I am really surprised to hear you say that.

I agree with the assessment of Koivu as a player and what he was asked to do.

Obviously I don't know nearly what I think I know about Habs players or the fans views. I always thought Koivu was a heart and soul guy and fan favourite and team favourite with the Habs.

Phaneuf seems to be universally disliked by fans and players alike.
- Aetherial

Most fans loved Koivu, but he had a lot of detractors because of how bad the Habs were during his tenure as a captain. Which is unfair considering how bad those habs teams were at the time.

But yeah, Phaneuf seems to be a lot more polarizing in that regard, but his situation isn't all that different. He's asked to do too much for what he can provide to a team.

Holy Crap. if they are worse like you say then be happy you will get a great draft pick, if they are better they will compete for a playoff spot, the whole idea to play the games is to compete to get into the playoffs. If they fall short then so be it.

You can female dog and moan that is not enough but every team's goal at the start of the season is to make the playoffs and a chance to compete for the cup.
- LeafMan

people are saying they are better. Im saying they're worse. How is that whining? Whining would be complaining about what they could have done but didn't. Im simply stating my view and im fine with tanking (they are obviously tanking, nothing else explains the moves made).

Im 33 and ive seen 4 confernce finals and several miserable seasons. Whats one or 2 more?

yeah, that's what I saw from Dreger.
- Pecafan Fan

Were there any $$$ numbers mentioned ?

Were there any $$$ numbers mentioned ?
- .HOHO.

Not that I saw.

Most fans loved Koivu, but he had a lot of detractors because of how bad the Habs were during his tenure as a captain. Which is unfair considering how bad those habs teams were at the time.

But yeah, Phaneuf seems to be a lot more polarizing in that regard, but his situation isn't all that different. He's asked to do too much for what he can provide to a team.
- Pecafan Fan

So was Sundin

and so is Kessel

guys asked to basically carry bad teams on their shoulders

you are hilarious.

you are not far off, but your attitude is brutal.
- big_dion

again give me an example of whining? How is it brutal? I think they are tanking. Why else wouldn't you sign mcclemant for a mil? He's no star but always up there in PK minutes even before he came to TO. With last year's roster i wasn't calling for a top 5 pick, but they needed help. They went the other way and somehow on here people say they're better? You don't finish 8th from the bottom and do nothing but lose guys and get better.

But because im not calling playoffs im whining or have a bad attitude?

Sanity, just searching for my sanity.. Have you seen it around ?
- bixll

Turn right onto that logging road...turn another right.....up 2kms on the left...follow the treeline 400 yards...and bring your guitar....and me

So was Sundin

and so is Kessel

guys asked to basically carry bad teams on their shoulders
- Aetherial

Pretty much.

And then take the blame when the team misses the playoffs.

people are saying they are better. Im saying they're worse. How is that whining? Whining would be complaining about what they could have done but didn't. Im simply stating my view and im fine with tanking (they are obviously tanking, nothing else explains the moves made).

Im 33 and ive seen 4 confernce finals and several miserable seasons. Whats one or 2 more?
- clark_griswold

I remember some epic battles between the Leafs and the Broadstreet Bullies ... especially when the Leafs got Scott Garland, Kurt Walker and Tiger Williams

Were there any $$$ numbers mentioned ?
- .HOHO.

For Legwand? It is rumoured to be a 1 year 4 mil offer.

again give me an example of whining? How is it brutal? I think they are tanking. Why else wouldn't you sign mcclemant for a mil? He's no star but always up there in PK minutes even before he came to TO. With last year's roster i wasn't calling for a top 5 pick, but they needed help. They went the other way and somehow on here people say they're better? You don't finish 8th from the bottom and do nothing but lose guys and get better.

But because im not calling playoffs im whining or have a bad attitude?
- clark_griswold

The Leafs PK was 28th in the league last season... maybe he wasn't/isn't all that good at killing penalties?

So, Legwand?





Makes sense.
- Pecafan Fan

I think it would be a decent stop gap...cap hit dependent.

Turn right onto that logging road...turn another right.....up 2kms on the left...follow the treeline 400 yards...and bring your guitar....and me
- jimi james

Perfect, you nailed it.. That is my sanity..

