All you re giving is opinion and using one stat as the evidence. Its hard to dispute something that is an opinion, goaltending stats are based around team play as well as individual play you cant argue that fact.

Of course Schneider did well in New Jersey they play a defensive game getting scored on wasn't the problem it was scoring goals.

Generally teams that give up a lot of shots have worse goaltending numbers because you pick out three does not support your argument it merely demonstrates that there is exception to every rule.
- Yeti1181

Be careful, he may cry from this post. He thinks he's always right.

- SpoiledByOil

I just have to jump in...

oooooohhhhhh man. That killed me.

oilers are a lottery team while the leafs are a top contender, it's like comparing a prius to a ferrari
- sensnucksnocups

Sweet Jesus that was awesome...

I think it's more like comparing a Prius to a 1967 Ford Pinto

Sweet Jesus that was awesome...

I think it's more like comparing a Prius to a 1967 Ford Pinto
- Horseguts

i'm sorry, is a fan of the oilers trying to smack talk another team? you guys are the laughing stock of the nhl, always finishing in the bottom, had 3 1st overall picks in a row and still suck. AHAHAHAHAHAH

All you re giving is opinion and using one stat as the evidence. Its hard to dispute something that is an opinion, goaltending stats are based around team play as well as individual play you cant argue that fact.

- Yeti1181

All stats are influenced by context. The particular stat I chose is the best one to measure a goalie by, however, and best indicative of his performance as an individual.

At the very least, it's near impossible to come up with an effective argument to say that Craig Anderson has proven himself to be a very good goaltender over the course of even ONE single full season.

You can come up with all the excuses why he hasn't that you'd like. The FACT remains that he's 33 years old and hasn't PROVEN himself to be a "very good goaltender". End of story.

Of course Schneider did well in New Jersey they play a defensive game getting scored on wasn't the problem it was scoring goals.

- Yeti1181

As I said, there are plenty of examples, and in fact, when you look at the correlation, playing on a worse team, and facing more shots, does not in fact have a statistically relevant effect on sv%.

Generally teams that give up a lot of shots have worse goaltending numbers because you pick out three does not support your argument it merely demonstrates that there is exception to every rule.
- Yeti1181

I gave three as examples. I thought I was pretty clear that when you look into it, the correlation that YOU are trying to claim as fact, but clearly have not researched, isn't there. In fact, some have even tried to argue the opposite, that when a goalie faces more shots, it has an inflationary effect on sv%.

If you're going to make the claim "Generally teams that give up a lot of shots have worse goaltending numbers" then why don't you back it up? (it's okay, I know you can't)

Take a read. There are plenty of studies out there. Here's one:

http://objectivenhl.blogs...-percentage-and-shot.html


You can try to say I'm wrong all you like. I'm not. You really don't have anything concrete to support the argument that he's proven he's a "very good goalie". No one does. As a starter, he's somewhere in the bottom third of the league. He's not a seive. But he's not a solid starter either.

He's proven he can be a great backup though, I'll give him that.

Be careful, he may cry from this post. He thinks he's always right.
- Horseguts

I don't think that. But in this case, the evidence is on my side. He actually hasn't offered a single thing to support what he's said. So, I'm way ahead of him at this point.

i'm sorry, is a fan of the oilers trying to smack talk another team? you guys are the laughing stock of the nhl, always finishing in the bottom, had 3 1st overall picks in a row and still suck. AHAHAHAHAHAH
- sensnucksnocups

Its all pretty funny but dude...comparing the Leafs to a Ferrari in any circumstance is just frickin hilarious.

Its all pretty funny but dude...comparing the Leafs to a Ferrari in any circumstance is just frickin hilarious.
- TandA4Flames

leafs are the richest team in the league, billion dollar franchise. you're right, comparing them to a ferrari is hilarious, i should have picked a more expensive car.

leafs are the richest team in the league, billion dollar franchise. you're right, comparing them to a ferrari is hilarious, i should have picked a more expensive car.
- sensnucksnocups

I'd love to know who this is.

All stats are influenced by context. The particular stat I chose is the best one to measure a goalie by, however, and best indicative of his performance as an individual.

At the very least, it's near impossible to come up with an effective argument to say that Craig Anderson has proven himself to be a very good goaltender over the course of even ONE single full season.

You can come up with all the excuses why he hasn't that you'd like. The FACT remains that he's 33 years old and hasn't PROVEN himself to be a "very good goaltender". End of story.




As I said, there are plenty of examples, and in fact, when you look at the correlation, playing on a worse team, and facing more shots, does not in fact have a statistically relevant effect on sv%.



I gave three as examples. I thought I was pretty clear that when you look into it, the correlation that YOU are trying to claim as fact, but clearly have not researched, isn't there. In fact, some have even tried to argue the opposite, that when a goalie faces more shots, it has an inflationary effect on sv%.

Take a read. There are plenty of studies out there. Here's one:

http://objectivenhl.blogs...-percentage-and-shot.html


You can try to say I'm wrong all you like. I'm not. You really don't have anything concrete to support the argument that he's proven he's a "very good goalie". No one does. As a starter, he's somewhere in the bottom third of the league. He's not a seive. But he's not a solid starter either.

