Kessel did Jack Squat when it mattered so maybe he should of been left off too.
- forbetterorWORSE

Hmmm...I'm afraid this doesn't pass the sniff test. Led the tournament in goals and points.

Bridge between the period of time where his market value is below what he feels his value is. He will not lock in long term for less than what he feels he could make.

For example, after last year, Ryan's value is lower than it could be. If he were negotiating a contract, he wouldn't go long-term based on value established last year. He would do short term, with the intent of playing lights out and then cashing in long term.

If that's not what a bridge contract is, I'm sorry - whatever they call it, that's what I mean.
- sensano

Fair enough.

Bobby Ryan will take the most money available to him in Free Agency. It may be, as you say, on a short term deal. But as a hypothetical...if someone offers him 5 years at 33m, and another team offers him 2 years at 17m he'll take the 5 year deal all day long.

Hmmm...I'm afraid this doesn't pass the sniff test. Led the tournament in goals and points.
- djamon

Im sure he meant staney cup playoffs. He seems to not show up for them. But its not like toronto has been the playoff capital of the nhl since the first lockout. I think twice they made it since then. Correct me if Im wrong

Kessel is better and he's making 8m. Whether you think he's overpaid or not is irrelevant, if he's the benchmark Bobby Ryan will try to use in negotiations then he can't really ask for "north of 8m a year"...can he?
- djamon

I think you are correct.

Kessel is better and he's making 8m. Whether you think he's overpaid or not is irrelevant, if he's the benchmark Bobby Ryan will try to use in negotiations then he can't really ask for "north of 8m a year"...can he?
- djamon

Rumour has it he was asking to be paid the same as Perry and Getzlaf in Anaheim so who knows?? That's why im in support of trading him. Hes a sniper style player like Kessel, but Kessels speed and shot are superior.

Im sure he meant staney cup playoffs. He seems to not show up for them. But its not like toronto has been the playoff capital of the nhl since the first lockout. I think twice they made it since then. Correct me if Im wrong
- jmdodgeser4

First off...it's been one time and I think you know that!

secondly...he has 21 points in 22 career Playoff Games. I think he's showed up fine.

Hmmm...I'm afraid this doesn't pass the sniff test. Led the tournament in goals and points.
- djamon

Kessel is an amazing offensive talent, I just don't see him as a leader or having that extra gear players like Toews and Perry have when it comes to crunch time. That's all my point is.

Rumour has it he was asking to be paid the same as Perry and Getzlaf in Anaheim so who knows?? That's why im in support of trading him. Hes a sniper style player like Kessel, but Kessels speed and shot are superior.
- forbetterorWORSE

That's a fair assessment.

Here's another question...do you honestly think Melnyk will pay anyone 8m/year?

That's a fair assessment.

Here's another question...do you honestly think Melnyk will pay anyone 8m/year?
- djamon

Maybe to Karlsson??

Kessel is better and he's making 8m. Whether you think he's overpaid or not is irrelevant, if he's the benchmark Bobby Ryan will try to use in negotiations then he can't really ask for "north of 8m a year"...can he?
- djamon

I hate to, but I agree with this. Kessel is 'a' benchmark, but there are others that are paid more. Is Kessel ($8Mil) better than Kane ($10Mil)? I think they're pretty equal players, yet they're not paid equally. That's why it's hard to tell how much Ryan will fetch. He's not Kessel, nor Kane.

I hate to, but I agree with this. Kessel is 'a' benchmark, but there are others that are paid more. Is Kessel ($8Mil) better than Kane ($10Mil)? I think they're pretty equal players, yet they're not paid equally. That's why it's hard to tell how much Ryan will fetch. He's not Kessel, nor Kane.
- Stringer74

Good point. I admit, I'm always wrong on what a player will get on the open market. They're all overpaid, and they keep pushing the envelope. Toews at 10m is understandable, but not Kane, IMO. Crosby's Cap hit is 8.7m...he must be a little ticked that an opportunistic guy like Patrick Kane is making almost 2m more than him.

Two years ago I would have said Bobby Ryan was at least as good as Kessel. But I don't think that anymore. Phil has taken his game to a higher level and Ryan seems to have regressed a little. But if he gets to market, and he's the only sniper out there, he'll get much more than I would have predicted.

I hate to, but I agree with this. Kessel is 'a' benchmark, but there are others that are paid more. Is Kessel ($8Mil) better than Kane ($10Mil)? I think they're pretty equal players, yet they're not paid equally. That's why it's hard to tell how much Ryan will fetch. He's not Kessel, nor Kane.
- Stringer74

Kane and Toews have hardware. That's the difference.

Kessel is better and he's making 8m. Whether you think he's overpaid or not is irrelevant, if he's the benchmark Bobby Ryan will try to use in negotiations then he can't really ask for "north of 8m a year"...can he?
- djamon

Kessel is obviously better than Ryan but Kessel signed his deal in October of 2013. Ryan likely gets his money sometime in 2015.

As time progresses, contract comparables become more and more obsolete. It's the same reason why Brooks Orpik's making $1MM less per year than Erik Karlsson, and not $4MM less. [or why Matt Niskanen beats out a lot of these guys http://www.capgeek.com/comparables/?player_id=694]

I think he can ask for $8. I doubt he gets it, but it's not entirely unreasonable, especially if he has a big season here.

A lot of this is contingent on what the cap number is for 2015-2016, too.

Yeah, the OS maybe prevented him from taking the bridge deal. We may never know. BTW...Duchene was still an RFA when he got his big deal.

That's the thing with the early deals...the Varly one looked a little crazy at the time, it was a huge gamble. But if he puts together another great year then he's a bargain and it looks fantastic.

