Patrick Roy wouldn't make #1.

Martin Brodeur would be one. I would give Fuhr, Hainesworth, Lumley and Joseph consideration before Patrick Roy.

Roy makes #1 for me on the all-time most overrated list.
- skidmark

Looks Like the skidmark did permanent damage.

No. I have been around longer than sharks fans.

I really like our team.........minus the goaltending. I am still worried about that, but hopeful that Allen can step in and do a great job.
- carcus

Elliott*

I've always thought of Quick as overrated. He's definitely a solid goaltender, but I just think he's put on a pedestal far too often. Looked great back in 2012, but this year his stats were nothing but average. I also think that Niemi should not be on the list. He's just been too inconsistent to be considered in the top 10 currently. I do believe Ryan Miller should be on the list, but him too I believe to be overrated. He can steal games, but man, is he inconsistent. I truly don't think the NHL has any truly elite goalies outside of Rask and Lundqvist right now. But of course, these are only my opinions.

Elliott*
- Yeah Boyes

Yes, he needs to play great. But it will likely be closer to a split, so Allen is going to need to come in and play great as well.

I think we know what to expect from Elliott in 30-40 games. It's the other 40-50 games that are a question mark. Allen is likely going to play in around 30 games or so.

No Luongo on the current list. I think he still has a few strong seasons left in him.

Ask a Sharks fan.
- Ogilthorpe2

They just found the missing piece all along though

John Scott

They just found the missing piece all along though

John Scott
- FourFeathers773

Crawford is better than 4 of the goalies on the now list. Let me know when Schneider carries the load as a number 1 goalie for a season.
Bishop is a one year wonder and hasn't been tested in the heat of the playoffs yet.

And in no world is Niemi better than Crawford. Let me know when Crawford gets yanked in a playoff series for a rookie.

No Luongo on the current list. I think he still has a few strong seasons left in him.
- flamminghead

THIS.

K, so like when I get a scoop like the Hawks being in the Winter Classic, for example, I should just not . . . publish . . . because . . . ?

Further, regardless of the records, which have to be teased out of the quality of the teams he and others played behind, what's debatable is who really was the best when all else is equal.

Sorry if I wasn't clear on that.
- John Jaeckel

When did I suggest that you shouldn't publish anything?? What was said is that I'm more fond of the blogs with your own personal opinions rather than these rumours that never see the light. I seriously wonder who the sources are when you write sometimes...That's all.

Everything is debatable and one can take out or add in whatever they want to scew their own point. Fact is, the guy has the record(s) to prove himself. When is everything equal?? Who's to say that it would play out a certain way when you "tease out" the teams he and others played behind......Looking at things that way is a waste of time for everyone involved.

It's like saying

Me: The 2012/2013 Chicago Blackhawks had the greatest season ever!!

You: Yeah but; if they didn't have the team that they had then they wouldn't have been as good........

Pointless.

When did I suggest that you shouldn't publish anything?? What was said is that I'm more fond of the blogs with your own personal opinions rather than these rumours that never see the light. I seriously wonder who the sources are when you write sometimes...That's all.

Everything is debatable and one can take out or add in whatever they want to scew their own point. Fact is, the guy has the record(s) to prove himself. When is everything equal?? Who's to say that it would play out a certain way when you "tease out" the teams he and others played behind......Looking at things that way is a waste of time for everyone involved.

It's like saying

Me: The 2012/2013 Chicago Blackhawks had the greatest season ever!!

You: Yeah but; if they didn't have the team that they had then they wouldn't have been as good........

Pointless.
- _diatribe_

It was a rhetorical question.

Sorry for wasting your time. A lot of people are just crazy like you say for putting Roy number one and Brodeur down the list a ways.

Sorry, the quality of the teams and defenses in front of different goalies has a bearing on their numbers and therefore their records. See: Osgood, C.

But you're also right. Pointless.

Crawford is better than 4 of the goalies on the now list. Let me know when Schneider carries the load as a number 1 goalie for a season.
Bishop is a one year wonder and hasn't been tested in the heat of the playoffs yet.

And in no world is Niemi better than Crawford. Let me know when Crawford gets yanked in a playoff series for a rookie.
- Elbows15

Guess it depends on the coaches confidence in the guy behind him. If the Hawks had a decent rookie on the bench in 2012, your boy would've been yanked. Dunno, that's Q's call, but that was some of the worst playoff goaltending I've ever seen. Anywhere.