He's proven he can be a great backup though, I'll give him that.
- prock

You may want to invest in a dictionary and look up the difference between fact and opinion because you are using stats to form your opinion which is not a fact but a opinion.

Also I would say someone who has spent a vast majority of his professional career in the NHL would be in FACT a very good goalie. Unless of course you mean a very good NHL goalie which in all your FACT spewing you forgot to mention at any point in time. How's that's FACT for ya.

I don't think that. But in this case, the evidence is on my side. He actually hasn't offered a single thing to support what he's said. So, I'm way ahead of him at this point.
- prock

You are spewing opinions and trying to say they are facts, you're not really a head of anything except possibly yourself.

You may want to invest in a dictionary and look up the difference between fact and opinion because you are using stats to form your opinion which is not a fact but a opinion.

Also I would say someone who has spent a vast majority of his professional career in the NHL would be in FACT a very good goalie. Unless of course you mean a very good NHL goalie which in all your FACT spewing you forgot to mention at any point in time. How's that's FACT for ya.
- Yeti1181

Oh, I see. I didn't realize I'd actually have to point out that we're talking in terms of NHL goalies. I guess I assumed that most people understood that context here.

I'll give you that, he's way better than my beer league goalie. He'd be very good in that league for sure.

In terms of NHL starters, he's done nothing to prove that he's a very good goalie. Does that help?

You are spewing opinions and trying to say they are facts, you're not really a head of anything except possibly yourself.
- Yeti1181

When I say he hasn't posted a .917 sv% in a season where he's played over 31 games, that is a fact. In fact, one more fact than you've posted.

That dictionary you spoke of......

Oh, I see. I didn't realize I'd actually have to point out that we're talking in terms of NHL goalies. I guess I assumed that most people understood that context here.

I'll give you that, he's way better than my beer league goalie. He'd be very good in that league for sure.

In terms of NHL starters, he's done nothing to prove that he's a very good goalie. Does that help?
- prock

As a NHL goalie he's decent yes. He has one good year, then one bad year.

As a NHL goalie he's decent yes. He has one good year, then one bad year.
- Yeti1181

I'm glad you agree that there is nothing to support calling him a "very good goalie", when speaking of NHL starters.

When I say he hasn't posted a .917 sv% in a season where he's played over 31 games, that is a fact. In fact, one more fact than you've posted.

That dictionary you spoke of......
- prock

We were discussing if he was a very good goalie. Like I said you were using stats to form an opinion and you just proved what I said even more.

There is not stat line where you are over or under which deems them a very good goalie.

I'm glad you agree that there is nothing to support calling him a "very good goalie", when speaking of NHL starters.
- prock

If you had just clarified before hand

We were discussing if he was a very good goalie. Like I said you were using stats to form an opinion and you just proved what I said even more.
- Yeti1181

Silly me, using facts to form an opinion.

leafs are the richest team in the league, billion dollar franchise. you're right, comparing them to a ferrari is hilarious, i should have picked a more expensive car.
- sensnucksnocups

Be smarter. We're obviously talking performance, not financial status. Great if you can afford a Ferrari but if you cant even drive a mini without crashing it repeatedly, who cares. The leafs are NOT a ferrari or any other high performance machine.

Silly me, using facts to form an opinion.
- prock

So you admit its only an opinion whether Craig Anderson is a 'very good goalie', well glad we cleared that up.

If you had just clarified before hand
- Yeti1181

You're f*&king with me right? You can't honestly think I was speaking in terms of AHL goalies, or goalies in general?

I'm not sure if you're serious. I feel like you're trying to mess with me.

This is weird. I feel like. Shoe. other foot.

Leafs currently have the better chance of making it through the first round (because of the gross quality of competition mismatch between conferences), although I wouldn't say they have a favorable chance anyways. The Oilers will likely be real contenders prior to the Leafs, just because of the amount of undeveloped high-end potential still in the system. Either way it's probably going to be a decent amount of time before either team is considered a true contender.

So you admit its only an opinion whether Craig Anderson is a 'very good goalie', well glad we cleared that up.
- Yeti1181

An opinion of which there is nothing to support. When speaking in terms of NHL goalies, that is. Starters, to be specific.

You're f*&king with me right? You can't honestly think I was speaking in terms of AHL goalies, or goalies in general?

I'm not sure if you're serious. I feel like you're trying to mess with me.

This is weird. I feel like. Shoe. other foot.
- prock

Hey I was going with what was written on the post.

Or as I like to refer to as out Procking Prock

The Oilers at least have a lot of young talent. They're terrible but the Leafs aren't much better and are much thinner on young talent so there's not much of a future for them without a complete teardown and re-build. All the stats guys in the world won't help you when you don't have depth. Analytics can help you maximize what you have and make good decisions on who you bring in but the free agent market's always pretty terrible so you just aren't going to get enough talent without drafting and developing at least reasonably well.