considering that the average Joe can't afford to take his family to see the Leafs on a regular basis, I'm sure a second Toronto team could fill seats faster than a game of musical chairs, although I'm basing this logic on the ideal of cheaper ticket prices...
- IRON.MAIDEN

It seems to me, and so, you know, it might not be true, but it seems like people have this fantasy where a new team comes to town and you get cheap, available tickets. But that's aint happening. The second team will sell just as many corporate tickets and the rest will be priced for people making over a hundred grand.

If you are a Leaf fan distressed cause you can't afford or get tickets, this isn't gonna help.

No doubt. And that is probably a good thing. The city of Toronto has enough problems as it is, don't need to start giving them real NHL hockey just so that they can start lighting poop on fire when we lose.
- IRON.MAIDEN

I'd rather see them light things on fire over the passion of sports than the crime of politics!!!

no you have those numbers wrong. The population of greater new york city is indeed 8.4 million. Greater toronto is 6.4 million. the actual toronto city within that is 2.7. According to wikipedia torontos Surrounding area is 5.5 million as well. greater toronto can be considered almost 12 million.
- SMBDragon

Thats fair. Still don't think it's a good idea, but if you include the surrounding areas, you're 100% right.

The Buffalo and Ottawa migration of Leaf fans illustrates how, in fact a second team succeeds outstandingly. Fans in Buffalo and Ottawa learned long ago that they can finance a large portion of their season ticket package by selling off the Leaf tickets. Ottawa also has the added benefit of very high ticket demand for Montreal games as well. So, another Toronto team would just add to the demand.

If you had a second Toronto team that was actually competitive it would be win win for everyone including the Leafs.

I fear most Leaf fans that oppose a GTA expansion team is because they fear the embarrassment of being less competitive than the new team.

Decent bounce back blog. I agree for the most part. The Playoff format is good as is, but if there were 34 teams I would expand it to 20. Simply have 2 wild cards per division and have a best of 5 or best of 3. It would be great for fans and in a league that has as much parity , it would be pretty exciting.

The tough part will be on the expansion teams themselves. I think an expansion team would need 7-10 years to become a contender, with zero errors ( winning trades, signing the right players and no draft busts). Multiply that by 4, consider the new lottery rules and it could take these 4 teams 15 years.

True - They should focus on moving poorly performing markets teams, Like the Coyotes....

It seems to me, and so, you know, it might not be true, but it seems like people have this fantasy where a new team comes to town and you get cheap, available tickets. But that's aint happening. The second team will sell just as many corporate tickets and the rest will be priced for people making over a hundred grand.

If you are a Leaf fan distressed cause you can't afford or get tickets, this isn't gonna help.
- James_Tanner

They could fly to Phoenix, take in an NHL game and a small vacation, for less than they could attending a Leaf game.

The Buffalo and Ottawa migration of Leaf fans illustrates how, in fact a second team succeeds outstandingly. Fans in Buffalo and Ottawa learned long ago that they can finance a large portion of their season ticket package by selling off the Leaf tickets. Ottawa also has the added benefit of very high ticket demand for Montreal games as well. So, another Toronto team would just add to the demand.

If you had a second Toronto team that was actually competitive it would be win win for everyone including the Leafs.

I fear most Leaf fans that oppose a GTA expansion team is because they fear the embarrassment of being less competitive than the new team.
- spatso

I don't think that's a legit fear. I mean, I don't know, maybe some people do think like that, but it seems as idiot as cheering for Seguin to fail so getting Kessel looks better. The thing is, the Leafs would be hurt - maybe not right away, but eventually they will take a lesser market share. Just because the market is big and the team is popular does not mean that it's infinite.

Plus, again, the idea that tickets would be cheaper and more available is like saying because Molson owns the Habs they are going to sell discount beer. No, they'll gouge you for as much money as often as they can.

I'd rather see them light things on fire over the passion of sports than the crime of politics!!!
- LeftCoaster

Sorry to break it to you...

...you wont see any fires in Couver for a long long time.

Lots of good players who never get a chance to play.

League could use 2 more teams to even out the divisions IMHO

I don't think that's a legit fear. I mean, I don't know, maybe some people do think like that, but it seems as idiot as cheering for Seguin to fail so getting Kessel looks better. The thing is, the Leafs would be hurt - maybe not right away, but eventually they will take a lesser market share. Just because the market is big and the team is popular does not mean that it's infinite.

Plus, again, the idea that tickets would be cheaper and more available is like saying because Molson owns the Habs they are going to sell discount beer. No, they'll gouge you for as much money as often as they can.
- James_Tanner

Why would Leafs fans care if the club took a financial hit? It's not like they will be in the poor house.
The 2nd team will eventually have their own fans, as generations of kids will like the new uniforms and have fun cheering against their Dads team.

Sorry to break it to you...

...you wont see any fires in Couver for a long long time.
- IRON.MAIDEN

I'm not from Vancouver, hard to see from the Island???

