about as well as Bernier did after the olympic break
- the_eye

He must have been playing injured
-glucker

Bernier had a some pretty soft goals every game too. my favourite being the one that bounced off the boards and slipped past him with no one around.
- Steeltownleafs

that's the one that hit his skate and in it went.
Bernier's leach was a lot longer than Reimer was.

true about the backup role.
agree that Bernier does handle to puck better but he was never a #1 goalie in the nhl Reimer was.
Reimer play at the beginning of the year was good no?
- zazzle[/quote]
Yeah he was excellent but Bernier was better technically, played a calmer style, and had rebound control.
But Reimers style is the opposite of calm, and has no rebound control but he fought like a mad man to keep that puck out.

that's the one that hit his skate and in it went.
Bernier's leach was a lot longer than Reimer was.
- zazzle

Their mind was made up.

But they had to somewhat give the impression that Reimer was given a chance, considering he lead the team to the playoffs the season before.

I still think Reimer may have some value, either as a backup or I still think he has a chance to rebound as a starter. He has shown some great play while getting hung out to dry by a bad Leafs team D. But I thought Bernier stood on his freaking head last year, if he didn't get injured he should have at least been mentioned in a Vezina conversation.

I still think Reimer may have some value, either as a backup or I still think he has a chance to rebound as a starter. He has shown some great play while getting hung out to dry by a bad Leafs team D. But I thought Bernier stood on his freaking head last year, if he didn't get injured he should have at least been mentioned in a Vezina conversation.
- Zezel

I think reamer will get more starts to showcase him to other teams to get some interest in him. I don't care if they end up keeping him if he can embrace the roll and play well when called upon. I like the guy but he has to take the bull by the horns somehow and not sulk.

Anyone hear what Nonis was asking for reamer. I thought I saw someplace that he wanted at least a 2nd round pick but to me if that was the case some teams would have taken that offer.

[quote=zazzle]true about the backup role.
agree that Bernier does handle to puck better but he was never a #1 goalie in the nhl Reimer was.
Reimer play at the beginning of the year was good no?
- Steeltownleafs[/

Yeah he was excellent but Bernier was better technically, played a calmer style, and had rebound control.
But Reimers style is the opposite of calm, and has no rebound control but he fought like a mad man to keep that puck out.


Dominik Hasek was like too.
the guy won what 5 vezinas or something like that. Now I'm not saying that Reimer will be the next Hasek just comparing the way they play.

2013-2014 Maple Leafs Relative Corsi

Players not retained (+ Orr and McLaren if sent down) in bold:

Player / CF% rel

Gardiner / +5.7%
Kadri / +3.7%
Bolland / +3.1%
Rielly / +2.8%
Franson / +2.6%
Kessel / +2.1%
Raymond / +1.9%
JVR / +1.9%
Holland / +0.7%
Bodie / +0.5%
Clarkson / +0.3%
Ranger / +0.2%
Bozak / +0.2%
Ashton / -0.7%
Lupul / -1.1%
Kulemin / -2.0%
Phaneuf / -2.8%
McLaren / -3.1%
Frazer / -3.3%
Smith / -3.5%
Gunnarsson / -4.0%
Orr / -4.3%
McClement / -5.0%
Gleason / -5.2%
D'Amigo / -5.3%
Smithson / -10.7%

Are the Leafs making personnel decisions using advanced stats a little more than people give them credit for?

Dominik Hasek was like too.
the guy won what 5 vezinas or something like that. Now I'm not saying that Reimer will be the next Hasek just comparing the way they play.
- zazzle

I agree, I was going to mention that his style is comparable to Hasak, but was afraid how that would be received lol

Why bother keeping goalie stats then?
Let's throw it all down the drain and use opinions instead of the data we have at hand.


It's much more convenient anyway.
- Pecafan Fan

Stats are useful but don't tell the whole story if they're incomplete.

sv% without shot quality is an incomplete stat... Still useful for comparing players, but you need to take things like systems into consideration.

.920 in an all offense system is more impressive than .920 in a trap system, don't you think?

Their mind was made up.