Dion was a number 1 on a playoff team last year.

And prior to Bernier getting injured, was going to be a #1 d-man on a playoff team this season too.

But, ignore facts.

Pessimirealism! WOOO!!
- Feeling Glucky?

During a 48 game season....dont you get it!!!!
If you think Bernier's injury is the only reason they didnt make the playoffs, than you simply cant be helped.
AFter 48 games this past season they had a playoff spot.
After 48 games the season prior to the shortened season, they had a playoff spot.
But what did they have after 82 games? In the past 10 years, what year, after completing 82 regular season games, did they have a playoff spot?
You relate everything back to a 48 game season..........the leafs are decent up 50 games (the past couple of years)

In recent years the leafs have reversed how they use to play. They now fall apart during the stretch run (final 20 games or so). about 6 - 7 years ago , they would be crap all year and turn it on the final 20 games or so.
But they have yet to complete an 82 game season without collasping somewhere during it.....often a couple of times.
So yes, Dion played in the number 1 spot on a team that made the playoffs during a 48 game season which collasped in game 7.

When he is able to play the number 1 spot (play it well) while his team makes the playoffs for consecutive years in a row after an 82 game season, then we'll talk.
Like I posted earlier, Dion needs a quality partner to take his minutes away and make him look good.

I need a taco!

For Legwand? It is rumoured to be a 1 year 4 mil offer.
- LeafMan

I could live with around that.

again give me an example of whining? How is it brutal? I think they are tanking. Why else wouldn't you sign mcclemant for a mil? He's no star but always up there in PK minutes even before he came to TO. With last year's roster i wasn't calling for a top 5 pick, but they needed help. They went the other way and somehow on here people say they're better? You don't finish 8th from the bottom and do nothing but lose guys and get better.

But because im not calling playoffs im whining or have a bad attitude?
- clark_griswold

moreso just the way you are going about it.

do i think the leafs are goona be great next year? i dont think so, i think bernier will have to be better than last season...our d is mildly better, but forwards i think we lost some depth overall.

hopefully a better 2 way play, but the bottom line is, we still have the same coach and the same style of play, which these players are not going to play.

everyone has their views, it doesnt mean anyone is more right than anyone else.

I ordered an iPad on eBay. It shipped from Florida to Ohio, and from there to Kentucky.

Seems odd.

The Leafs PK was 28th in the league last season... maybe he wasn't/isn't all that good at killing penalties?
- Pecafan Fan

he was given too much ice time with the C injuries IMO.

again give me an example of whining? How is it brutal? I think they are tanking. Why else wouldn't you sign mcclemant for a mil? He's no star but always up there in PK minutes even before he came to TO. With last year's roster i wasn't calling for a top 5 pick, but they needed help. They went the other way and somehow on here people say they're better? You don't finish 8th from the bottom and do nothing but lose guys and get better.

But because im not calling playoffs im whining or have a bad attitude?
- clark_griswold

If he would've stayed, he would've wanted more. It's only because of the stark reality that for each day you go unsigned as aging 4th liner, the harder it is to land a deal. That's where FA can really pay off (like it did for us with Raymond and McClement), veteran/depth guys on the cheap.

Turn right onto that logging road...turn another right.....up 2kms on the left...follow the treeline 400 yards...and bring your guitar....and me
- jimi james

I was just there and ya missed me! Figured you'd respond to me on fb about meeting up for a beer

thats a blow mind
- big_dion

that is pretty awesome.

I ordered an iPad on eBay. It shipped from Florida to Ohio, and from there to Kentucky.

Seems odd.
- Feeling Glucky?

Apple has a big deal on them plus a free gift card, go the reputable route, lol.

Big concern on the roster as it sits, two penalty killers at forward, actually only one full timer in Komarov and one part timer in JVR, I can see why the Leafs are interested in Legwand.
- LeafMan

At the right price, he would be a good addition IMO.

The Leafs PK was 28th in the league last season... maybe he wasn't/isn't all that good at killing penalties?
- Pecafan Fan

he was good before he got here and good the first year. Last year wasn't his best but the guy played way too much. I dont' see a replacement at all, and that bodes not well for the 28th PK

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