I think you get outside Chicago, you get a lot more people willing to argue Niemi vs. Crawford. In fact, I know it. Crawford has consistently had better defenses in front of him than Niemi has, start with a two time Norris winner who plays nearly half of every game.

Rask before Price? Give me a break.

No Luongo on the current list. I think he still has a few strong seasons left in him.
- flamminghead

No disagreement, I think it's questionable whether he's still top 10 though.

Guess it depends on the coaches confidence in the guy behind him. If the Hawks had a decent rookie on the bench in 2012, your boy would've been yanked.

I think you get outside Chicago, you get a lot more people willing to argue Niemi vs. Crawford. In fact, I know it. Crawford has consistently had better defenses in front of him than Niemi has, start with a two time Norris winner who plays nearly half of every game.
- John Jaeckel

They had Emery behind Crawford in 2012 - not a rookie, but certainly deployable.

Unless he was injured going into the tournament? Don't remember (not thinking about his hip).

No Luongo on the current list. I think he still has a few strong seasons left in him.
- flamminghead

Will he be able to show what he has left in Miami?

They had Emery behind Crawford in 2012 - not a rookie, but certainly deployable.

Unless he was injured going into the tournament? Don't remember (not thinking about his hip).
- StLBravesFan

Good point, I was just thinking that, and I don't remember. Point is, Crawford's had his good (and great) playoff games and series. And he had one series and a game here or there where he has been pretty godawful (I believe Game 4 of the 2013 Finals where he was beaten glove side like 17 times).

To say there's no debate (even) about Niemi versus Crawford is a bit overreaching. But let the hyperbole flow, I guess.

Put it to you this way, put Crawford on the Sharks and Niemi on the Hawks. Hmmm.

No Luongo on the current list. I think he still has a few strong seasons left in him.
- flamminghead

Agreed.

Good point, I was just thinking that, and I don't remember. Point is, Crawford's had his good (and great) playoff games and series. And he had one series and a game here or there where he has been pretty godawful (I believe Game 4 of the 2013 Finals where he was beaten glove side like 17 times).

To say there's no debate (even) about Niemi versus Crawford is a bit overreaching. But let the hyperbole flow, I guess.

Put it to you this way, put Crawford on the Sharks and Niemi on the Hawks. Hmmm.
- John Jaeckel

Fortunately, the game that Rask wasn't any better (6-5 OT).

I wouldn't put Niemi in the top ten - I see him as about the same as Crawford, with your criticism covering both: plays terrific for a while, but has some just terrible games / stretches.

Of course, I've said before, goalies are like MLB closers: escellent for a period of time, then the breaking ball can't find the plate, and a series of blown saves; a couple of good seasons in a row, then they can't get anyone out for two summers.

Goalies are very similar.

Guess it depends on the coaches confidence in the guy behind him. If the Hawks had a decent rookie on the bench in 2012, your boy would've been yanked. Dunno, that's Q's call, but that was some of the worst playoff goaltending I've ever seen. Anywhere.

I think you get outside Chicago, you get a lot more people willing to argue Niemi vs. Crawford. In fact, I know it. Crawford has consistently had better defenses in front of him than Niemi has, start with a two time Norris winner who plays nearly half of every game.
- John Jaeckel

Crawford being yanked in 2012 is debatable at best. The whole team was awful in that series and he gave up goals in OT after keeping his team in it for the whole game. And it still doesn't change the fact that Niemi was yanked in 2013 for a rookie because he stunk up the place and played a huge part in his team choking away a 3-0 lead.

Also. Keith won his first Norris in front of Huet and Niemi.


And if defense in front of a goalie is a factor, then Dryden shouldn't be on any list.

Crawford being yanked in 2012 is debatable at best. The whole team was awful in that series and he gave up goals in OT after keeping his team in it for the whole game. And it still doesn't change the fact that Niemi was yanked in 2013 for a rookie because he stunk up the place and played a huge part in his team choking away a 3-0 lead.

Also. Keith won his first Norris in front of Huet and Niemi.


And if defense in front of a goalie is a factor, then Dryden shouldn't be on any list.
- Elbows15

It's a factor, by all means, but you (I think) and I know Dryden should be on the list. So . . . yeah, ok, whatever.

Like I said, you swap sweaters between Niemi and Crawford and you tell me there's no comparison. Which is clearly what you imply.

