There is zero positive about this agreement. He isn't a player that is worth anything north of 2 million. Should have insisted on something else instead of Spaling, who was a known RFA and looking for an increase based on his numbers in Nashville last year. He isn't that good.
- Oneonta Penguin

There's bound to be someone who can take Scuds off your hands. That seems like the complicating matter.

There's bound to be someone who can take Scuds off your hands. That seems like the complicating matter.
- Morris

I would tend to agree with you. Scuds can't play any worse than he did last year, so he can only get better.

Make it a 2nd and you have a deal!
- YouMeAndDupuis9

I could live with that... although it's a deep draft year

I thought Jokinen was payed way too much in FA. But lets say both Sutter and Jokinen would sign with the Pens for 2 years @ $3.8M...who would you rather have?
- YouMeAndDupuis9

You must be jokin me. Of course Jokinen. Having Jokinen on the team adds another potential top 6 player plus a good faceoff man that can fill in at center if need be. It kills two birds with one stone. Sutter is just an average 3rd liner, which we have about 3 of now at this juncture, and isn't very versatile, or at least not nearly as much as Jokinen. Jokinen clearly has better value here.

As to the Spaling signing, I'm not enamored with the figures, but I think he's gonna be a great 3rd line player for us. Thinking if Sutter isn't traded (which is a big if), Spals and Flats will compliment each other greatly and our 3rd line will actually be offensively potent again along with being much better defensively than it was last year.

2013-2014: The bottom 6 sucks!
2014-2015: They're paying 16% too much for the bottom six not to suck!
- hardnosed

That has yet to be proven. While they may look better on paper, that doesn't count. A lot of people giving Ryan and other Spaling doubters grief because he hasn't even played yet, so the same applies for the people saying the bottom 6 is better. They haven't played yet, so they haven't proven anything.

That has yet to be proven. While they may look better on paper, that doesn't count. A lot of people giving Ryan and other Spaling doubters grief because he hasn't even played yet, so the same applies for the people saying the bottom 6 is better. They haven't played yet, so they haven't proven anything.
- PensFan1103

Very good point. They look a heck of a lot better on paper though.

I could live with that... although it's a deep draft year
- ystoil

Might rather up the ante on the prospect end and keep the pick. We could give them a solid Left D prospect and a 3rd for Sutter and a lower end Right D prospect

There's bound to be someone who can take Scuds off your hands. That seems like the complicating matter.
- Morris

he is our vinny L. teams know we are in a bind and will force us to pay them to take him. he is here through the year unless he is moved as part of blockbuster deal as a way to give back salary, or he retires, or he has a career ending injury. pens have no choice but to hope he plays better. if he plays outstanding then the pens have no need to trade him. nope. pens gonna have to figure out other salary solutions this year

Might rather up the ante on the prospect end and keep the pick. We could give them a solid Left D prospect and a 3rd for Sutter and a lower end Right D prospect
- Morris

Hahaha please don't offer us D prospects. Anything but D prospects. We already have an infestation of them. How bout we give you some D prospects and you give us Yakupov

Might rather up the ante on the prospect end and keep the pick. We could give them a solid Left D prospect and a 3rd for Sutter and a lower end Right D prospect
- Morris

no more d-prospects! please, for the love of god, NO!

he is our vinny L. teams know we are in a bind and will force us to pay them to take him. he is here through the year unless he is moved as part of blockbuster deal as a way to give back salary, or he retires, or he has a career ending injury. pens have no choice but to hope he plays better. if he plays outstanding then the pens have no need to trade him. nope. pens gonna have to figure out other salary solutions this year
- ChrisMS

He's not really essential to our squad even if he plays good. If he plays well, I bet we try to move him for something that's actually worth some salt rather than the spare parts to a washing machine that we would get if we managed to move him now. Hopefully his limited NTC doesn't get in the way.

While I see the point that some people make in saying it's not Letang's contract that kills you...I also know that it is Letang's contract...and contracts of Crosby, Malkin, Toews, Kane...etc that help to make a guy like Spaling a 2.2M player.

I also get the point about how it seems to be more than he is worth...but at 25-26 years old, is he not able to improve upon his game?

A few hundred thousand over payment for a 25-26 year old...I guess I don't see that as a such a big deal.

On the Sutter front...the Penguins NEED a 3rd line that gets decent minutes and is respectable offensively and defensively. I'm torn on whether or not Sutter is worth the money.

Obviously, to this point the answer is probably no.

Rossi made a big deal out of Johnston talking to Malkin...I think it's Sutter's role that needs to expand and he's a guy that needs to be more involved with the team - he needs to be more consistent and get closer to being a true Staal replacement (granted...he will probably never be as good as Jordan was at times).

I don't really get the hate over this deal. If it was for 1.9 everyone would be thrilled. We are talking like a half percent of the cap total. Plus it's a two year deal. We already got one bargain signing in Downie. I'm more comfortable with this deal than a lot of the other bargain deals.

Bottom line JR needs to deal Scuderi by any means necessary. We need to open up a spot to let one of our young d prospects shine. We got to start showcasing what we got so we can solve our top 6 forward issues. I see no other way to deal with it.

no more d-prospects! please, for the love of god, NO!
- ChrisMS

It was worth a shot we're stuffed with them too, but so many of them are left shots that I thought maybe there a chance for us to diversify.

