He'd be a solid bottom six add....over his career he's good for about 10-15 goals and that many assists to....better that our bottom six now.
- southernhawk

Exactly! He can even serve the occasional shift on the top two lines.

Let's face it, who thought that during the coldest days of 2010, we'd see you the line of 33/19/88 in the WCF and SCF?! Exactly....! Interchangeable pieces. THAT is what SB has to deliver to Q.

JJ,


The only real piece i can see there would be Stepan....possibly Hagelin...

Im sure they learned playing LA that they made a mistake letting Gaborik loose...

Maybe a Sharp and Leddy for Stepan and Hagelin deal....this would allow the Rangers to re-sign Brassard for the decent raise hes in line for....

doesnt really seem though that NY needs help on the blue line...

thoughts?
- ChicagoDave

If they have Moore on defense, then Leddy cannot play on that blue line. This is something wiz would say makes sense.

Yup

Ok.
I am only trying to look at every player on every team without being a hawk fan-boy, becasue surely i have a long list of players I really really like that I would love to see on the hawks, including Kesler for years.

Last season, Tavares goes down at the Olympics.
This leaves the Islanders in the unenviable position of now losing their best goal scoring centre (after they disrupted their scoring lines, trading Moulson for Vanek) and after it happened Nielsen scored 7 of his goals and 8 of his assists, and was a plus one.

Youngster centre Brock Nelson (drafted in the tarde Hawk draft slot in the exchange for Kevin hayes pick) was asked to step up and Nelson had 4 goals and 4 assists. Rookie Ryan Strome had six goals and eight assist.

Young vet Josh Bailey failed ot produce at centre and was basically used as a winger he had two goals and 17 assists. makes maybe far too much money to warrant him sticking around and centre is no longer in his future.
Casey Cizikas is viewed as a low end checker at centre and had one goal and one assist after the Tavares injury

Note: all the stats above are post Tavares injury.

Free Agency

Islander add centre Mikhail Grabovski, who is what he is a off the side close to the net tip in tap scorer who they envision as a 2nd line centre - scorer/PP guy.
They add Nikolai Kulemin who no matter waht anyone is a LW period.
They add 5' 8" Cory Conacher who may be listed as a centre but for all intents and purposes lines up at RW for those four big goals he scored in Ottawa this year.

They way I see their free agency they added a centre and now have the option of letting one of their two youngsters Brock Nelson and Ryan Strome playe LW and RW respectively while they learn, abd are NOT tading them.

You look up and down that Islander lineup and you a need for both a young puck carrying defenseman and a big time NHL scorer, if they want to attempt to get better now.

After looking at the post Tavares loss numbers I don't see Nielsen as way out.
He is generously six foot, and does his best as 200 foot gamer but he did come and he did fill on top line with Thomas Vanek and Kyle Okposo on his wings...

You think he is available?
That getting Mikhail Grabovski makes him expendable so Nelson and Strome continue to on the job train and they don't keep his offense around to make sure they are solid at the position?

So there is the rub...

If the Islanders think Leddy is an answer, you think he NOW suddenly leapfrogs Richards and Kruger is our 4th line centre and that solves the Kings????

If you think Sharp is gonna get Brooklyn to the playoffs, you think Nielsen fills a need right now, because after two more seasons imagine what he commands on a market (he makes 275,000 now) where David Legwand a 3rd liner got three million a year.
So what is Nielsen a two year fill and the cost a REAL NHL scorer?

It's not like I came to my opinion through my arse, or just came online to down you guys, but things have to make sense to me, and I think this is past happening after the signed Richards at a bargain rate.


and sure, the Rangers would love a Leddy typr carrier, but there is absolutely nothing on that roster cap wise that fits the Hawks .
you can conjure a RFA Brassard comig to hawks but he made 3.2 million already.

If they are talking ...it is thank you to Slats for buying out Richards. And no one put Dominic Moore on a pedestal either.
- wiz1901

Great analysis but bc of the depth that Isles have at C doesn't mean 1 would be moved. Also if Frans gets moved its prob for a top 4 defensive Dman. Isles have to many type's of Leddy's in system and on team. I think that Snow is trying to trade Bailey and/or Grabner 1st before Frans even gets considered. If you look at the SCF both Kings & Rangers had 4 C that rolled 4 lines which seems to be the common recipe for advancing ( from an offensive perspective ).

He'd be a solid bottom six add....over his career he's good for about 10-15 goals and that many assists to....better that our bottom six now.
- southernhawk

Eh, that's just really not true. Clutterbuck is a bad possession player, has never had a positive +/- season in his career, and hasn't reached 30 points in his last 4 seasons.