I don't believe any player should feel obligated take a "hometown" discount. Not because another player did it, not because you're building something great. It's a business...both sides know that.
- djamon

I know, his current deal was an RFA going past into UFA elgiability. But right off his ELC he did a 2 year brdige deal. He did the right thing for the team in his mind, and showed he was worth the long term investmenet.

That's a fair assessment.

Here's another question...do you honestly think Melnyk will pay anyone 8m/year?
- djamon

Spezza and Heatley has annual salaries of $10 mil on their last contracts, so it's not completely outside the realm of possibilities.

Spezza and Heatley has annual salaries of $10 mil on their last contracts, so it's not completely outside the realm of possibilities.
- ahjnkn

True enough. I didn't originally think he had been around that long.

Im sure he meant staney cup playoffs. He seems to not show up for them. But its not like toronto has been the playoff capital of the nhl since the first lockout. I think twice they made it since then. Correct me if Im wrong
- jmdodgeser4

He's a PPG player (nearly) in the playoffs. 22 GP 21 points

Rumour has it he was asking to be paid the same as Perry and Getzlaf in Anaheim so who knows?? That's why im in support of trading him. Hes a sniper style player like Kessel, but Kessels speed and shot are superior.
- forbetterorWORSE

He was. That's not saying he's not worth it, it's saying that Anaheim couldn't afford 3 players at that cap hit. If Perry had opted out, the Ducks would have paid Bobby.

Any AAV of 7-7.5 million is fair value I think, I can't see him making more than Kessel even with the cap rising. I just hope we don't get leaked info about horrible under value contract offers from this organization again. Also if he leaves this team is in complete shambles.

There are not many (if any) teams spending near the cap this year that will be able to clear $8m to sign Ryan next year. Cap situation is going to be a lot tougher next year. Remember the biggest change in contracting is not the demands of UFAs. It is the demand for top money by RFAs (ROR, Subban, Johannson).

Teams like the Flyers have been shut out of the UFA market because they can't even give away their bad contracts (LaCavalier). Toronto could not retain some good players because they did not have the cap flexibility. Chicago is likely going to get a small return for a good player like Sharp.

The much more difficult question is does Ottawa want to pay Ryan in a range that could run in excess of $8m?
- spatso

Dallas is pretty close to the cap this year. Next year they have 30mil opening up, that's not including cap rise. Dallas can offer Ryan a nice chunk of change and a spot on the top line with Benn-Seguin

Kessel is obviously better than Ryan but Kessel signed his deal in October of 2013. Ryan likely gets his money sometime in 2015.

As time progresses, contract comparables become more and more obsolete. It's the same reason why Brooks Orpik's making $1MM less per year than Erik Karlsson, and not $4MM less.
- Travis Yost[or why Matt Niskanen beats out a lot of these guys http://www.capgeek.com/comparables/?player_id=694]

I think he can ask for $8. I doubt he gets it, but it's not entirely unreasonable, especially if he has a big season here.

A lot of this is contingent on what the cap number is for 2015-2016, too.

Some box holders have reached the breaking point. These are the business guys who understand that games have to be a positive commercial event in order to be appealing to their clients. Several of them have squeezed the Senators really hard on the renewal of their boxes. Suicide for the Senators to go into the season with an unsigned Ryan. They either sign him or deal him before the season starts. The mood of the stakeholders is starting to get kind of ugly. They understand they pay upwards of 70% more for the similar box or seat in Dallas or Nashville or St. Louis.

These guys may not understand player evaluations but they do understand numbers, contracting and value. They know they are buying very expensive entertainment services, they are paying steep prices. But, they are not getting a fair return on their dollar.

Pro scout Rob Murphy has officially left the organization. He's accepting a promotion w/ Buffalo. We talked about this months ago, but it appears done now.
Just FYI.

If Bobby Ryan is going to free agency he's getting $50M to start with (over 7 years). The only advantage to Ottawa is that we have the ability to sign him for 8 years. I don't see him getting more than 8M for 7 years; unless he hits above 35G and 70pts.

That means that $56M is on the table (maximum); not knowing which team he's going to. The Sens can match that salary (making it a 8 year deal). I'd give him 8 years $54M and call it a day; make him the biggest cap hit. Or BEST CASE, sign him 8 years at $6.5M (tied with Karlsson) ; very unlikely with 21 forwards already higher than that. Ryan is in his prime... big factor

If Bobby Ryan is going to free agency he's getting $50M to start with (over 7 years). The only advantage to Ottawa is that we have the ability to sign him for 8 years. I don't see him getting more than 8M for 7 years; unless he hits above 35G and 70pts.

That means that $56M is on the table (maximum); not knowing which team he's going to. The Sens can match that salary (making it a 8 year deal). I'd give him 8 years $54M and call it a day; make him the biggest cap hit. Or BEST CASE, sign him 8 years at $6.5M (tied with Karlsson) ; very unlikely with 21 forwards already higher than that. Ryan is in his prime... big factor
- AlfieisKing

Agree 100%. Plus Bobby and his agent will remember how Burke played hard ball during his last contract negotiation. The Karlsson contract is irrelevant because he is grossly underpaid now. You were close on your initial figure. $56 mil might get it done.

Agree 100%. Plus Bobby and his agent will remember how Burke played hard ball during his last contract negotiation. The Karlsson contract is irrelevant because he is grossly underpaid now. You were close on your initial figure. $56 mil might get it done.
- duxcup07

ya its wishful thinking but who knows.

i think $ 54M (old jersey #)... over 8 years is fair - 6.75 per