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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Development Camp, Setoguchi, Kovalenko
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Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 7 @ 9:48 AM ET
Not exactly a complete translation, but somebody on twitter got the cliffs notes:

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) Morin wants to make the #Flyers out of camp. He's an inch taller and gained 20+ pounds of muscle mass.

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) Morin says he had a taste of it w/ the exhibition games last season and he wants more.

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) He said PHI has been impressed w/ his on- and off-ice attitude. Very physical presence.

Tyler J. Altemose
@TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) But he has to work on his decision making when it comes to whom to go after (he can get himself in trouble).

- BulliesPhan87



Cool. Give him another taste and then he can pack his bags again
JoeRussomanno
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: me bitter? F-no i think it's hilarious
Joined: 12.14.2011

Jul 7 @ 9:48 AM ET
The hartnell contract was a negative value contract. The flyers dont want umberger, but they had to take him in order to rid themselves of hartnell. Umbergers deal is 2 years shorter, that's what it was all about. How fast can you flush a turd
- Just5

I know he had a bad year last season but for 90% of his tenure hartnell was not a "turd" here... Just saying.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jul 7 @ 9:49 AM ET
Sarcasm....nice but who mentioned those players both were overpaid. The flyers have enough big, slow dmen so Orpik...no. Bolland at that price...good luck in Florida. The point is they can't do anything....they trade Hartnell and take back the same money....smart. If the flyers would have waited they could have got Umberger after he was bought out for less than 4.6 mil. The whole Lecavalier thing is exhausting. To trade him they will have to retain half of his contract and they will still be over the cap.
- RobFlyers#1



The Flyers aren't over the Cap. And they still have some money to spend. Who knows if Umberger would have been bought out, or what they coul've signed him for, and for how many years.
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Jul 7 @ 9:49 AM ET
Not exactly a complete translation, but somebody on twitter got the cliffs notes:

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) Morin wants to make the #Flyers out of camp. He's an inch taller and gained 20+ pounds of muscle mass.

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) Morin says he had a taste of it w/ the exhibition games last season and he wants more.

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) He said PHI has been impressed w/ his on- and off-ice attitude. Very physical presence.

Tyler J. Altemose
@TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) But he has to work on his decision making when it comes to whom to go after (he can get himself in trouble).

- BulliesPhan87


I'm not against a 9-game tryout, but I'd like him to spend another year in juniors. Go back, continue to work on your decision making/puck movement, and go from there. Also, BIG difference between physically dominating 17-year-olds and 27-year-olds. Still, very excited for him in years to come.
BiggE
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: SELL THE DAMN TEAM!
Joined: 04.17.2012

Jul 7 @ 9:50 AM ET
You don't see any of our D prospects arriving on the roster for 3-5 years? I agree they may not be dominating, but I'd hope at least 1 of them can crack the roster in a year or 2.
- jmatchett383


FWIW, here is my best case scenario for the Flyer's top D prospects

Morin-cracks the roster in 15-16, develops into a top pair shutdown guy by 18-19

Ghost-gets some injury call up time in 14-15, cracks the roster full time in 15-16. By 17-18 he is a solid 2nd pair guy and QBs the top pp unit.

Hagg-cracks the roster at some point during the 15-16 season, by 17-18 he is playing on the 2nd pair.

Sanheim-makes the roster out of camp in 16-17, is playing with Morin on the top pair by 18-19.

Alt-Comes up midway thru 14-15, is anchoring the 3rd pair by 16-17.