Even comparing Clutterbuck's 2011-2012 (his best overall season in terms of possession and points) to 2014 Kruger, Smith, Shaw, and Bickell (most common 4 in the bottom 6), they still come out on top in terms in most categories. Bickell is the only one to have significantly less points than him in comparison while Shaw was over 10 points higher and Kruger and Smith were about even. And Kruger and Smith did that while facing tougher quality of competition. 3 of those 4 guys are also cheaper, too.

So no, I don't think it's fair to say Clutterbuck is better than most in our bottom 6.

Where do you move those guys? That is the $4.9M question.
- blackhawk24

The Jackets are almost 16 mil under the cap, and I know they are not looking to spend it all but they don't have a ton on D.

Wiz, Johnson and Tyutin to go along with youngsters Murray and Savard. They might be willing to take a vet to help this year.

Oduya for draft picks? bad move.

Versteeg, Bickell, yes... JO, No.
- fvineze

Bickel is a big man who when he plays big is quite valuable. Those type are not easy to obtain. There is not a lot of sense to move Bickel despite his reputation for lack of motivation or games where he doesn't hit much. Cripes sake look at what he can do in the playoffs, eg. vs Boston. With Western Conference teams stronger this season I would like Bickel here. He might work well on any number of line combinations.

No one is going to trade for Rozsival and I am fine with that. He gets trashed unfairly on this board. The difference in salary between Oduya and Leaddope is 600 K. And its my feeling ODuya will sign a contract for around what he makes now. Something like 3-4 years @3.5 to 3.75 a years. And Oduya will still be an effective player for that contract. And better than Leddy. And the cost will be about the same.

You go with the better player. Always.
- Elbows15

I'd say if JO goes to FA, he'll get an AAV of $5M in a 3-4 yr deal. I am willing to keep Rozy and move Leddy. Keep JO so that leaves the top 2 pairings untouched.

The Jackets are almost 16 mil under the cap, and I know they are not looking to spend it all but they don't have a ton on D.

Wiz, Johnson and Tyutin to go along with youngsters Murray and Savard. They might be willing to take a vet to help this year.
- yobwoc03

At one time a couple years ago Sharp might have been good to teach and help along some younger Columbus players. But Bowman is not likely trading Sharp now (this summer or this season IMHO) and who knows if Sharp even would approve a trade to the land of the Ohio State Buckeyes.

I'd say if JO goes to FA, he'll get an AAV of $5 in a 3-4 yr deal. I am willing to keep Rozy and move Leddy. Keep JO so that leaves the top 2 pairings untouched.
- blackhawk24

My point is I think he would take less to stay here. If Andy (frank)ing Macdonald can get 5 a year, Oduya can get close to that on the OPEN market. I don't know why but I just have a feeling he would prefer to finish his career here. Since its his last contract most likely, I couldn't blame him for getting the most he can.

He could be at a stage in his career, not saying its the case, where he just wants to play in a place that best suits his skills and in a place he wants to.

At one time a couple years ago Sharp might have been good to teach and help along some younger Columbus players. But Bowman is not likely trading Sharp now (this summer or this season IMHO) and who knows if Sharp even would approve a trade to the land of the Ohio State Buckeyes.
- jhawk59

Who said anything about Sharp? I was talking a possible destination to move a defenseman to.

Great analysis but bc of the depth that Isles have at C doesn't mean 1 would be moved. Also if Frans gets moved its prob for a top 4 defensive Dman. Isles have to many type's of Leddy's in system and on team. I think that Snow is trying to trade Bailey and/or Grabner 1st before Frans even gets considered. If you look at the SCF both Kings & Rangers had 4 C that rolled 4 lines which seems to be the common recipe for advancing ( from an offensive perspective ).
- Ur Not Me

Now your response makes a lot of sense. There are two offensive #1 round drafts dmen trying to break in plus deHahn, so why would they want Leddy. They want a top four dman but do not want to trade Neilsen. Might be difficult moving something of value other than Nielsen. If I were Snow I would not trade Neilsen. As for why, see wiz post. I wish that I could say that Rosival was a patch who Bowman trades to NYI.

Scouts have to determine if Rosy has slowed down too much. He is injured or sits out a lot, so when Rosy played sometimes last season he looked slow. Have to ask if he just was a bit out of shape or not in sync. But yes others have said that Rosy has lost a step. Again, any team trading for Rosy should have scouts give an evaluation if he has slowed down too much. Probably not if he is just a patch? If i wre another teams GM and I was considering Rosy, I would wait until after preseason and see if Chi would pick up half the tab on Rosy. If that is a bad strategy for another GM, then go ahead and tell me so, I might be overlooking something!