It's really not that bad of a deal. He is still young and maybe on a more offensive minded team, he can continue his 30 pt seasons. There is a chance he gets thrown into the top 6 if injuries come into play. I've heard mixed things about him, but I've heard he plays hard in front of the net and could add a very nice touch on the 3rd line

While I see the point that some people make in saying it's not Letang's contract that kills you...I also know that it is Letang's contract...and contracts of Crosby, Malkin, Toews, Kane...etc that help to make a guy like Spaling a 2.2M player.

I also get the point about how it seems to be more than he is worth...but at 25-26 years old, is he not able to improve upon his game?

A few hundred thousand over payment for a 25-26 year old...I guess I don't see that as a such a big deal.
- icedog97

There's a bit of speculation here, but I feel like Spaling could very realistically be a better player over the next two years than Daniel Winnik. Further, I believe that after this "prove yourself" season, Winnik could conceivably hit 1.7-2 million in FA next year.

Now you're talking about a younger player in Spaling who's better and only 100-400k pricier than Winnik anyway over a two year term. Maybe a bit optimistic, but in that light not a horrendous deal.

Might rather up the ante on the prospect end and keep the pick. We could give them a solid Left D prospect and a 3rd for Sutter and a lower end Right D prospect
- Morris

Ya I agree, this may be a better route

he is our vinny L. teams know we are in a bind and will force us to pay them to take him. he is here through the year unless he is moved as part of blockbuster deal as a way to give back salary, or he retires, or he has a career ending injury. pens have no choice but to hope he plays better. if he plays outstanding then the pens have no need to trade him. nope. pens gonna have to figure out other salary solutions this year
- ChrisMS

If you did retain salary and traded him for a 4th and a 7th somewhere, is there a decent enough dman you could call up? Is there anyone who can fill scuds shoes now?

retaining 25% and calling up Harrington at 590k still saves you almost 2 million for example.

I just don't think we need Sutter.

If you did retain salary and traded him for a 4th and a 7th somewhere, is there a decent enough dman you could call up? Is there anyone who can fill scuds shoes now?

retaining 25% and calling up Harrington at 590k still saves you almost 2 million for example.
- Morris

If you retain salary, does it count against your cap number?

If you did retain salary and traded him for a 4th and a 7th somewhere, is there a decent enough dman you could call up? Is there anyone who can fill scuds shoes now?

retaining 25% and calling up Harrington at 590k still saves you almost 2 million for example.
- Morris

How does retaining salary work? Are we only retaining 25% for this year? Or for every year of the contract? If its only this year, I would do it. Thats enough savings for us this year and a huge savings through his remaining contract years.

I just don't think we need Sutter.
- powerhouse

I love you

Here's a random thought:

I'm almost positive we trade Sutter. We have the depth at center that we don't need to/can't overpay for what Sutter brings to the table, so the question becomes what do we get for him? I think most will agree that simply cap dumping Sutter for middling picks isn't quite satisfying, but when we look at the two teams that look like they could use Sutter the most in Colorado and Edmonton, there's no real way that we can get what we really want, which is a top 6 forward. So I think its time to lay those pipe dreams to rest and think of a way to make a hockey trade out of Sutter that isn't centered around a top 6 winger, but also isn't simply a cap dump. How bout this:

To Avs: Brandon Sutter

To Pittsburgh: Talbot, forward prospect, 3rd

The Avs are one of the most complete teams in hockey. The only thing that they're really missing is a legit 3C. We give them that with Sutter and allows them to comfortably continue to play Ryan O'Reilly and his 6 mil contract as a top 6 right wing instead of 3C which is a major asset mismanagement. In return, we get Talbot, a guy who becomes expendable to the Avs after acquiring Sutter due to center depth. to even out the trade, they give us a 3rd to replace the one we lost, and part with a forward prospect. For the most part, their forward prospects are middling talents, so they can stomach parting with one without feeling like they over payed for an average player in Sutter, especially since Colorado is so deep with youth anyways.

What this does for the Pens: gives us another guy for the bottom 6 on a reasonable contract who can play in various different rolls. The two major points with Talbot would be that he replenishes the center depth lost from trading away Sutter and gives us yet another option to choose from for our bottom 6 center roll, allowing us to boot Spaling to wing if he's not impressing. Secondly, he adds even more strength to the PK. Between Goc, Spaling, Talbot, and Dupuis, our PK core should be strong and deep enough that Adams can permanently start watching games from the press box.

This trade isn't flashy but I think its pretty fair. It provides us with cap relief to take care of signing one more forward, gives us even more flexibility on the bottom 6, makes our PK better, replenishes draft picks, and adds another forward prospect, even if its not a great forward prospect. Good mix of immediate help and future assets which is I think the best case scenario for a Sutter trade.

He's not really essential to our squad even if he plays good. If he plays well, I bet we try to move him for something that's actually worth some salt rather than the spare parts to a washing machine that we would get if we managed to move him now. Hopefully his limited NTC doesn't get in the way.
- Victoro311

i disagree. if he has a bounceback year the pens may see him as a veteran guy who, after martin and erhoff possibly leave, could help mentor the youngins. that might be managements take. I'd prefer they move him... that being said, they couldn't even move him for washing machine parts now and only could get those if he plays better

I just don't think we need Sutter.
- powerhouse

He's definitely expendable, IMO. We have plenty of guys that can play center. I'd put Goc on the 3rd and Spaling centering the 4th.

I don't care most of you seem content with the top 6. We need to address it. It's a big problem. Sutter is one piece that can help us get top 6 help. The other effect of adding in the top 6 is sliding guys like Dupuis or Bennett to the third line which will make our bottom 6 stronger than Sutter will. It makes too much sense, imo.