Woderwick
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: David Clarkson's Water Bottle, ON Joined: 02.12.2013
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So did Kessel and Lupul - Fakepartofme
Lupul breaks that partnership far too often through injury. I stopped counting on Lupul last year. |
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Woderwick
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: David Clarkson's Water Bottle, ON Joined: 02.12.2013
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A week ago or so I said, if they put Lupul, Bozak and Kessel on the same line( three righties) you lose those cross ice - two on one passes between JVR and Kessel, that was a lethal combo. - LeafMan
Of the best in the league. |
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Fakepartofme
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Living rent free... in your head, ON Joined: 09.20.2010
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Apparently they watch every single minute of every single game I'm told. - LeafMan
Veeeery interesting. |
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Lucas Neilson
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Hockeybuzz Fantasy @lucasneilson84 , ON Joined: 10.04.2013
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Veeeery interesting. - Fakepartofme
pretty sure the guys who do the stat tracking for games do it during the game - and its part of their job to do it again after the game on video to ensure accuracy? no? im almost positive thats how it works.. |
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Aetherial
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Has anyone discussed the standings today? Joined: 06.30.2006
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it was 82 games to prove it - senstroll
So, the stats predicted a total, late season collapse?
because at the 68 game mark, we actually had well over 100 games where the Leafs were mostly contrary to the advanced stats, win or lose and at that time, apparently the sample size was too small ...
but as soon as the Leafs stumbled ... well then, the sample size is suddenly just right.
Oh ... and most people were pretty close to the Leafs ending position without using advanced stats.
I am not anti-advanced stats. I am against most of the proponents because of their arrogant attitude and willful stupidity. I am also not convinced that the current advanced stats tell me much of anything.
I want better advanced stats that are also more "limited" in their conclusions so we don't start havign arguements that the Leafs didn't make the playoffs because we didn't have Clarke (SuperCorsi) MacArthur on the team.
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senstroll
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Location: Leafs AAV Champs, ON Joined: 02.22.2008
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Could the same not be said about the people who do the stats.
So many chances for human error. - Fakepartofme
sure
like anything there is a % for error. |
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Aetherial
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Has anyone discussed the standings today? Joined: 06.30.2006
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it was 82 games to prove it - senstroll
Answer honestly...
If the Leafs didn't stumble, but continued on their pace last season, do you really think that the advanced stats proponents would admit that they just don't work?
No f'ing way.
The line would become "one season is not a large enough sample size". That response would continue until the first 10-game losing streak, at which point, suddenly, the stats were right all along.
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DoubleDown
Montreal Canadiens |
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Location: Not to point any fingers but Tyson Barrie has looked awful in the blue and white for the Leafs., QC Joined: 07.28.2006
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Yeah and I have consistently been told that any sample size that belies the advance stats is meaningless (68 games, too small) ... but the 14 game sample size that followed proved the stats are right!
As I have said so many times. You cannot debate the efficacy of advanced stats with some people because they simply ignore when the stats are wrong and as soon as they "work", you get an "I told you so". - Aetherial
i don't think anyone judges the Leafs solely on those last 15ish games. if it was the case, the Leafs would be thought of along the lines of Buffalo and Calgary. |
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senstroll
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Location: Leafs AAV Champs, ON Joined: 02.22.2008
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So, the stats predicted a total, late season collapse?
because at the 68 game mark, we actually had well over 100 games where the Leafs were mostly contrary to the advanced stats, win or lose and at that time, apparently the sample size was too small ...
but as soon as the Leafs stumbled ... well then, the sample size is suddenly just right.
Oh ... and most people were pretty close to the Leafs ending position without using advanced stats.
I am not anti-advanced stats. I am against most of the proponents because of their arrogant attitude and willful stupidity. I am also not convinced that the current advanced stats tell me much of anything. - Aetherial
ok they were wrong about the leafs... carry on
my eyes watched and I thought the leafs were a bad team with good goaltending ..for most of it
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Aetherial
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Has anyone discussed the standings today? Joined: 06.30.2006
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i don't think anyone judges the Leafs solely on those last 15ish games. if it was the case, the Leafs would be thought of along the lines of Buffalo and Calgary. - DoubleDown
well... arenn't we thought of that way? I think we are as hopeless as those two teams. |
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Aetherial
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Has anyone discussed the standings today? Joined: 06.30.2006
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ok they were wrong about the leafs... carry on
my eyes watched and I thought the leafs were a bad team with good goaltending ..for most of it - senstroll
yeah, pretty much sums it up.
Their roster was not as bad as the results. I don't believe that the Sens roster last season was better than ours and yet, they finished higher.
I think the problem was coaching and leadership. The two things they didnt change and I'm not real hopeful for this season |
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Scabeh
Montreal Canadiens |
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Location: The Slovakian Jagr, QC Joined: 02.25.2007
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ok they were wrong about the leafs... carry on
my eyes watched and I thought the leafs were a bad team with good goaltending ..for most of it - senstroll
I'd say the Leafs had a very, very questionnable defensive system/cast with good goaltending.
