That is what I meant by as within a team and not another team or player, it is not the same circumstances, it would be inaccurate or at best speculation.
- LeafMan

I'm not sure what you're trying to say...


What I'm reading is "you can't compare an NHL player to another NHL player because they aren't the same person"

What you can do however is track individual players relative to their own team's norms. Chances are if a player makes one team better, they will make another team better as well. And there are some contributions that are not as patently obvious as goals and assists.
- lumlums

like Clark MAc. and Grabo

no matter where they play they kill possession... you had to see that Randy buried them..but they still preformed well when given tough mins

That is what I meant by as within a team and not another team or player, it is not the same circumstances, it would be inaccurate or at best speculation.
- LeafMan

This is true whenever one compares two players under normal, stat-free circumstances. It comes down to whether you trust opinions, which may be biased, or the numbers, which are not.

not yet I am saving up for the leafs conference finals tickets
- senstroll

You should have about $2,345,219.47 saved up by now. Your kids will appreciate it.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say...


What I'm reading is "you can't compare an NHL player to another NHL player because they aren't the same person"
- Pecafan Fan

No, you can compare them but you have to take in account different variables, such as coach, teammates, market etc... You can't get an accurate snapshot is all I'm saying, imo.

This is true whenever one compares two players under normal, stat-free circumstances. It comes down to whether you trust opinions, which may be biased, or the numbers, which are not.
- lumlums

Pretty much, yes.

You should have about $2,345,219.47 saved up by now.
- Woderwick

well I have the .47

like Clark MAc. and Grabo

no matter where they play they kill possession... you had to see that Randy buried them..but they still preformed well when given tough mins
- senstroll

I bet they did really well in the playoffs for their team....wait.

No, you can compare them but you have to take in account different variables, such as coach, teammates, market etc... You can't get an accurate snapshot is all I'm saying, imo.
- LeafMan

If that's true it means a player would be seeing his numbers vary greatly depending on what team he plays.

I bet they did really well in the playoffs for their team....wait.
- LeafMan

you got me

well I have the .47
- senstroll

You still have time.

If that's true it means a player would be seeing his numbers vary greatly depending on what team he plays.
- Pecafan Fan

Not greatly that is overstating it but to some degree positively or negatively.

I bet they did really well in the playoffs for their team....wait.
- LeafMan

got us to game 7 going up vs Bostons #1 line all series

NOT GREAT

but someone had to sink their +- stat vs that line and we all know it wasnt going to be phil's line or lupul's line as they have 1 player per line that has any D game what so ever.

still impressive we made it to game 7, just a a drag how it finished, it still hurts!

got us to game 7 going up vs Bostons #1 line all series

NOT GREAT

but someone had to sink their +- stat vs that line and we all know it wasnt going to be phil's line or lupul's line as they have 1 player per line that has any D game what so ever.

still impressive we made it to game 7, just a a drag how it finished, it still hurts!
- Lucas Neilson

Sorry Lucas both Mac A and Grabo stunk that series.

got us to game 7 going up vs Bostons #1 line all series

NOT GREAT

but someone had to sink their +- stat vs that line and we all know it wasnt going to be phil's line or lupul's line as they have 1 player per line that has any D game what so ever.

still impressive we made it to game 7, just a a drag how it finished, it still hurts!
- Lucas Neilson

Who had the D game on Lupul's line? Frattin?

Who had the D game on Lupul's line? Frattin?
- TheThrill

Frattin played with Lupul and Kadri

Sorry Lucas both Mac A and Grabo stunk that series.
- LeafMan

take a look at their ice time for the 10 games in the regular season BEFORE the playoff started

8-10 mins a game, then playoff start and they are getting around 20 vs top line

bottom line, randy (frank)ed them and everyone and their mother knows it...even randy.

Frattin played with Lupul and Kadri
- LeafMan

that line couldnt shut down a 3rd line grind line

as a matter of fact, they didnt.

Not greatly that is overstating it but to some degree positively or negatively.
- LeafMan

Remember when everyone was saying that Malone was good only because he was playing with Crosby?

http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=45143


Or that Kunitz was a product of Crosby as well?

http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=49486

Funny how both players had similar numbers throughout their respective careers with, or without Crosby...

Sorry Lucas both Mac A and Grabo stunk that series.
- LeafMan

but i do agree, they had a rough go, i just dont blame them under the circumstances is all

Guy is 175 lbs.

Give him time.
- Pecafan Fan

In Montreal that's called a power forward, no?

that line couldnt shut down a 3rd line grind line

as a matter of fact, they didnt.
- Lucas Neilson

They had the most scoring chances against the Bruins, hemmed them down low, I remember watching the replays on Leafs TV during that summer, they were a good line

If we can cut 7-8 shots a game he should be a stud
- Yeti1181

sorry dude but that's to low more like 15 shot per game. 40 per game is a lot of shots on your net.

Frattin played with Lupul and Kadri
- LeafMan

Yes I know. Luke had said that Phils line and Loops line had 1 guy with a semblance of a D game on each. I figure Bozak was the guy on Phil's. Surely Kadri couldn't be considered defensive. Must have been Frattin he was meaning

Sorry Lucas both Mac A and Grabo stunk that series.
- LeafMan

this type of "analysis" is very flawed
when you look deeper in to the stats you see what was happening