And Crawford gave up the two softest goals, at the worst possible times, in that series, I have ever seen in the playoffs. And he couldn't track the puck around his net the whole series too. You know what, Oduya, for one, was a train wreck in the series. No question. But the goalie has to pick those guys up sometimes, which he failed to do in that series.

He's been great at times (which I readily acknowledge). But a little like Huet (but not as bad) actually, when he goes off the rails, he goes off. He personally requested they hire Waite and that's probably a good thing then, but the pressure will be higher on him with the new contract—even more so if they have to subtract salary on D.

And let me just add this:

Outside of Chicago, outside of Hawk fans or Hawk-paid media flacks, there is only one credible source I have ever heard (much less any fans of other teams) who puts Crawford in the top tier of NHL goalies. And that was Kevin Weekes. Who, by the way, was a pretty big fan of Cristobal Huet too. I know because he told me. Just for the sake of perspective.

It's a factor, by all means, but you (I think) and I know Dryden should be on the list. So . . . yeah, ok, whatever.

Like I said, you swap sweaters between Niemi and Crawford and you tell me there's no comparison. Which is clearly what you imply.

And Crawford gave up the two softest goals, at the worst possible times, in that series, I have ever seen in the playoffs. And he couldn't track the puck around his net the whole series too. You know what, Oduya, for one, was a train wreck in the series. No question. But the goalie has to pick those guys up sometimes, which he failed to do in that series.

He's been great at times (which I readily acknowledge). But a little like Huet (but not as bad) actually, when he goes off the rails, he goes off. He personally requested they hire Waite and that's probably a good thing then, but the pressure will be higher on him with the new contract—even more so if they have to subtract salary on D.
- John Jaeckel

And the pressure will be on the forwards to think defense first, and make sure he is protected. That's what we've always said - Crawford, when well-protected, is an excellent goalie for this team.

Last year - protection was not as good as it should have been - too many SOG, too many open opponents in the slot, with enough time to aim at the glove, too many pucks - and opponent skaters - not cleared from the crease.

Part of that - especially in the tournament - was Q having (or believing he had) only 2+ forward lines to work with. Hopefully, between Richards, Morin, etc., the depth is there this year.

It's a factor, by all means, but you (I think) and I know Dryden should be on the list. So . . . yeah, ok, whatever.

Like I said, you swap sweaters between Niemi and Crawford and you tell me there's no comparison. Which is clearly what you imply.

And Crawford gave up the two softest goals, at the worst possible times, in that series, I have ever seen in the playoffs. And he couldn't track the puck around his net the whole series too. You know what, Oduya, for one, was a train wreck in the series. No question. But the goalie has to pick those guys up sometimes, which he failed to do in that series.

He's been great at times (which I readily acknowledge). But a little like Huet (but not as bad) actually, when he goes off the rails, he goes off. He personally requested they hire Waite and that's probably a good thing then, but the pressure will be higher on him with the new contract—even more so if they have to subtract salary on D.
- John Jaeckel

And in the Cup finals in 2013 his numbers were slightly better than Rask. And if you compare their numbers for the cup runs, Crawford's are better than Niemi's. and not by a little. Its just my opinion. I would take Crawford over Niemi every time. And the truth of the matter is Crawford actually beat out Niemi in 2010 but was sent down because the Hawks needed the cap space in the difference in salary between the 2.

And the pressure will be on the forwards to think defense first, and make sure he is protected. That's what we've always said - Crawford, when well-protected, is an excellent goalie for this team.

Last year - protection was not as good as it should have been - too many SOG, too many open opponents in the slot, with enough time to aim at the glove, too many pucks - and opponent skaters - not cleared from the crease.

Part of that - especially in the tournament - was Q having (or believing he had) only 2+ forward lines to work with. Hopefully, between Richards, Morin, etc., the depth is there this year.
- StLBravesFan

I thought Crawford was ok in the regular and basically very good in the playoffs this past year.

Going forward, the money committed to the core is going to force compromises on supporting cast and/or looking for lightning in a bottle a lot.

I remember the 2009 WCF, when Detroit was able to take huge advantage of the Hawks' third pairing (Walker and Barker), basically winning the series on an OT goal against that pair, when it looked like if the hawks pulled out the road win, they might turn the series around.

Oduya is what he is, but he, also, has improved tremendously the last couple of years, especially in his own end. If he has to be dealt, it will not be an automatic replacing him. Not by a long shot.