It seems to me, and so, you know, it might not be true, but it seems like people have this fantasy where a new team comes to town and you get cheap, available tickets. But that's aint happening. The second team will sell just as many corporate tickets and the rest will be priced for people making over a hundred grand.

If you are a Leaf fan distressed cause you can't afford or get tickets, this isn't gonna help.
- James_Tanner

Problem is, I can't disprove you, at the moment.

But unless this team shares the ACC, the tickets would be much more reasonable. To presume the new team would command the lion share of attention from corporate sponsorship is just plain silly. The expansion, or relocated team, would enter the league with tickets cheaper than the Leafs in order to create the level of compete.

Hell, it might even drive the tickets to a Leaf game down over time.

Problem is, I can't disprove you, at the moment.

But unless this team shares the ACC, the tickets would be much more reasonable. To presume the new team would command the lion share of attention from corporate sponsorship is just plain silly. The expansion, or relocated team, would enter the league with tickets cheaper than the Leafs in order to create the level of compete.

Hell, it might even drive the tickets to a Leaf game down over time.
- IRON.MAIDEN

I just looked at the Canucks season ticket prices for lower bowl seats between the dots, $6500 and change (for one), what do similar Leaf season tickets go for?

I just looked at the Canucks season ticket prices for lower bowl seats between the dots, $6500 and change (for one), what do similar Leaf season tickets go for?
- LeftCoaster

No idea.

I quit looking at Leaf ticket prices a few years ago.

I just get seasons to my OHL team instead.

No idea.

I quit looking at Leaf ticket prices a few years ago.

I just get seasons to my OHL team instead.
- IRON.MAIDEN

I hope Bo make the Canucks this year. I really like the kids potential.

I hope Bo make the Canucks this year. I really like the kids potential.
- LeftCoaster

He never impressed me until his last season with the knights. Griffith ran that team for a few seasons and Horvat quietly did his thing. Once Griffith, and a few others moved on the the AHL, He really got a chance to carry the team. He's got great hands, and is real chippy. Decent speed, and good vision as well. I hope he translates that to his NHL game.
Besides, his hometown of 500 could use something to brag about

oh no, you changed the main blog pic.

You know that'll drop your hit count bro.

Problem is, I can't disprove you, at the moment.

But unless this team shares the ACC, the tickets would be much more reasonable. To presume the new team would command the lion share of attention from corporate sponsorship is just plain silly. The expansion, or relocated team, would enter the league with tickets cheaper than the Leafs in order to create the level of compete.

Hell, it might even drive the tickets to a Leaf game down over time.
- IRON.MAIDEN

I don't have a degree in economics or anything, but considering the demand for Leafs tickets at the price they are at, I think it would only make sense for the new team to mirror the prices exactly and then lower them if they didn't sell. Makes no sense to sell discounts unnecessarily.

I disagree. I don't think they will expand by four teams. But they should relocate two failing teams (florida and phoenix maybe?) and expand by two teams to get to 32 teams total. It's the number you want. 8 divisions of four teams. Two conferences with 4 divisions each. No more mickey mouse unbalanced conferences which is more embarassing than two roughrider teams in the CFL. It won't change the playoffs, and expanding the NHL by two teams won't dilute the talent pool. The game is growing--especially in the U.S. It will produce more high end talent to support and extra two teams without an issue.

And Toronto should absolutely be considered for another team. Your population numbers are wrong btw. You need to consider the population of the GTA--not just Toronto..

I don't have a degree in economics or anything, but considering the demand for Leafs tickets at the price they are at, I think it would only make sense for the new team to mirror the prices exactly and then lower them if they didn't sell. Makes no sense to sell discounts unnecessarily.
- James_Tanner

A team with 0 tradition, 0 history, and in the burbs is not going to be able to mirror any Leaf ticket price. People who are die hards to this team, are die hards for one reason.

It was bred into us from our fathers.

A team with no emotional connection to us isnt going to be able to pull that poop off.


Good thing you don't have a degree in economics bra

i love the irony of this coming from the coyotes blogger

the solution to get 30 healthy teams would be moving teams like phoenix to better markets

Didn't read the blog, but I agree.

i love the irony of this coming from the coyotes blogger

the solution to get 30 healthy teams would be moving teams like phoenix to better markets
- sushi

x2

It's shameful how the NHL deprives other hockey cities from a team, yet fights so bad for this joke of a city.

All because of tv markets.

A team with 0 tradition, 0 history, and in the burbs is not going to be able to mirror any Leaf ticket price. People who are die hards to this team, are die hards for one reason.

It was bred into us from our fathers.

A team with no emotional connection to us isnt going to be able to pull that poop off.


Good thing you don't have a degree in economics bra
- IRON.MAIDEN

While I have a hard time deigning to answer a guy who calls me "bra" I will say that I think you are massively underestimated the appetite for NHL hockey, not just TML hockey in the GTA. I don't think it'll be any trouble to sell out the games and season tickets at Leafs prices. Maybe a little cheaper, but not cheap enough that normal people would be able to afford tickets any more often. It just won't happen.