Letang and Ehroff will be vets, Maata will have 2 full seasons under his belt, Scuds is old and a vet, Bortz has 3 years experience I think? Not too bad IMO.
- sammy87

I was talking about the 3 specific players he'd mentioned. Also, it's more than just the players, it's where they're slotted to play. If you move a top-4 player, all the players below move up a slot which might be asking them to handle too much. See: Flyers, Philadelphia, 2014 season to date.

Maybe Martin for Sharp. Letang would be a really dumb move.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Martin isnt going to land you Sharps broken stick.

Neither one of Scuds or Martin will land in LA. To pricey for what you get. Dean will play it out with the guys he has.

You just dont trade a Norris candidate defenseman in his prime locked up long term (whos contract really is not bad over the long run) for an aging winger. Especially, when you can utilize other assets to address your weakness, even if its not a "star" player.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

What if you could trade your (2 seasons removed) Norris candidate defenseman for a guy who could pot 50 goals on your top line?

Also, didn't know 32 was "aging" for a guy who plays a game like Sharp's.

Martin isn't flashy or anything, but he's about as steady as they come. You're putting a lot of faith in players with little experience (in Pouliot, 1 game so far) for a "win now" team. I'm not saying you're wrong, but it's far from coclusive that it would improve them.
- jmatchett383

That's definitely a fair counterpoint but its like we always seem to focus on the loss of Martin and forget we are getting something valuable in return. I do have faith that splitting up Martin's minutes among 3 blue chip defense prospects, odds are pretty good at least one of them can handle the NHL. Is it a bit of a gamble? Yes. But odds are pretty good PLUS you are fixing a weakness up front.

Letang, Ehrhoff, Maatta, Despres, Bortuzzo, Harrington, Pouliot, Dumoulin, *scuderi*. You can win a championship with some combination of that defensive core, especially if the young guys gain valuable experience in the NHL this season and the forward unit becomes even more potent.

As I said, with the $$ you'd save, you could theoretically resign Martin.'

Just using Sharp as an example of a top-end player you could deal Letang for.
- jmatchett383

Question, as a Flyer's fan, would you trade Simmonds or Voracek for Letang?

You just dont trade a Norris candidate defenseman in his prime locked up long term (whos contract really is not bad over the long run) for an aging winger. Especially, when you can utilize other assets to address your weakness, even if its not a "star" player.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Good NHL D men make 7+. Letang is a very good Dman in his prime. I just don't see a trade where the team is overall better with him gone.

I have said before, I don't like having 2 superstars on the team (87, 71) and I would move 71 for a Hershell Walker type deal and Malkin is worth that type of offer. Letang does not generate that type of return.

Question, as a Flyer's fan, would you trade Simmonds or Voracek for Letang?
- cap1681

No, because we are thin everywhere. We don't have the depth to move either of those 2 players (or Giroux or Couturier) for anything short of a Weber/Suter type.

Well, I doubt Martin makes a $2.25M raise, maybe a $0.5M raise. You have good points when you factor in age. I'm not saying either player has to be moved, and personally, unless a no-brainer came along, I wouldn't move either one. And when I say no brainer, I mean stupid overpayment (say, JvR for Luke Schenn stupid). Uf you're trying to win now, I'd keep the best defense together that I could and bank of my forwards being relatively healthy going into the postseason.
- jmatchett383

In the sport of hockey, thats a huge gamble. Plus, our forward group cannot handle the loss of one decent player, we dont have proper depth for that.

What if you could trade your (2 seasons removed) Norris candidate defenseman for a guy who could pot 50 goals on your top line?

Also, didn't know 32 was "aging" for a guy who plays a game like Sharp's.
- jmatchett383

Pens have 2 guys that can put up 50g on the top 2, Hornquest possibly 40. How many 40g scorers do the pens need considering there were only 3 in the entire league last year?

Pens have 2 35 yr olds on the top 6, adding Sharp at 32 for a top D man in his prime is just stupid.

What if you could trade your (2 seasons removed) Norris candidate defenseman for a guy who could pot 50 goals on your top line?

Also, didn't know 32 was "aging" for a guy who plays a game like Sharp's.
- jmatchett383

I'm not saying he's an old bum by any means. I love Patrick Sharp. But the combination of Dupuis/Kunitz/Sharp isn't a good long term solution. And if youre trading Letang, you have to think 7 years of production to replace.

That's definitely a fair counterpoint but its like we always seem to focus on the loss of Martin and forget we are getting something valuable in return. I do have faith that splitting up Martin's minutes among 3 blue chip defense prospects, odds are pretty good at least one of them can handle the NHL. Is it a bit of a gamble? Yes. But odds are pretty good PLUS you are fixing a weakness up front.

Letang, Ehrhoff, Maatta, Despres, Bortuzzo, Harrington, Pouliot, Dumoulin, *scuderi*. You can win a championship with some combination of that defensive core, especially if the young guys gain valuable experience in the NHL this season and the forward unit becomes even more potent.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

You have a point, but to me, depth at defense is paramount to winning in the postseason. Your 08/09 defense was flat-out amazing (Hal Gill not included). You finally have that defense again. If one of your top-3 goes down, putting top-4 minutes on 2 of Bortuzzi/Harrington/Pouliot/Dumolin/Scuderi is not a winning recipe.

That's definitely a fair counterpoint but its like we always seem to focus on the loss of Martin and forget we are getting something valuable in return. I do have faith that splitting up Martin's minutes among 3 blue chip defense prospects, odds are pretty good at least one of them can handle the NHL. Is it a bit of a gamble? Yes. But odds are pretty good PLUS you are fixing a weakness up front.