Of course this is a best case scenario assuming none of the above are busts, none get seriously injured and none are traded. In reality, if any 2 of these guys are in our top four by 17-18, we should be happy.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jul 7 @ 9:50 AM ET
If they waited and got Umberger, that would have been added to Hartnell's salary and put them further over the cap. Unless you can say with 100% assurance that there were other trades that Hartnell would 100% have agreed to. There was absolutely NO ONE who was a "name" in UFA who was worth what they got paid. I'm not sure what moves you want them to make that they can't due to cap reasons. Sign Niskanen for minimum wage, maybe?
- jmatchett383



I would say Ehrhoff was worth what he got paid in free agency. Steal of a deal.
RobFlyers#1
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.22.2009

Jul 7 @ 9:51 AM ET
If they waited and got Umberger, that would have been added to Hartnell's salary and put them further over the cap. Unless you can say with 100% assurance that there were other trades that Hartnell would 100% have agreed to. There was absolutely NO ONE who was a "name" in UFA who was worth what they got paid. I'm not sure what moves you want them to make that they can't due to cap reasons. Sign Niskanen for minimum wage, maybe?
- jmatchett383


If Hartnell waived to go to Columbus then it don't matter who was coming back. They could have got a prospect or draft picks anything without taking money back. My point is they knew they were up against the cap and done nothing about it Wheather they did anything or not on July 1st they put themselves in a position were they could not do anything. Washington May have overpaid to get Orpik and Niskanen but they are a better team for it as well
BiggE
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: SELL THE DAMN TEAM!
Joined: 04.17.2012

Jul 7 @ 9:51 AM ET
Not exactly a complete translation, but somebody on twitter got the cliffs notes:

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) Morin wants to make the #Flyers out of camp. He's an inch taller and gained 20+ pounds of muscle mass.

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) Morin says he had a taste of it w/ the exhibition games last season and he wants more.

Tyler J. Altemose @TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) He said PHI has been impressed w/ his on- and off-ice attitude. Very physical presence.


Tyler J. Altemose
@TJamesAltemose
LRT: (Translated) But he has to work on his decision making when it comes to whom to go after (he can get himself in trouble).

- BulliesPhan87


This is all great to here, but I would still be very surprised if Morin made this team out of camp. I still think he is at least one more year away.
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 7 @ 9:51 AM ET
I know he had a bad year last season but for 90% of his tenure hartnell was not a "turd" here... Just saying.
- JoeRussomanno


It's all relative. Whats his contract look like? His value was a steaming pile of dung as the trade suggested, unless we think hextall is incompetent
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Jul 7 @ 9:51 AM ET
I would say Ehrhoff was worth what he got paid in free agency. Steal of a deal.
- MJL


True, but that seems like a tailor-made deal where he was going one place and one place only.
BulliesPhan87
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: the lone wolf of hockeybuzz
Joined: 07.31.2009

Jul 7 @ 9:51 AM ET
Thats (frank)ing awesome
- JoeRussomanno

he will deliver us to the promised land
JoeRussomanno
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: me bitter? F-no i think it's hilarious
Joined: 12.14.2011

Jul 7 @ 9:52 AM ET
he will deliver us to the promised land
- BulliesPhan87

Lets not get carried away now
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jul 7 @ 9:52 AM ET
No one said they had to be elite persons of the core immediately. He simply said they arrive on the roster.
- jmatchett383



No, he said the Flyers are in a holding pattern for the young defenseman. That's open to interpretation. So the Flyers are going to sit back and wait until those players arrive on the roster? I wouln't.
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Jul 7 @ 9:53 AM ET
If Hartnell waived to go to Columbus then it don't matter who was coming back. They could have got a prospect or draft picks anything without taking money back. My point is they knew they were up against the cap and done nothing about it Wheather they did anything or not on July 1st they put themselves in a position were they could not do anything. Washington May have overpaid to get Orpik and Niskanen but they are a better team for it as well
- RobFlyers#1


Maybe Columbus insisted the Flyers take Umberger? I hear the other team sometimes has a say in a trade.

Also, I don't think Washington is better. They'll regret those deals within 2 years.
JoeRussomanno
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: me bitter? F-no i think it's hilarious
Joined: 12.14.2011

Jul 7 @ 9:53 AM ET
It's all relative. Whats his contract look like? His value was a steaming pile of dung as the trade suggested, unless we think hextall is incompetent
- Just5

Hmmmm .... Ok
BiggE
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: SELL THE DAMN TEAM!
Joined: 04.17.2012

Jul 7 @ 9:53 AM ET
Maybe Columbus insisted the Flyers take Umberger? I hear the other team sometimes has a say in a trade.

