Nisky? (serious question, not being an ass)
- YouMeAndDupuis9

We lost Orpik several years ago. When he signed with Washington it was addition by subtraction in my opinion.

Although losing Niskanen hurt somewhat (his defensive skills were average - his main asset was shooting a lot, even if most of his shots were way off target) last season, like all the seasons since 2008 was a season the Pens were expected to make a run at the Cup. You have to put the best team on the ice possible if you think you have a good chance of winning the Cup. I don't disagree with Shero letting him play out his contract, especially since he got overpaid by Washington (Orpik much more so).

Well, if you're cool with giving up Olli Maata, I think we can start talking.
- jmatchett383

You take that back!

How do you feel about not getting anything in return for Orpik, Nisky? (serious question, not being an ass)
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Obviously you always want a return for a player. But when it comes to a player coming up on UFA, it depends if you want to make a run or sacrifice for the future. I think the Penguins have been a "win now" team since 2008, and that window won't last forever. They held onto Niskanen because he gave them the best chance to win last year. It didn't work, but keeping him made them a better team, gave them a better shot.

You take that back!


- rival22

Well, if you want a guy like Simmonds, especially from a division rival, then you better be prepared to pony up.

Actually, if the Flyers were to give Simmonds to the Penguins (or Rangers, Blue Jackets, etc.) then even Olli Maata probably wouldn't get it done alone. I realize that Matta and Simmonds may be a fair trade, but if the Penguins did come calling, a drastic overpayment would be required to pry Simmonds away.

You take that back!


- rival22

I honestly don't think that is a terrible trade. In my opinion, it's a good hockey trade. Pens dealing from an area of strength to bolster an area of weakness, and the Flyers getting a stud d-man they have been looking for since Pronger got hurt (not that Maata is the same type of player, but you know what I'm sayin.)

You take that back!


- rival22

Could you imagine
Kunitz-Crosby-Hornqvist
Dupuis-Malkin-Simmonds
Bennett-Sutter-Downie
Adams/Comeau-Goc-Spaling

Could you imagine
Kunitz-Crosby-Hornqvist
Dupuis-Malkin-Simmonds
Bennett-Sutter-Downie
Adams/Comeau-Goc-Spaling


- j.boyd919

And that is why the Flyers would require massive overpayment as opposed to a "fair trade" before handing you the next 4 Cups.

How do you feel about not getting anything in return for Orpik, Nisky? (serious question, not being an ass)
- YouMeAndDupuis9

It doesn't really bother me much... It's a risk that you take trying to "go for it". If you miss the playoffs or are a low seed with really no chance of going far, I think that you need to try to get something for a player that is leaving anyway, but I don't mind trying to make a Cup run and then losing a guy. To me, it's a cost of doing business as a contender.

If it's a legit hockey trade and somehow we manage to get a top 6 forward for Paul Martin, then great, but the Pens signed Paul Martin for 5 years, and I'm fine with having him for 5 years and 5 playoff runs. I'd rather have those 5 years than a 4 1/2 years and get a couple draft picks/mediocre NHL players in return.

Well, if you want a guy like Simmonds, especially from a division rival, then you better be prepared to pony up.

Actually, if the Flyers were to give Simmonds to the Penguins (or Rangers, Blue Jackets, etc.) then even Olli Maata probably wouldn't get it done alone. I realize that Matta and Simmonds may be a fair trade, but if the Penguins did come calling, a drastic overpayment would be required to pry Simmonds away.
- jmatchett383

If the Penguins came and offered Maatta for Simmonds, peoples necks would snap with how fast that deal would be done. A 20 y/o top 4 defenseman with a huge ceiling, and a extremely friendly cap hit for the next 2 seasons is something the Flyers are sorely missing and would jump all over in an instant.

Well, if you want a guy like Simmonds, especially from a division rival, then you better be prepared to pony up.

Actually, if the Flyers were to give Simmonds to the Penguins (or Rangers, Blue Jackets, etc.) then even Olli Maata probably wouldn't get it done alone. I realize that Matta and Simmonds may be a fair trade, but if the Penguins did come calling, a drastic overpayment would be required to pry Simmonds away.
- jmatchett383

Maybe I'm in the minority in here but I'd much rather have Maatta than Simmonds. Simmonds is very good but he plays a very similar style to Kunitz/Hornqvist. I love that "type" of player but I think it would be overkill at the expense of Maatta.

Plus Maatta in a Flyers jersey is just

Well, if you want a guy like Simmonds, especially from a division rival, then you better be prepared to pony up.

Actually, if the Flyers were to give Simmonds to the Penguins (or Rangers, Blue Jackets, etc.) then even Olli Maata probably wouldn't get it done alone. I realize that Matta and Simmonds may be a fair trade, but if the Penguins did come calling, a drastic overpayment would be required to pry Simmonds away.
- jmatchett383

I know, I'm not saying that you'd be ripping us off at all, I just don't want to give up Maatta. It's a pretty even trade when you take organizational needs into it.

Maybe I'm in the minority in here but I'd much rather have Maatta than Simmonds. Simmonds is very good but he plays a very similar style to Kunitz/Hornqvist. I love that "type" of player but I think it would be overkill at the expense of Maatta.

Plus Maatta in a Flyers jersey is just
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Yeah I agree, he does play a similar style, and that's exactly why I want him. Not to mention he'll throw down the mitts too. He's exactly what I would want to see on Geno's wings in the playoffs.