As in Adding a Third Line that Can score so that Komorov and Orr if he's still around and Holland can be our 4th line.. throw lievo or another marile on a third line with say Legwand and seteguchi and boom not a terrible fix for our 3rd and 4th lines!
- lmrick76

I thin Orr will probably be out. A 3rd of 4th line centre (Santorelli)? and a 4th line einger (Fiddler/Winnik)? may happen along with another d move. Reimer and Franson out. Holland, Leivo and Granberg most likely make the Leafs, maybe one more Marlie. Glad to see some Marlies on the roster finally.

Ive been a leaf fan for decades......nothing to be happy about.

Well concerning the leafs that is. Luckily they take up a very very small percentage of my life.
- Fakepartofme

I just envision you walking around with your cane hitting children as you pass.

Komarov?
- ILoveLamp

I had him on there and when I went to paste a player's name it got removed, my bad.

I thin Orr will probably be out. A 3rd of 4th line centre (Santorelli)? and a 4th line einger (Fiddler/Winnik)? may happen along with another d move. Reimer and Franson out. Holland, Leivo and Granberg most likely make the Leafs, maybe one more Marlie. Glad to see some Marlies on the roster finally.
- walshyleafsfan

With the addition of Frattin, I don't really see a spot for Leivo in the top 9. He's a skilled player, not a grinder, so playing him 4th line is not the right move.

Best to give him top line duties on the Marlies and bring him up when someone goes down.

I forget who made the point, but they just made themselves harder to play against. You can expect robidas to steady, and Polak will make sure Berny sees the shots. I think they are hoping Frattin still has chemistry with Naz and if he doesn't who care D'Amigo wasn't going to make it anyways. And Komarov... Already the fan favorite..
- Arctic_AARDVARK

It'll be interesting, to say the least.

I thin Orr will probably be out. A 3rd of 4th line centre (Santorelli)? and a 4th line einger (Fiddler/Winnik)? may happen along with another d move. Reimer and Franson out. Holland, Leivo and Granberg most likely make the Leafs, maybe one more Marlie. Glad to see some Marlies on the roster finally.
- walshyleafsfan

Is it just me or am I the only one that Thinks that the Leafs will trade one of their top 6 forwards...I can See lupul going or Kadri going. This team Barely made the Playoffs 2 years ago and failed to do it last Season...I think Shanahan wants to remold this team a little more than just adding a defense that can actually play defense.

I truly believe that Nonis and Carlyle are bottom-5 coach/GM duo in the league.

Add in the fact that the our core players have absolutely zero heart and I really wonder where the culture change comes from.

A 37 year old D man?
A 3rd/4th liner who runs around and hits but doesn't score much?
Trading one Dman for a not-better Dman and throwing in a draft pick?
Bringing back a 3rd/4th line forward by trading another 3rd/4th line forward?

Can you imagine if the Leafs organization ran the Ontario Medical system? We would be putting bandaids on people in a coma... and paying a million bucks for each bandaid.

... come to think of it ...
- Aetherial

You're complaining just for the sake of it when you knock that trade. It was like a 4th for christ sakes and Gunnerson is a nobody.

But do I care, it was a joke..
- bixll

Hey, if you want to live in a world of ignorance then go right ahead.

The only time Ive agreed with anything the sun has said.
- Fakepartofme

With the way professional sports is now. Big names switching to rival teams. It is so refreshing to see someone say that they wont play for a hated team. It had nothing to do with the leafs being bad. He waived to buffalo for (frank) sakes. Steve simmons is an idiot. And proving it with that article

With the addition of Frattin, I don't really see a spot for Leivo in the top 9. He's a skilled player, not a grinder, so playing him 4th line is not the right move.

Best to give him top line duties on the Marlies and bring him up when someone goes down.
- ILoveLamp

Yeah good point. I think you have to reward the Marlies sooner rather than later though (to those who deserve it)

I'd like:

JVR Bozak Kessel
Lupul Kadri Leivo
Komorov Holland Clarkson
--- ---- Frattin
Ashton (who for some reason i'm starting to like. The kkid does everything to try and stay with the big club, including losing all respect for his nose)

Dion ---
Gardiner Robidas
Rielly Polak
Granberg

Bernier
---

Riemer and Franson gone. Couple of bottom 6 forwards still via FA. No idea how we get that top line Dman (preferably right handed)

You're complaining just for the sake of it when you knock that trade. It was like a 4th for christ sakes and Gunnerson is a nobody.
- Mr_Smokey

I don't mind Fans complaining. Heck it's fun.. but bring a reasonable solution. just don't complain.

