I'd rather trade him after they find out about those kids than before.
- hardnosed

Martin hasn't exactly been durable. His value will never be higher than it is right now.

Moving Martin now brings back a piece that will help the team this season. He is more valuable to this team at the deadline then what he would bring back. At the deadline, he would return picks and/or prospects, which would not help this team in the stretch run/playoffs.

On a different note, forget about Pouliot. He will not sniff the Pens lineup this year. Without the luxury of a training camp, and with all the young depth the Pens have a defense, he will be better suited spending the year in WBS.
- cap1681

no reason to think he would only fetch picks/pospects. trade him in a hockey trade to a contender in the west that needs d and has excess o.

Pretty sure Guroux has the method of how to go wrong well documented.
- Guile

This is actually pretty quality stuff!

no reason to think he would only fetch picks/pospects. trade him in a hockey trade to a contender in the west that needs d and has excess o.
- ChrisMS

You rarely see "hockey trades" at the deadline, especially for a rental.

The only thing positive about this is Downie was brought in to protect Sid's and Geno's ass from Claudia.
- Oneonta Penguin

Reluctantly admitting that I had an actual LOL when I read this...

maybe people are just getting smarter about sports these days.
- ChrisMS

Yea like in football where you're no longer allowed to hit the head so leg injuries have gone way up. Or baseball where you're not allowed to stand near home plate. Sports are being ruined. People suck. Let every kid make the team. Please

You rarely see "hockey trades" at the deadline, especially for a rental.
- cap1681

And a contender giving up a rental

you made my point. If he has a monster year then he is more valuable to the pens chances at a cup than whatever we get in a trade. if he has a decent year, but so does ehrhoff, letang, youngsters, then it gives you options. and players are worth more at the deadline than in the summer. for example, look at kesler. nucks get a better deal with sutter/despres/1stat the deadline than they did in the offseason. hey, maybe ehrhoff is the one traded at the deadline? or despres?
- ChrisMS

We battle quite a bit, but we actually do have similar views on many occasions. I don't see Ehrhoff as a guy that gets dealt. I see him as a guy that is given an extension before free agency hits next year once its apparent Martin won't be back.

You rarely see "hockey trades" at the deadline, especially for a rental.
- cap1681

rarely isn't never. if picks prospects come back, than picks prospects could go out for our own rental

My problem with this line-up is that there is nobody in the bottom 6 who can move up and play top 6 if/when there is an injury. Signing a top 6 guy and moving Bennett or Dupuis to the 3rd line gives you that flexibility.
- cap1681

Agreed but they only have so much to spend.

I have no issue with this being the roster they start with. Lots of moving pieces and, more importantly, lots of flexibility at the deadline and even during the season.

If one of the young D knock it out of the park in training camp, they can always consider moving Martin. If none of the young D emerge, let Martin play it out and walk at season's end. You get Erhoff for a test drive for a season.

They also have forward flexibility as well. Lots of options at center. Good mix of skill, grit, experience.

They didn't overpay for Kulemin. I think anything beyond $3 mill per was a risk contract. Good for them on passing on him. Malkin doesn't need star wingers to shine. In fact, I think he does better when he has to dominate the puck. PLus, no more deferring to Neal.

On a 1 to 10 happiness scale, I'm at around a 7.5 or so.

no reason to think he would only fetch picks/pospects. trade him in a hockey trade to a contender in the west that needs d and has excess o.
- ChrisMS

Hockey trades don't seem to happen too frequently at the deadline. No team wanting Martin at the deadline and those being play-off chasers or Cup contenders, are going to trade a young good budding roster player for Paul Martin, who would be a rental. You get picks and prospects, or another rental.

You won't with Martin and Scuderi in the line-up.
- cap1681

Sure you will. There's one spot wide open already, and there'll be one more wide open until Maatta returns. One more if Scuderi continues to suck, they won't be married to keeping him in the lineup this year if he's ineffective.

That is a very dangerous game. You stand a better chance getting a young top six forward type, or one that can turn into one now than at the deadline.
- Oneonta Penguin

At the deadline you could very likely get a 1st round pick, which I'd rather have than some team's unwanted prospect now.

Point was, making statements like trade him now or never fails to take into account all the variables that a regular season brings. As I said, there are a multitude of scenarios where keeping him now but trading him at the deadline makes sense.