Eh, that's just really not true. Clutterbuck is a bad possession player, has never had a positive +/- season in his career, and hasn't reached 30 points in his last 4 seasons.

Even comparing Clutterbuck's 2011-2012 (his best overall season in terms of possession and points) to 2014 Kruger, Smith, Shaw, and Bickell (most common 4 in the bottom 6), they still come out on top in terms in most categories. Bickell is the only one to have significantly less points than him in comparison while Shaw was over 10 points higher and Kruger and Smith were about even. And Kruger and Smith did that while facing tougher quality of competition. 3 of those 4 guys are also cheaper, too.

So no, I don't think it's fair to say Clutterbuck is better than most in our bottom 6.
- L_B_R

Bicks shouldn't be a bottom six guy

My point is I think he would take less to stay here. If Andy (frank)ing Macdonald can get 5 a year, Oduya can get close to that on the OPEN market. I don't know why but I just have a feeling he would prefer to finish his career here. Since its his last contract most likely, I couldn't blame him for getting the most he can.

He could be at a stage in his career, not saying its the case, where he just wants to play in a place that best suits his skills and in a place he wants to.
- Elbows15

Perhaps that's what Bowman is trying to figure out - if Oduya wants to stay and can be affordable? Perhaps he's doing the same thing with Leddy? Maybe Bowman is trying to figure out which of the two is going to be the better extension to hand out, and will trade the other?

Either player could be extended by Bowman this summer. That's if Bowman is looking to even do that?

sharp, leddy, versteeg,prospect or pick to arizona for vermette and yandle
TT starts in the Rock - i think that fits cap issue

Perhaps that's what Bowman is trying to figure out - if Oduya wants to stay and can be affordable? Perhaps he's doing the same thing with Leddy? Maybe Bowman is trying to figure out which of the two is going to be the better extension to hand out, and will trade the other?

Either player could be extended by Bowman this summer. That's if Bowman is looking to even do that?
- EKolb13

Maybe the market isn't what people think for Leaddope?

Maybe the market isn't what people think for Leaddope?
- Elbows15

Could be?

sharp, leddy, versteeg,prospect or pick to arizona for vermette and yandle
TT starts in the Rock - i think that fits cap issue
- dpard

change vermette to hanzal and get er done.

sharp, leddy, versteeg,prospect or pick to arizona for vermette and yandle
TT starts in the Rock - i think that fits cap issue
- dpard

Coyoytes might be trying some kids up front and also with Gagner around, they are looking deep and as strong as ever at centerice. Phoenix blog writer, Tanner, projects Vermette as a shut down #3 center. Actually Vermetee would be a great fit in whatever way he is used for some team. But I doubt that Phoenix is moving him.

Bicks shouldn't be a bottom six guy
- southernhawk

That's where he's played his entire career, save some of the playoffs. And honestly, 2014 Bickell is the only one that came in under best!Clutterbuck in comparison (points, not possession #s), so he was the only one somewhat helping your argument that Clutterbuck > Hawks bottom 6. Clutterbuck isn't Tanner Glass, but he's still not that good.

Not sorry to say, but Clutterbuck is the type of player that is good for some goals but will be on the ice for more of them and has a lot of hits because he rarely has the puck.

No one is going to trade for Rozsival and I am fine with that. He gets trashed unfairly on this board. The difference in salary between Oduya and Leaddope is 600 K. And its my feeling ODuya will sign a contract for around what he makes now. Something like 3-4 years @3.5 to 3.75 a years. And Oduya will still be an effective player for that contract. And better than Leddy. And the cost will be about the same.

You go with the better player. Always.
- Elbows15

No chance oduya signs a same figure salary. Absolutely no chance. Have you seen the d man Ufa market? He's going to get at least 5 million and may offer the Hawks 4.5-4.75 for longer term. He's not Jesus Christ. He can be replaced.

And yes, rozsival needs to go. He'd old, slow, and blocking a roster spot. He's this upcoming years handzus.

Leddy may fetch you more because of the could be and pending Rea status but you have to listen to on oduya.

I'm just ecstatic teuvo will start in Rockford so all these clowns thinking he's ready now can get a reality check. Far from it.

Perhaps that's what Bowman is trying to figure out - if Oduya wants to stay and can be affordable? Perhaps he's doing the same thing with Leddy? Maybe Bowman is trying to figure out which of the two is going to be the better extension to hand out, and will trade the other?

Either player could be extended by Bowman this summer. That's if Bowman is looking to even do that?
- EKolb13

Odds ar3 he's listening on both and weighing tye returns. No way oduya is not looking for a big contract and not taking a raise. Zero.

change vermette to hanzal and get er done.
- Elbows15

I see your point
With Hossa having back problems the past couple of years, he may be a year away from 3rd line duty - do you trade him instead of sharp????