But they had to somewhat give the impression that Reimer was given a chance, considering he lead the team to the playoffs the season before.
- Pecafan Fan

don't like the way it played out. Reimer was just as good as Bernier at the beginning of the season, but fell off as his responsibilities shrunk. And then he got thrown in at the end of the season completely cold, and was asked to save the team.

If Reimer was getting steadier starts, before Bernier's injury, I'm willing to bet he would have looked better.

2013-2014 Maple Leafs Relative Corsi

Players not retained (+ Orr and McLaren if sent down) in bold:

Player / CF% rel

Gardiner / +5.7%
Kadri / +3.7%
Bolland / +3.1%
Rielly / +2.8%
Franson / +2.6%
Kessel / +2.1%
Raymond / +1.9%
JVR / +1.9%
Holland / +0.7%
Bodie / +0.5%
Clarkson / +0.3%
Ranger / +0.2%
Bozak / +0.2%
Ashton / -0.7%
Lupul / -1.1%
Kulemin / -2.0%
Phaneuf / -2.8%
McLaren / -3.1%
Frazer / -3.3%
Smith / -3.5%
Gunnarsson / -4.0%
Orr / -4.3%
McClement / -5.0%
Gleason / -5.2%
D'Amigo / -5.3%
Smithson / -10.7%

Are the Leafs making personnel decisions using advanced stats a little more than people give them credit for?
- The Shrike

Don't defense-first guys tend to see worse corsi numbers though?

2013-2014 Maple Leafs Relative Corsi

Players not retained (+ Orr and McLaren if sent down) in bold:

Player / CF% rel

Gardiner / +5.7%
Kadri / +3.7%
Bolland / +3.1%
Rielly / +2.8%
Franson / +2.6%
Kessel / +2.1%
Raymond / +1.9%
JVR / +1.9%
Holland / +0.7%
Bodie / +0.5%
Clarkson / +0.3%
Ranger / +0.2%
Bozak / +0.2%
Ashton / -0.7%
Lupul / -1.1%
Kulemin / -2.0%
Phaneuf / -2.8%
McLaren / -3.1%
Frazer / -3.3%
Smith / -3.5%
Gunnarsson / -4.0%
Orr / -4.3%
McClement / -5.0%
Gleason / -5.2%
D'Amigo / -5.3%
Smithson / -10.7%

Are the Leafs making personnel decisions using advanced stats a little more than people give them credit for?
- The Shrike

Maybe, but McClements corsi is bad cause of the role he is asked to play as well as being over played.
But I do love how it shows Kadri & Gardiners importance to this team

Maybe, but McClements corsi is bad cause of the role he is asked to play as well as being over played.
But I do love how it shows Kadri & Gardiners importance to this team
- Steeltownleafs

look at the distribution of the +s and -s though...

Only one defense first guy with a +(Bolland), and only one offense first guy with a -(Lupul).

Hell, even Clarkson was a +

don't like the way it played out. Reimer was just as good as Bernier at the beginning of the season, but fell off as his responsibilities shrunk. And then he got thrown in at the end of the season completely cold, and was asked to save the team.

If Reimer was getting steadier starts, before Bernier's injury, I'm willing to bet he would have looked better.
- Feeling Glucky?

Absolutely, and I swear Reimer played with a concussion for the last 12 or so games of the year but played as an attempt to take his starting job back

don't like the way it played out. Reimer was just as good as Bernier at the beginning of the season, but fell off as his responsibilities shrunk. And then he got thrown in at the end of the season completely cold, and was asked to save the team.

If Reimer was getting steadier starts, before Bernier's injury, I'm willing to bet he would have looked better.
- Feeling Glucky?

After a few games then he isn't completely cold anymore, and should have played better. I felt sorry for him because I think he wanted to be 'the guy' then but our team D was so bad that the poor guy was left out to dry.

I think this year we will be a better all round team that is more D responsible which should make it easier on the goaltenders.

look at the distribution of the +s and -s though...

Only one defense first guy with a +(Bolland), and only one offense first guy with a -(Lupul).

