Dont you think if you are a "Great" D-man you should be on the plus side? I know its not a end all, be all. But it gives you a pretty good idea about that players defense. I.E. Lecavalier -16 and -5 (playoffs)
- GOA88

Who said he was a great d-man? He's the best of our defenseman, but that doesn't mean he's great.

Edit: Again, Shea Weber was a minus, finishing 4th on Nashville's +/- amongst defenders. So, any that rationale, he was not a great defender for Nashville.

So you're saying that two rosters with non-injury-prone players are injury-prone? Or were you trying to say, "I don't think the Devils are injury prone." Very confused over here. Are you 2Real?
- jmatchett383

Yes, I am saying that I dont feel the Devils are as injury prone as 2real believes they are. To be realistic though.... the Flyers are always "injury prone" no matter who it is....its our curse.

Yes, I am saying that I dont feel the Devils are as injury prone as 2real believes they are. To be realistic though.... the Flyers are always "injury prone" no matter who it is....its our curse.
- GOA88

Well, aside from freak injuries like the Pronger stick to the eye/concussion and Timonen's blood clots, they're pretty lucky. They get minor bumps/bruises like any other team, but they usually suffer from really odd injuries (Coburn breaking his butt, etc.). But yes, I agree that both lineups are not injury prone, althought he Devils are "softer" than the Flyers (on paper).

I'm telling you. Hextall will talk all he wants about not rushing the young D-men but if Morin or Ghost show they are better than any of the top-6 that are currently penciled in right now. They will be on the starting roster, make no mistake about it.
- GOA88

Agree, I think Ghost would be the one if any were to make the team.
Timo played key minutes for this team andI just think Hextall must be thinking how he is going to replace that. It would have to be via trade.

I don't expect MDZ to set the world on fire, but he could be a fair value addition. Maybe he gains a little bit of his old form back, possibly playing with something to prove, and can put up something like 6/19/25 or so. I could like with that from a 5/6 defenseman. You need to watch his ES minutes, though. Basically, he's a poor man's cheap Mike green.
- jmatchett383

If he comes in at 6/19/25 and is no worse than -5, at maybe 16-17 minutes per night, I'll be ecstatic

Agree, I think Ghost would be the one if any were to make the team.
Timo played key minutes for this team andI just think Hextall must be thinking how he is going to replace that. It would have to be via trade.
- 3flyerkids

I don't think Morin makes it past the 9-game tryout, if that, unless he comes in and plays like Pronger did his rookie season. I'm definitely thinking he's going back for one more QMJHL year.

Dont you think if you are a "Great" D-man you should be on the plus side?
- GOA88

Yeah. Karlsson, Weber, Subban, Yandle, Josi, Carlson, Campbell, Ehrhoff and Enstrom all suck.

If he comes in at 6/19/25 and is no worse than -5, at maybe 16-17 minutes per night, I'll be ecstatic
- AllInForFlyers

That's kind of what I'm hoping for. Not unrealistic if he's locked in. But if he's drifting, it could be an AHL demotion for the $900K savings.

Who said he was a great d-man? He's the best of our defenseman, but that doesn't mean he's great.
- jmatchett383

Weber is considered great is he not? I wasnt referring to Coburn, nobody would call him great. I just dont agree with your assessment that he is our best defenseman. He is average. Streit being our best OFF D-man and Grossmann being our best DEF D-man. Coburn screws up far too much

Yeah. Karlsson, Weber, Subban, Yandle, Josi, Carlson, Campbell, Ehrhoff and Enstrom all suck.
- Feanor

Clearly. Don't forget how bad the much-coveted Seth Jones was, too.

Weber is considered great is he not? I wasnt referring to Coburn, nobody would call him great. I just dont agree with your assessment that he is our best defenseman. He is average. Streit being our best OFF D-man and Grossmann being our best DEF D-man. Coburn screws up far too much
- GOA88

I just...wow. Okay, we're just stopping this here.

Suddenly the Flyers are flush with high-upside, sub-24 defensemen:

Del Zotto
Schenn
Alt
Gostisbehere
Hagg
Morin
Sanheim
Friedman

Yeah. Karlsson, Weber, Subban, Yandle, Josi, Carlson, Campbell, Ehrhoff and Enstrom all suck.
- Feanor

I dont think you named but one defenseman (Weber) that is actually praised for his defensive part of the game. They are all OFF d-men.