No chance oduya signs a same figure salary. Absolutely no chance. Have you seen the d man Ufa market? He's going to get at least 5 million and may offer the Hawks 4.5-4.75 for longer term. He's not Jesus Christ. He can be replaced.

And yes, rozsival needs to go. He'd old, slow, and blocking a roster spot. He's this upcoming years handzus.

Leddy may fetch you more because of the could be and pending Rea status but you have to listen to on oduya.

I'm just ecstatic teuvo will start in Rockford so all these clowns thinking he's ready now can get a reality check. Far from it.
- SteveRain

Read what I said. And you know as much about it as I do.

Ok.
I am only trying to look at every player on every team without being a hawk fan-boy, becasue surely i have a long list of players I really really like that I would love to see on the hawks, including Kesler for years.

Last season, Tavares goes down at the Olympics.
This leaves the Islanders in the unenviable position of now losing their best goal scoring centre (after they disrupted their scoring lines, trading Moulson for Vanek) and after it happened Nielsen scored 7 of his goals and 8 of his assists, and was a plus one.

Youngster centre Brock Nelson (drafted in the tarde Hawk draft slot in the exchange for Kevin hayes pick) was asked to step up and Nelson had 4 goals and 4 assists. Rookie Ryan Strome had six goals and eight assist.

Young vet Josh Bailey failed ot produce at centre and was basically used as a winger he had two goals and 17 assists. makes maybe far too much money to warrant him sticking around and centre is no longer in his future.
Casey Cizikas is viewed as a low end checker at centre and had one goal and one assist after the Tavares injury

Note: all the stats above are post Tavares injury.

Free Agency

Islander add centre Mikhail Grabovski, who is what he is a off the side close to the net tip in tap scorer who they envision as a 2nd line centre - scorer/PP guy.
They add Nikolai Kulemin who no matter waht anyone is a LW period.
They add 5' 8" Cory Conacher who may be listed as a centre but for all intents and purposes lines up at RW for those four big goals he scored in Ottawa this year.

They way I see their free agency they added a centre and now have the option of letting one of their two youngsters Brock Nelson and Ryan Strome playe LW and RW respectively while they learn, abd are NOT tading them.

You look up and down that Islander lineup and you a need for both a young puck carrying defenseman and a big time NHL scorer, if they want to attempt to get better now.

After looking at the post Tavares loss numbers I don't see Nielsen as way out.
He is generously six foot, and does his best as 200 foot gamer but he did come and he did fill on top line with Thomas Vanek and Kyle Okposo on his wings...

You think he is available?
That getting Mikhail Grabovski makes him expendable so Nelson and Strome continue to on the job train and they don't keep his offense around to make sure they are solid at the position?

So there is the rub...

If the Islanders think Leddy is an answer, you think he NOW suddenly leapfrogs Richards and Kruger is our 4th line centre and that solves the Kings????

If you think Sharp is gonna get Brooklyn to the playoffs, you think Nielsen fills a need right now, because after two more seasons imagine what he commands on a market (he makes 275,000 now) where David Legwand a 3rd liner got three million a year.
So what is Nielsen a two year fill and the cost a REAL NHL scorer?

It's not like I came to my opinion through my arse, or just came online to down you guys, but things have to make sense to me, and I think this is past happening after the signed Richards at a bargain rate.


and sure, the Rangers would love a Leddy typr carrier, but there is absolutely nothing on that roster cap wise that fits the Hawks .
you can conjure a RFA Brassard comig to hawks but he made 3.2 million already.

If they are talking ...it is thank you to Slats for buying out Richards. And no one put Dominic Moore on a pedestal either.
- wiz1901

I'm not sure if I'm understanding everything so forgive me if I misread. I know you've said before that Sharp is still a very valuable high end scorer. It's almost certain that Sharp will have to go this year or next year to make the cap work in 2015/16. I just don't get why other teams wouldn't be willing to give up something of value say Nielsen or Eller and Tinordi for someone like Sharp who is also very valuable to another team?

It's of my opinion that trading Sharp for a decent center, prospect, and cap space would be worth it for this year and the future. Sharp finished the playoffs on the third line and was not all that productive so I think the Hawks could find someone to fill the role while improving their center play and being able to roll 4 lines this year. As well as allow them to continue to roster a team with decent depth once Toews and Kane are the two highest paid players in the league on the same team.

Lastly, before people talk about Sharp's NTC, it's a limited NTC. I don't know the specifics of it, but I have to imagine that its not THAT difficult to move him or get him to waive it to a reasonable destination.