how is he shafting the flyers? he gave his all for so many years
- 2Real

Exactly

"That Timonen didn't announce his retirement should not surprise. For him to do so right now would shaft the Flyers and guarantee a $2 million salary cap hit this season."

--Tim Pannacio



- MBFlyerfan

Maybe you guys can answer this question. Brian Rafalski from what I can remember still had a couple years on his deal before he retired from hockey with the Detroit Red Wings. I don't believe price tag still counted against their cap. How were the Wings able to avoid this? He did officially retire if I remember correctly.

Unbelievable isn't it?
- MJL

"Get a life."

-Timmy the P

(seriously, this is bush league)


(on his part)

Maybe you guys can answer this question. Brian Rafalski from what I can remember still had a couple years on his deal before he retired from hockey with the Detroit Red Wings. I don't believe price tag still counted against their cap. How were the Wings able to avoid this? He did officially retire if I remember correctly.
- SuperSchennBros

His deal wasn't a 35+ so it came off the cap. He left $6M on the table in that last year.

Maybe you guys can answer this question. Brian Rafalski from what I can remember still had a couple years on his deal before he retired from hockey with the Detroit Red Wings. I don't believe price tag still counted against their cap. How were the Wings able to avoid this? He did officially retire if I remember correctly.
- SuperSchennBros

If he signed it before he turned 35 that would account for that. But I don't recall how old he was for sure.

I don't think kimmo is concerned about paying for the best healthcare available. I'm sure he can afford anything he needs. I just think it's the Flyer's way. It's like a family thing. You take care of your family.
- Dkos

I'm sure he's not overly worried about it, but why not stay on the books and guarantee that it's covered.

There might be some sort of legalese that prevents the Flyers to cover a retired player who retired over a non hockey related injury.

Also the money...why walk away from it? It's not a huge impact on the Flyers cap.

Thanks

how is he shafting the flyers? he gave his all for so many years
- 2Real

Tim is saying it would shaft the Flyers because the salary counts against the cap and can't be LTIRd. He is of course, wrong.

I don't think kimmo is concerned about paying for the best healthcare available. I'm sure he can afford anything he needs. I just think it's the Flyer's way. It's like a family thing. You take care of your family.
- Dkos

I agree with that. I don't know enough about it, or if the Flyers would have grounds to not have to pay Timonen, if it is a hereditary condition and is not a hockey related illness. But even if that's possible, it's not something it seems like the Flyers would do.

I agree with that. I don't know enough about it, or if the Flyers would have grounds to not have to pay Timonen, if it is a hereditary condition and is not a hockey related illness. But even if that's possible, it's not something it seems like the Flyers would do.
- MJL

That's what I'm saying. I'm not surprised he's not retiring. I don't think the flyers expect or want him to retire. I don't think he will ever play again. I think he knows it and the flyers know it. They're just going thru the steps that have to go thru. They bring him in at the start of the season. He sees the docs. The docs say he cant play and the odds are very low that he'll ever play again, but it's not impossible. Everything is on the up and up. Kimmon can continue to receive his salary until his contract is up. Everyone is happy...except Tim.

That's what I'm saying. I'm not surprised he's not retiring. I don't think the flyers expect or want him to retire. I don't think he will ever play again. I think he knows it and the flyers know it. They're just Going thru the steps that have to go thru. They bring him in at the start if the season. He sees the docs. The docs say he cant play and the odds are very low that he'll ever play again, but it's not impossible. Everything is on the up and up. Kimmon can continue to receive his salary until his contract is up. Everyone is happy...except Tim.
- Dkos

Yep. Doesn't sound like Timonen is ready to retire, and is holding out hopes for a miracle all most, on the slim chance that the clots will go away. Hell I don't even know if that's even possible. But he said the earliest they'll have any further info is in the new year.

I don't see the big deal--he'll be LTIR'd at the start of the season with Pronger.

What does Tim think the Flyers are going to do? Go all in on Bobby Ryab right now?

Cap is not an issue for the Flyers ATM. At the start of the season--sure. But we'll cross that bridge when we get there.