Offense was just fine. |
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DoubleDown
Montreal Canadiens |
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Location: Not to point any fingers but Tyson Barrie has looked awful in the blue and white for the Leafs., QC Joined: 07.28.2006
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Answer honestly...
If the Leafs didn't stumble, but continued on their pace last season, do you really think that the advanced stats proponents would admit that they just don't work?
No f'ing way.
The line would become "one season is not a large enough sample size". That response would continue until the first 10-game losing streak, at which point, suddenly, the stats were right all along. - Aetherial
no of course not. but i don't look at it so black and white. i don't see 1 outlier and say "the data means nothing". it's like your kid bringing home a 90% on an algebra test. he's not perfect but he's obviously knows his poop. i remember the 2001-02 Habs. terrible, terrible hockey team. couldn't score for poop, rag tag defenders and just a crap roster outside a piece or two and phenomenal goalie. i could guarantee that if stats were around back then, Montreal would have been at or near the bottom of every category. but they had Jose Theodore play out of his mind for 3 months. if that happened today, no one would say the stats were wrong. they'd say "that is one poopty hockey team and one great goalie"... |
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DoubleDown
Montreal Canadiens |
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Location: Not to point any fingers but Tyson Barrie has looked awful in the blue and white for the Leafs., QC Joined: 07.28.2006
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well... arenn't we thought of that way? I think we are as hopeless as those two teams. - Aetherial
no you guys are thought of as playoff bubble team. which is worse in a way. |
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Woderwick
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: David Clarkson's Water Bottle, ON Joined: 02.12.2013
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no you guys are thought of as playoff bubble team. which is worse in a way. - DoubleDown
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Garnie
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: ON Joined: 11.30.2009
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Simmon's " Kessel is lying"
How about they ban him from the team?
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RickJames77
Boston Bruins |
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Location: We’re Too Old, Boston Joined: 04.03.2013
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Simmon's " Kessel is lying"
How about they ban him from the team?
- Garnie
Give him to us for 2 firsts and a second |
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TheThrill
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Sid, I'm open!, ON Joined: 12.10.2013
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Answer honestly...
If the Leafs didn't stumble, but continued on their pace last season, do you really think that the advanced stats proponents would admit that they just don't work?
No f'ing way.
The line would become "one season is not a large enough sample size". That response would continue until the first 10-game losing streak, at which point, suddenly, the stats were right all along. - Aetherial
You could be right, but it really doesn't matter.
All season long, the adv. stats community said that the Leafs couldn't sustain their win % with the way they were playing. They eventually wore down and fell off the cliff, just as was predicted.
A hypothetical about what that community would have said if things went differently isn't going to change the fact that they called their shot, and it went the way they said it would. |
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Garnie
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: ON Joined: 11.30.2009
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- Woderwick
Don't be sad...anything can happen in the East, I expect the Leafs to finish ahead of the Habs. |
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Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Tanktown, ON Joined: 10.08.2008
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Might be just me but I like to watch a game and not have these preconceived stats in my head while I watch it, I rather just enjoy watching the game, I can leave the stats to analytic nerds, I really don't care about them, sucks the enjoyment out of the game for me. - LeafMan
Trust me, it's not just you. |
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Mike Augello
Commissioner Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Buffalo, NY Joined: 06.25.2006
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Garnie
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: ON Joined: 11.30.2009
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Give him to us for 2 firsts and a second - RickJames77
never |
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senstroll
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Location: Leafs AAV Champs, ON Joined: 02.22.2008
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yeah, pretty much sums it up.
Their roster was not as bad as the results. I don't believe that the Sens roster last season was better than ours and yet, they finished higher.
I think the problem was coaching and leadership. The two things they didnt change and I'm not real hopeful for this season - Aetherial
I agree with the Bold parts
I may not be hopeful for this season either...but I am for the future now.. once Nonis and RC are gone I will be be like a teen with his first nudie mag |
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Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Tanktown, ON Joined: 10.08.2008
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You could be right, but it really doesn't matter.
All season long, the adv. stats community said that the Leafs couldn't sustain their win % with the way they were playing. They eventually wore down and fell off the cliff, just as was predicted.
A hypothetical about what that community would have said if things went differently isn't going to change the fact that they called their shot, and it went the way they said it would. - TheThrill
Nobody ever told me which advanced stat measured the likelihood of a goalie getting injured.
That being said, advanced stats have value, but aren't the end-all, as the Leafs showed for the last two seasons. |
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TheThrill
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Sid, I'm open!, ON Joined: 12.10.2013
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Trust me, it's not just you. - Feeling Glucky?
I could never be a statistician for this reason as well. But I do like the signings we made this off-season, which have been verified to be adv. stats-based acquisitions.
There is a place for it in hockey, as a tool. |
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