Letang, Ehrhoff, Maatta, Despres, Bortuzzo, Harrington, Pouliot, Dumoulin, *scuderi*. You can win a championship with some combination of that defensive core, especially if the young guys gain valuable experience in the NHL this season and the forward unit becomes even more potent.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

You have a point, but to me, depth at defense is paramount to winning in the postseason. Your 08/09 defense was flat-out amazing (Hal Gill not included). You finally have that defense again. If one of your top-3 goes down, putting top-4 minutes on 2 of Bortuzzi/Harrington/Pouliot/Dumolin/Scuderi is not a winning recipe.

I'm not saying he's an old bum by any means. I love Patrick Sharp. But the combination of Dupuis/Kunitz/Sharp isn't a good long term solution. And if youre trading Letang, you have to think 7 years of production to replace.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Didn't you just say you had a bunch of young guys who can step into big roles immediately?

Pens have 2 guys that can put up 50g on the top 2, Hornquest possibly 40. How many 40g scorers do the pens need considering there were only 3 in the entire league last year?

Pens have 2 35 yr olds on the top 6, adding Sharp at 32 for a top D man in his prime is just stupid.
- sammy87

You can disagree, but calling it "stupid" when I present relatively valid points (to me) is a bit of a Richard thing to say.

Good NHL D men make 7+. Letang is a very good Dman in his prime. I just don't see a trade where the team is overall better with him gone.

I have said before, I don't like having 2 superstars on the team (87, 71) and I would move 71 for a Hershell Walker type deal and Malkin is worth that type of offer. Letang does not generate that type of return.
- sammy87

You don't win a trade where you give away Evgeni Malkin. We aren't rebuilding and only have a few needs to fill. Build around him and Sid. Simple as that.

You don't win a trade where you give away Evgeni Malkin. We aren't rebuilding and only have a few needs to fill. Build around him and Sid. Simple as that.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Whoever said you "give away" Malkin? That's a horrible idea.

Also, are you familiar with the deal he presented?

Didn't you just say you had a bunch of young guys who can step into big roles immediately?
- jmatchett383

Yes, on defense. A Letang for Sharp trade would only be equivalent in value if Sharp can produce for 7 years like Letang will.

Yes, on defense. A Letang for Sharp trade would only be equivalent in value if Sharp can produce for 7 years like Letang will.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

What if he produces for 3 years and is a key piece of winning 2 Cups in those years?

And yes, I meant on defense, as that would be the hole to backfill.

You have a point, but to me, depth at defense is paramount to winning in the postseason. Your 08/09 defense was flat-out amazing (Hal Gill not included). You finally have that defense again. If one of your top-3 goes down, putting top-4 minutes on 2 of Bortuzzi/Harrington/Pouliot/Dumolin/Scuderi is not a winning recipe.
- jmatchett383

It goes both ways. What you listed is not a winning recipe but we would be better suited for that scenario than a loss of a Kunitz or Hornqvist. I'd feel more comforatble with one of those 4 defenseman taking big minutes than I would trying to put Downie or Spaling with Sid/Geno. We should never be in a position where we are putting Brian Gibbons type players on our top line. If Sid and Geno can't be at their best, we have no shot.

Kapanen apparently has two goals in his current game. He is really making strides in an expanded offensive role. There is no doubt he will be in North America once his season over seas is finished...

The only question is will he be a Penguin or a Baby Penguin?

It goes both ways. What you listed is not a winning recipe but we would be better suited for that scenario than a loss of a Kunitz or Hornqvist. I'd feel more comforatble with one of those 4 defenseman taking big minutes than I would trying to put Downie or Spaling with Sid/Geno. We should never be in a position where we are putting Brian Gibbons type players on our top line. If Sid and Geno can't be at their best, we have no shot.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

True. I know I went heavy to one side and not the other (injuries to defense and not offense). But to me, winning in the postseason is all about defense, so you go with the strongest defense you can. From my view, Martin is more valuable on the team that he is as a trade piece, especially when you don't have to worry about trying to fit a new player in. Just how I see it, although I see what you're getting at.

What if he produces for 3 years and is a key piece of winning 2 Cups in those years?

And yes, I meant on defense, as that would be the hole to backfill.
- jmatchett383

Backfilling the loss of Martin is easier than backfilling the loss of Letang. Hence, even with Sharp, I don't think we win a cup without Letang. We could win a cup without Martin. Just my opinion.

Kapanen apparently has two goals in his current game. He is really making strides in an expanded offensive role. There is no doubt he will be in North America once his season over seas is finished...

The only question is will he be a Penguin or a Baby Penguin?
- usethe1-2-2

He can play for the Penguins, but he wouldn't be able to play in the playoffs. Might be best for his to sign a PTO and play with WBS once his season is over.

True. I know I went heavy to one side and not the other (injuries to defense and not offense). But to me, winning in the postseason is all about defense, so you go with the strongest defense you can. From my view, Martin is more valuable on the team that he is as a trade piece, especially when you don't have to worry about trying to fit a new player in. Just how I see it, although I see what you're getting at.
- jmatchett383

We may disagree, but good argument all the way around

Backfilling the loss of Martin is easier than backfilling the loss of Letang. Hence, even with Sharp, I don't think we win a cup without Letang. We could win a cup without Martin. Just my opinion.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

I agree that it's much easier to win without Letang. Not gonna argue that. But I think it's possible if the return is good enough,