I don't see the big deal--he'll be LTIR'd at the start of the season with Pronger.

What does Tim think the Flyers are going to do? Go all in on Bobby Ryab right now?

Cap is not an issue for the Flyers ATM. At the start of the season--sure. But we'll cross that bridge when we get there.
- KGBflyers10

Actually, Ryan White & Timonen help the Flyers at the start. They will eat up $2.575mm of the $4.91mm needed to max out Pronger, who they should be able to LTIR before the season and receive full LTIR exemption.

Then after the rosters are submitted, they can LTIR Timonen and White and gain that money in additional LTIR exemption. Only concern at that point is being able to bury any bonus overages

I don't see the big deal--he'll be LTIR'd at the start of the season with Pronger.

What does Tim think the Flyers are going to do? Go all in on Bobby Ryab right now?

Cap is not an issue for the Flyers ATM. At the start of the season--sure. But we'll cross that bridge when we get there.
- KGBflyers10

The Flyers already know exactly how they're going to maneuver with the Cap, including all the possible final rosters.

I'm sure he's not overly worried about it, but why not stay on the books and guarantee that it's covered.

There might be some sort of legalese that prevents the Flyers to cover a retired player who retired over a non hockey related injury.

Also the money...why walk away from it? It's not a huge impact on the Flyers cap.
- Jsaquella

Here's my point which I obviously wasn't clear enough about.

In my mind, Timo was the least bit conceded about collecting his 2 mil paycheck. His main concerns were to get healthy and if at all possible, come back and help the Flyers win the Cup. Even if he was able to return and again fell short of his goal, at least he'd be going out on his own terms.

For me to believe Timo's efforts to play this season stems from a desire to pocket an additional 2 mil after the exceptional career he's had (and not to mention the money and fame he's acquired both there and in his native Finland), is a bit of a reach.

For me to believe he would say to those close to him in a quiet moment that if he was unable to resume his career, that his plan was not to retire for the sole purpose to collect an additional 2 mil from the Flyers (all cap ramifications aside) is just too far fetched for me.

I just feel, watching him and listening to him for so many years, that he just seems to have too much integrity for something like that.

Hey, but I could be wrong.

Here's my point which I obviously wasn't clear enough about.

In my mind, Timo was the least bit conceded about collecting his 2 mil paycheck. His main concerns were to get healthy and if at all possible, come back and help the Flyers win the Cup. Even if he was able to return and again fell short of his goal, at least he'd be going out on his own terms.

For me to believe Timo's efforts to play this season stems from a desire to pocket an additional 2 mil after the exceptional career he's had (and not to mention the money and fame he's acquired both there and in his native Finland), is a bit of a reach.

For me to believe he would say to those close to him in a quiet moment that if he was unable to resume his career, that his plan was not to retire for the sole purpose to collect an additional 2 mil from the Flyers (all cap ramifications aside) is just too far fetched for me.

I just feel, watching him and listening to him for so many years, that he just seems to have too much integrity for something like that.

Hey, but I could be wrong.
- 77rams

It's not a knock on his integrity to collect the money that he is owed that he negotiated for in a contract, in good faith, in my opinion. It's not as though he is just deciding not to play. It is not his fault that the blood clot issue happened.

Secondly, you're the only one bringing up Timonen coming back to play for the money. When it's pretty obvious based on what he has stated many times, which is he came back for another chance to win the Cup, which he hasn't achieved to this point in his career..

Here's my point which I obviously wasn't clear enough about.

In my mind, Timo was the least bit conceded about collecting his 2 mil paycheck. His main concerns were to get healthy and if at all possible, come back and help the Flyers win the Cup. Even if he was able to return and again fell short of his goal, at least he'd be going out on his own terms.

For me to believe Timo's efforts to play this season stems from a desire to pocket an additional 2 mil after the exceptional career he's had (and not to mention the money and fame he's acquired both there and in his native Finland), is a bit of a reach.

For me to believe he would say to those close to him in a quiet moment that if he was unable to resume his career, that his plan was not to retire for the sole purpose to collect an additional 2 mil from the Flyers (all cap ramifications aside) is just too far fetched for me.