Josi and Campbell and Carlson and Enstrom are just offensive guys? I think I've identified the problem here - you are clueless about hockey.

Grossmann being our best DEF D-man. Coburn screws up far too much
- GOA88

That's ludicrous. Grossmann did much worse than Coburn last year despite getting much easier minutes.

Suddenly the Flyers are flush with high-upside, sub-24 defensemen:

Del Zotto
Schenn
Alt
Gostisbehre
Hagg
Morin
Sanheim
Friedman



- Tomahawk

Pitbull

Josi and Carlson and Enstrom are just offensive guys? I think I've identified the problem here - you are clueless about hockey.



That's ludicrous. Grossmann did much worse than Coburn last year despite getting much easier minutes.
- Feanor

No no no. Only Coburn makes mistakes. Much like when Matt Carle was here, only Carle made mistakes. Until he left, then he became much better defensively.

I just...wow. Okay, we're just stopping this here.
- jmatchett383

Thats fine. I cant stop you from your love affair with Coby.

Thats fine. I cant stop you from your love affair with Coby.
- GOA88

You go you.

That's kind of what I'm hoping for. Not unrealistic if he's locked in. But if he's drifting, it could be an AHL demotion for the $900K savings.
- jmatchett383

Absolutely. Totally agree.

I've never read much about his personality, so I don't know how seriously he takes the game and these kinds of opportunities.

I do know, from how I view professional sports, that playing for Fonzie would be about the last thing I'd ever want to do, and I also think getting traded midseason, as a young player, might be really difficult, as well.

Yep: I just totally made two excuses for his play over the last two seasons. I'm totally wanting to believe that he's going to recognize the amazing opportunity that being productive on the Philadelphia blueline will give a player at his age. There is such an opportunity with the Flyers for this kind of player. If he truly wants to be a player in this league, at that position, the Flyers are starving for his skillset.

I'm going to choose to believe that he plays well enough that the Flyers squeak into the playoffs.

I'm a fan. What else can I do?

Josi and Campbell and Carlson and Enstrom are just offensive guys? I think I've identified the problem here - you are clueless about hockey.



That's ludicrous. Grossmann did much worse than Coburn last year despite getting much easier minutes.
- Feanor

Who did Grossmann pair with? Streit. Timonen helps other d-men look more steady. Any Flyer fan knows that kid

I don't expect MDZ to set the world on fire, but he could be a fair value addition. Maybe he gains a little bit of his old form back, possibly playing with something to prove, and can put up something like 6/19/25 or so. I could like with that from a 5/6 defenseman. You need to watch his ES minutes, though. Basically, he's a poor man's cheap Mike green.
- jmatchett383

I agree. I think with getting 2nd PP minutes I could see him getting 10/29/39. I am hoping his skating also helps in the breakout as that he can escape some traffic if the pass is not there. But solid signing for so late in the offseason. Not like bringing a Hall gill, kurtis foster type.

You go you.
- jmatchett383

I will... Im so proud of myself. You have no idea

Absolutely. Totally agree.

I've never read much about his personality, so I don't know how seriously he takes the game and these kinds of opportunities.

I do know, from how I view professional sports, that playing for Fonzie would be about the last thing I'd ever want to do, and I also think getting traded midseason, as a young player, might be really difficult, as well.

Yep: I just totally made two excuses for his play over the last two seasons. I'm totally wanting to believe that he's going to recognize the amazing opportunity that being productive on the Philadelphia blueline will give a player at his age. There is such an opportunity with the Flyers for this kind of player. If he truly wants to be a player in this league, at that position, the Flyers are starving for his skillset.

I'm going to choose to believe that he plays well enough that the Flyers squeak into the playoffs.

I'm a fan. What else can I do?
- AllInForFlyers

Judging by most Philadelphia "fans", the best thing to do is to start appealing for the trade of every player, no matter which team we're talking about...unless he's a young, white quarterback.

Pitbull
- jmatchett383

Here we go!

I agree. I think with getting 2nd PP minutes I could see him getting 10/29/39. I am hoping his skating also helps in the breakout as that he can escape some traffic if the pass is not there. But solid signing for so late in the offseason. Not like bringing a Hall gill, kurtis foster type.
- J35Bacher

I'm thinking those numbers are a bit high, but 2nd duty PP time could help. He'll struggle with corner dumps and the cycle game in his zone, but my hope is that can help offset some of that. For the $$, and given the situation, it's not a horrible idea.