Yea like in football where you're no longer allowed to hit the head so leg injuries have gone way up. Or baseball where you're not allowed to stand near home plate. Sports are being ruined. People suck. Let every kid make the team. Please
- lloyd095

how about let every kid walk away from the game without life changing injuries. sports are evolving and its gonna have some bumps in the road. sports are getting better. if you want to watch people get hurt watch nascar

At the deadline you could very likely get a 1st round pick, which I'd rather have than some team's unwanted prospect now.

Point was, making statements like trade him now or never fails to take into account all the variables that a regular season brings. As I said, there are a multitude of scenarios where keeping him now but trading him at the deadline makes sense.
- hardnosed

theres no way to predict what the best thing to do is, if they get a great offer now i cant imagine theyd turn it down...variables as you say in the regular season could honestly make his trade value go down, he could get hurt, or just be lousy, not to mention that team is only using him as a rental most likely, and any contender isnt going to be giving that much of their playoff bound team to get such rental...

We battle quite a bit, but we actually do have similar views on many occasions. I don't see Ehrhoff as a guy that gets dealt. I see him as a guy that is given an extension before free agency hits next year once its apparent Martin won't be back.
- Oneonta Penguin

overall point is JR is setting the team up to evaluate during the first few months and is giving himself options to make changes where they are needed

Sure you will. There's one spot wide open already, and there'll be one more wide open until Maatta returns. One more if Scuderi continues to suck, they won't be married to keeping him in the lineup this year if he's ineffective.
- hardnosed

Exactly this.

A few guys playing for 1 or two spots...Depres' time is now or never.

At the deadline you could very likely get a 1st round pick, which I'd rather have than some team's unwanted prospect now.

Point was, making statements like trade him now or never fails to take into account all the variables that a regular season brings. As I said, there are a multitude of scenarios where keeping him now but trading him at the deadline makes sense.
- hardnosed

He could get hurt in the 1st game and be out for the season. Would rather get something to bolster the top 6 now.

Sure you will. There's one spot wide open already, and there'll be one more wide open until Maatta returns. One more if Scuderi continues to suck, they won't be married to keeping him in the lineup this year if he's ineffective.
- hardnosed

Letang-Martin
Ehrhoff-Bortuzzo
Scuderi-????

One spot for 4 guys, and once Maatta comes back, there's nothing.

It think old man Rutherford mixed up his words.. He said pens need top 9 help but it looks like bottom 9 is all he is signing... he'll make that bottom 6... we all botched about having a team with all 3rd 4th liners and most of you are happy with him building a team of 3rd and 4th liners because he got them cheap... I'm all for low cap low length contracts but wtf....

I just don't see his master plan here.... OK he got a top 6 guy when he traded a top 6 guy but cmon... is he really betting on kapanen making team to not go after an elite winger for sid or even geno bf who he puts up pts with everytime they play...

I'm sorry I just don't understand until there is another trade or something....

Sorry I don't look at the corsi as much and understand if this is the money ball team of hockey. Almost everything I have read from tiops and MolinariPG et all is saying JR really didn't help out the team... but yes I am very thankful he didn't bring any off the ufas back

You heard it here first...Claude's new nickname...Mr. Whipple

how about let every kid walk away from the game without life changing injuries. sports are evolving and its gonna have some bumps in the road. sports are getting better. if you want to watch people get hurt watch nascar
- ChrisMS

A bit dramatic... These guys get paid to play a sport and paid well. I think they understand the risk/reward of it. You can't take being physical out of sports.

Letang-Martin
Ehrhoff-Bortuzzo
Scuderi-????

One spot for 4 guys, and once Maatta comes back, there's nothing.
- cap1681

Hopefully, they'd sit Scuds if a better option presented itself.

He could get hurt in the 1st game and be out for the season. Would rather get something to bolster the top 6 now.
- cap1681

another teams top pairing defenseman could get hurt in the 1st game of the season leaving them desperate. making getting an actual top 6 return more likely

At the deadline you could very likely get a 1st round pick, which I'd rather have than some team's unwanted prospect now.

Point was, making statements like trade him now or never fails to take into account all the variables that a regular season brings. As I said, there are a multitude of scenarios where keeping him now but trading him at the deadline makes sense.
- hardnosed

Some very good prospects have gone at the deadline. I would rather take a close to being ready made forward prospect than a mid to late first round pick that you have to wait on for two, three or four years at least.

We have a glaring spot in our lineup; up to the cap and won't be able to keep him. Teams will trade more for Martin now knowing they would have a full year, not 20 games. If we didn't have younger options like Dumoullin, Samuelsson, Harrington, Pouliot once he gets back to health, I'd say wait and deal him.