Also, I don't think Washington is better. They'll regret those deals within 2 years.

- jmatchett383


Agreed, I feel that the Orpik signing was the worst move made by any team this offseason.
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Jul 7 @ 9:54 AM ET
No, he said the Flyers are in a holding pattern for the young defenseman. That's open to interpretation. So the Flyers are going to sit back and wait until those players arrive on the roster? I wouln't.
- MJL


Sure. You win.
Giroux_Is_God
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: CLASS DISMISSED
Joined: 12.15.2011

Jul 7 @ 9:55 AM ET
This is all great to here, but I would still be very surprised if Morin made this team out of camp. I still think he is at least one more year away.
- BiggE

Come on man you're better than that
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Jul 7 @ 9:55 AM ET


Agreed, I feel that the Orpik signing was the worst move made by any team this offseason.

- BiggE


Absolutely. He was a complete waste on Pittsburgh the last 2 years. And Niskanen was very fortunate with how things went on a top-end team this past season.
Tomahawk
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner bandwagon. Grab 'em by the Corsi.
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 7 @ 9:55 AM ET
Yes, this team has holes.

Unfortunately, there are more holes than there are solutions in the FA market.

I want a plan from the organization and I want them to execute it. Not just buy players because they can.

- johndewar



JoeRussomanno
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: me bitter? F-no i think it's hilarious
Joined: 12.14.2011

Jul 7 @ 9:56 AM ET

- Tomahawk

X2
vejim
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: FL
Joined: 07.08.2007

Jul 7 @ 9:56 AM ET
FWIW, here is my best case scenario for the Flyer's top D prospects

Morin-cracks the roster in 15-16, develops into a top pair shutdown guy by 18-19

Ghost-gets some injury call up time in 14-15, cracks the roster full time in 15-16. By 17-18 he is a solid 2nd pair guy and QBs the top pp unit.

Hagg-cracks the roster at some point during the 15-16 season, by 17-18 he is playing on the 2nd pair.

Sanheim-makes the roster out of camp in 16-17, is playing with Morin on the top pair by 18-19.

Alt-Comes up midway thru 14-15, is anchoring the 3rd pair by 16-17.

Of course this is a best case scenario assuming none of the above are busts, none get seriously injured and none are traded. In reality, if any 2 of these guys are in our top four by 17-18, we should be happy.

- BiggE

hopefully, we are all still alive in 2020
RobFlyers#1
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.22.2009

Jul 7 @ 9:57 AM ET
The Flyers aren't over the Cap. And they still have some money to spend. Who knows if Umberger would have been bought out, or what they coul've signed him for, and for how many years.
- MJL


Really..... You better check that because they are over by 3 mil. News coming out of Columbus was he was going to be traded or the team would use a compliance buyout. The Flyers must be under the cap before the season starts and Pronger can not go on LTIR until after the first game....
TobyFlenderson
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: The Annex, Scranton, PA
Joined: 06.13.2013

Jul 7 @ 9:58 AM ET
I'm not against a 9-game tryout, but I'd like him to spend another year in juniors. Go back, continue to work on your decision making/puck movement, and go from there. Also, BIG difference between physically dominating 17-year-olds and 27-year-olds. Still, very excited for him in years to come.
- jmatchett383


I really hope he takes a step forward in his offensive development and I think playing one more year in the Q will help that. He had 8 points in 11 playoff games this past year so the skills are there. I'm anxious to see how he does at prospect camp.
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 7 @ 9:58 AM ET
If Hartnell waived to go to Columbus then it don't matter who was coming back. They could have got a prospect or draft picks anything without taking money back. My point is they knew they were up against the cap and done nothing about it Wheather they did anything or not on July 1st they put themselves in a position were they could not do anything. Washington May have overpaid to get Orpik and Niskanen but they are a better team for it as well
- RobFlyers#1



Why would you think Columbus would have done the deal without umberger involved? There's no way they would. Their owners were thrilled they don't have to use a buyout on umberger, their a small market team
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