I just feel, watching him and listening to him for so many years, that he just seems to have too much integrity for something like that.

Hey, but I could be wrong.
- 77rams

I'm not saying he's doing it just to grab a check.

I do think the primary reason is because they haven't told him that he's done for sure, and that there's a chance he could play later in the season.

I'm not knocking Timonen's integrity at all. Just noting that retiring means walking away from $2mm as an addition to the other factors.

Wild sign Darcy Kuemper to a new deal, 2 years $2.5mm total, 1 way deal

Personally, I don't think that the Flyers could've gotten Luke Schenn for Hartnell. Toronto was looking for youth in return.
And also, I really hope the Flyers don't go after Bobby Ryan. Not the kind of player I want them to go after.
- MJL

I was just thinking about it but Toronto seems like a team that throws anything at the wall and sees what sticks. I mean Tim Gleason at this stage of his career just to get rid of John Michael Liles? I'll keep Liles.

I was just thinking about it but Toronto seems like a team that throws anything at the wall and sees what sticks. I mean Tim Gleason at this stage of his career just to get rid of John Michael Liles? I'll keep Liles.
- SuperSchennBros

Toronto bought out Gleason. He is now with Carolina I believe. And a teammate of Liles there.

I'm not saying he's doing it just to grab a check.

I do think the primary reason is because they haven't told him that he's done for sure, and that there's a chance he could play later in the season.

I'm not knocking Timonen's integrity at all. Just noting that retiring means walking away from $2mm as an addition to the other factors.
- Jsaquella

I didn't mean to imply you stated he just wanted to grab a check. On the contrary, I, like you, believe he's still in it because there's the slightest of chances that he'll play again.

But many players walked away for a myriad of reasons leaving money on the table. I'd just like to think the 2 mil never was an issue.

And you're right, there may be other factors involved.

Hell, I'd pay him that amount to stick around and mentor our youngsters on D.

I didn't mean to imply you stated he just wanted to grab a check. On the contrary, I, like you, believe he's still in it because there's the slightest of chances that he'll play again.

But many players walked away for a myriad of reasons leaving money on the table. I'd just like to think the 2 mil never was an issue.

And you're right, there may be other factors involved.

Hell, I'd pay him that amount to stick around and mentor our youngsters on D.
- 77rams

Absolutely. Guy's a warrior. Love him, wish he could play

I'm not interested in getting into a long term high cap dollar deal with a player like Ryan. He's too one dimensional, and lacks certain elements in his game to get into a deal for what it's going to take in my opinion.
- MJL

I'd sign him for the 7x7 deal that supposedly OTT offered. He's 27, cost no assets, and can easily score 30 goals on G's line for the next 5 years straight.

I think Ryan is less one-dimensional than you think he is. He's got a great shot, solid speed and size, can check and battle on the boards, and is at worst an average defender. He's streaky - but pretty much all players in the NHL run hot and cold.

My only concern would be the final couple years of the contract but even then I'd worry about that in 5 years. Ive seen plenty of bad contracts dealt - Luongo, Campbell, Hartnell, just off the top of my head.

I'd sign him for the 7x7 deal that supposedly OTT offered. He's 27, cost no assets, and can easily score 30 goals on G's line for the next 5 years straight.

I think Ryan is less one-dimensional than you think he is. He's got a great shot, solid speed and size, can check and battle on the boards, and is at worst an average defender. He's streaky - but pretty much all players in the NHL run hot and cold.

My only concern would be the final couple years of the contract but even then I'd worry about that in 5 years. Ive seen plenty of bad contracts dealt - Luongo, Campbell, Hartnell, just off the top of my head.
- moylander

You could put Matt Read or Wayne Simmonds on a line with Giroux and probably get 30 goals a year for the next 5 years. Plus in two years you have to re-sign Couturier, Schenn and Voracek.

Toronto bought out Gleason. He is now with Carolina I believe. And a teammate of Liles there.
- MJL

I know.....well more like remembering