Based on what was available what should Nonis have done differently.?

Is it just me or am I the only one that Thinks that the Leafs will trade one of their top 6 forwards...I can See lupul going or Kadri going. This team Barely made the Playoffs 2 years ago and failed to do it last Season...I think Shanahan wants to remold this team a little more than just adding a defense that can actually play defense.
- lmrick76

I'd imagine they would prefer to trade Lupul more than Kadri. Although i am not sure they would want to trade either unless it's for a top 6 center of top 2 dman, which probably wouldn't happen.

Some of you guys are more than irritating

With the way professional sports is now. Big names switching to rival teams. It is so refreshing to see someone say that they wont play for a hated team. It had nothing to do with the leafs being bad. He waived to buffalo for (frank) sakes. Steve simmons is an idiot. And proving it with that article
- Lee Denault

Absolutely. When you see Ellsbury going from the Sox to the Yankees.... WTF???

I know he a Yankees fan, but at least tell the Sox to (frank) off a lot earlier in your career you traitor.

Some of you guys are more than irritating
- Lee Denault

I think you irritated someone to the point of a long account ban yesterday.

they rely heavily on unsustainable play..which ends up correcting and you go on long losing streaks once the sv% and sh% tanks...

having good possession players and playing the game more in the other teams end..getting more shots and giving up less allows you to survive those down trends.

continually blaming Bernier getting injured as the reason they lost just puts blinders on..they sucked all season.. the standing were a mirage then.. the season is 82 games.
- senstroll

The fact is, on an intuitive AND observational level I agree with your conclusions about the Leafs.

What I want to see is someone take a serious look at *why* the stats may be wrong. Saying it is "luck" just isn't good enough. This is the advanced stats arguement:

100+ (67 games this past season) game sample where the Leafs performance belies the stats = luck

15 game sample where starting goalie is injured = Advanced stats are right

Yes, the season is 82 games and Colorado was ranked 27 in posession stats.

Further,
You mentioned earlier that the Leafs lost their best posession players and got worse as a result.

Would we have been worse if we had Partick Kane, or Claude Giroux, or Sidney Crosby on the team instead of MacArthur or Grabovski?

There are glaring exceptions to the advanced stats rules. That's OK, because they are still relatively new. I just wish someone would acknowledge that and starting working on a better model.

I'd imagine they would prefer to trade Lupul more than Kadri. Although i am not sure they would want to trade either unless it's for a top 6 center of top 2 dman, which probably wouldn't happen.
- walshyleafsfan

If they can get Josh Georges for the rights to franson...imagine what they could get if they threw in Lupul or kadri.

I'd imagine they would prefer to trade Lupul more than Kadri. Although i am not sure they would want to trade either unless it's for a top 6 center of top 2 dman, which probably wouldn't happen.
- walshyleafsfan

If they can get Josh Georges for the rights to franson...imagine what they could get if they threw in Lupul or kadri.

I think you irritated someone to the point of a long account ban yesterday.
- LeafMan

Yeah im not a fan of that clown

I think you irritated someone to the point of a long account ban yesterday.
- LeafMan

The bans were fruitful in here yesterday.

I know Bruce is happy, we added Robidas. And I'm happy, we added Polak. Bruce and I are on top of the world female doges!

In terms of looking at the remaining spots, Holland won't get anymore than the $850,500 QO he accepted, but if he's smart he takes two years at $750-800k now when he has a legit chance to prove himself (plus he's 4 years from UFA status).

Gardiner won't get a deal worth more than 2.75m against the cap, likely 2.5m 1st year and 3.0 2nd year, max.

So if we assume this and factor in Granberg and at least one other Marlie making the team (and Orr buried), we have 17 with 12.2m left, needing at minimum 2 more forwards (4th liners) and a backup keeper.

Absolutely. When you see Ellsbury going from the Sox to the Yankees.... WTF???

I know he a Yankees fan, but at least tell the Sox to (frank) off a lot earlier in your career you traitor.
- walshyleafsfan

And a reporter of steve simmons responsibility. This is pretty easy to figure out

I don't mind that we didn't sign any big names to stupid money.

But why did we sign a nobody to stupid money?

Komarov for almost $4 million a year X 4 years?

This is pure insanity.

you think thats what I am saying?
- senstroll

... no that is clearly not what you are saying.

What you did say was that the Leafs lost their best possession players and therefore got worse.

By that logic, the Leafs would be a worse team than 2013 if some of the best players in the game played for them, who had worse possession stats than MacArthur or Grabovski.

You cannot have your arguement one way and your advanced stats have some glaring exceptions/holes.