Hell, even Clarkson was a +
- Feeling Glucky?

That's cause Clarkson was suspended for half the year, and wasn't asked to kill penalties

Seriously, fellas - Bernier was just flat-out better than Reimer last year. It wasn't even close.

Reimer is too inconsistent, and he's the only goalie in the history of the NHL who can't hold onto a puck shot into his catcher.

He is on a bus to Backupville - he just doesn't know it yet.

Trade him. You won't get anything for him (you never do for goalies). Let him figure out his place in the universe with another team.

I wish him well. But his usefulness to us is waning.

Seriously, fellas - Bernier was just flat-out better than Reimer last year. It wasn't even close.

Reimer is too inconsistent, and he's the only goalie in the history of the NHL who can't hold onto a puck shot into his catcher.

He is on a bus to Backupville - he just doesn't know it yet.

Trade him. You won't get anything for him (you never do for goalies). Let him figure out his place in the universe with another team.

I wish him well. But his usefulness to us is waning.
- Atomic Wedgie

Bernier had a great 1st full year of playing, he will regress this coming season as all players do, making Reimer valuable as a "back up" especially if an injury crops up.

Seriously, fellas - Bernier was just flat-out better than Reimer last year. It wasn't even close.

Reimer is too inconsistent, and he's the only goalie in the history of the NHL who can't hold onto a puck shot into his catcher.

He is on a bus to Backupville - he just doesn't know it yet.

Trade him. You won't get anything for him (you never do for goalies). Let him figure out his place in the universe with another team.

I wish him well. But his usefulness to us is waning.
- Atomic Wedgie

Reimer had his big chance when Bernier went down with injury, and he fell flat on his face. The fact that they went back to an injured Bernier when they had a healthy Reimer speaks volumes.

If you average out Santorelli's numbers over a full season they are about the same as Raymond, so it is in theory a wash there.
- LeafMan

Numbers yes, but Santorelli isn't as soft and as prone to giveaways as Raymond was.
Better all around player, potentially. Every Canuck fan here praised his work ethic and drive. I hope he stays healthy...

Maybe, but McClements corsi is bad cause of the role he is asked to play as well as being over played.
But I do love how it shows Kadri & Gardiners importance to this team
- Steeltownleafs

By the sounds of it, Gardiner and Kadri were the first two names other GM's brought up whenever they talked to Sam the Slayer. Fortunately, he's a little more patient than most of us.

Numbers yes, but Santorelli isn't as soft and as prone to giveaways as Raymond was.
Better all around player, potentially. Every Canuck fan here praised his work ethic and drive. I hope he stays healthy...
- Liger4

Raymond had world class speed, but played a perimeter game that's a detriment when you're expected to generate energy and burn up minutes in the offensive zone.

I hope that we can establish a cycle game and zone time in our bottom 6, however it ends up looking.

Raymond had world class speed, but played a perimeter game that's a detriment when you're expected to generate energy and burn up minutes in the offensive zone.

I hope that we can establish a cycle game and zone time in our bottom 6, however it ends up looking.
- gravyface

I completely agree. I think the bottom six is looking stronger, and more skilled than last year... (as Bolland was out most of the year) Hopefully they let the 4th line actually play, and don't revert to 4 minutes a game with Orr and Co. gooning it up.
I'm actually looking forward to seeing Holland get some ice time.

I completely agree. I think the bottom six is looking stronger, and more skilled than last year... (as Bolland was out most of the year) Hopefully they let the 4th line actually play, and don't revert to 4 minutes a game with Orr and Co. gooning it up.
I'm actually looking forward to seeing Holland get some ice time.
- Liger4

Yes, people seem to forget that Bolland had a marginal impact on the team last year: he looked every bit the tweener 2/3 center Nonis bragged about in the first month of the year, but when he returned, he looked awkward and was for the most part ineffective.

I'm excited to see some center depth for a change as Santorelli, Kontiola, Holland, and even Komarov can all play center or the wing.

We've essentially played with a shortened bench the entire time Randy has been here; let's hope that this changes next year and we actually roll 4 lines.