What your doing, like many is allowing your mind to run wild. Scratch him until he decides to leave? You didn't say it but another fan allowing his mind to run wild just did. Lecavalier didn't play well but was it the system he couldn't fit into or was he trying to play through injury? Perhaps both? If the injury was any part of it, then Lecavalier can definitely be better.
- SuperSchennBros

Lecavalier himself stated he was not injured at the end of the year and the back injury was NOT affecting him after the Olympics or in the playoffs.

I'm basing my comments on what I saw when Lecavalier played, a review of his statistical performance, using both traditional and non traditional stats, comments from the player, the new GM and coach in an effort to better understand their views on the player and their plans to shape the team in the future.

It's a guess, but it's not letting my mind run wild. I'm reading what was said, looking at the numbers and video and coming up with an idea of what could happen.

Do you guys think hextall makes a splash at the draft?
- ystoil

yes, i do. i think he slashes kent nilsson right in the face at the podium with a white vic.

Lecavalier himself stated he was not injured at the end of the year and the back injury was NOT affecting him after the Olympics or in the playoffs.

I'm basing my comments on what I saw when Lecavalier played, a review of his statistical performance, using both traditional and non traditional stats, comments from the player, the new GM and coach in an effort to better understand their views on the player and their plans to shape the team in the future.

It's a guess, but it's not letting my mind run wild. I'm reading what was said, looking at the numbers and video and coming up with an idea of what could happen.
- Jsaquella

So Lecavalier was completely healthy after having three different injuries including a bad back this season which often effect careers? Bull! Injuries along with age slow down players. John LeClair was never the same player again after sitting out almost an entire season with a back injury. Injuries efforted the player whether he admits it or not.

So Lecavalier was completely healthy after having three different injuries including a bad back this season which often effect careers? Bull! Injuries along with age slow down players. John LeClair was never the same player again after sitting out almost an entire season with a back injury. Injuries efforted the player whether he admits it or not.
- SuperSchennBros

Well, Lecavalier had two injuries. One was a facial laceration and the other was a broken bone in his back, which was a good deal different than the degenerative back injury that LeClair had, which required surgery and led to a staph infection and further issues.

Lecavalier didn't have surgery. He didn't have a degenerative condition. Compaing him to LeClair is apples and oranges.

And yes, Lecavalier had two injuries. The back strain was actually the same injury as the broken bone. The initial diagnosis was scrapped when further exams revealed the fracture.

So how do we deal him? What is the logical answer to my question?
- SuperSchennBros

If he doesn't waive, as you have stated, it is a moot point.

But you do whatever you have to -- take a bad contract back at a different slot, eat money, whatever.

But having him as the 4th-line center -- on merit, because of his skating and defense, and because the Flyers don't have the personnel to help hide those flaws -- is simply pointless.

If he doesn't waive, as you have stated, it is a moot point.

But you do whatever you have to -- take a bad contract back at a different slot, eat money, whatever.

But having him as the 4th-line center -- on merit, because of his skating and defense, and because the Flyers don't have the personnel to help hide those flaws -- is simply pointless.
- AllInForFlyers

Well, you do what you have to do, within reason.

They can't eat half the deal. They can't take on a worse contract.

Lecavalier is a bad fit here. They need to find a spot where he's willing to go, that can use him properly and is willing to make an acceptable deal. Who knows, maybe somebody really values Lecavalier. I've mentioned a few teams that could have a desire to add him.

Ideally he goes someplace that will give a bit of value for him, not require a ton of cash to be eaten and he can go play well and finish his career well.

Crazy thing is that I'm extremely optimistic they will win within the next couple of years. I trust Hextall and think Mason is the guy that can get them there. One or two pieces plus the maturation of the kids and this team is more then capable.
- Flyers1218

i want to believe this, and i think mason is capable - i've seen worse goalies win the (frank)ing cup. this is a big first offseason for hextal. big. [/img]

i want to believe this, and i think mason is capable - i've seen worse goalies win the (frank)ing cup. this is a big first offseason for hextal. big.
- hammarby31[/img]

It's big, but next offseason is bigger.

The cap will go up, he will have more ability to jettison guys that don't fit his vision and he will not have the benefit of being new at the gig.

If they have a good season and deep run in 2014-15, how will the pressure from above affect his plan?

If he doesn't waive, as you have stated, it is a moot point.

But you do whatever you have to -- take a bad contract back at a different slot, eat money, whatever.

But having him as the 4th-line center -- on merit, because of his skating and defense, and because the Flyers don't have the personnel to help hide those flaws -- is simply pointless.
- AllInForFlyers

Just because he ended last season on the fourth line doesn't mean he begins next season on the fourth line. Monday's soap opera begins where Friday's left off, no Hockey seasons.

I may be a lunatic but that superschennbrother and mjl seem really similar.

But what do I know

Just because he ended last season on the fourth line doesn't mean he begins next season on the fourth line. Monday's soap opera begins where Friday's left off, no Hockey seasons.
- SuperSchennBros

That's a cute saying, but it isn't going to make Lecavalier skate faster.

His problems stem from his skating. I have yet to see a 34-year-old player who is slow, all of a sudden, get faster.

But since phrases seem to be in vogue, I'll offer these:

"You can't put tread back on a tire." -- Bill Parcells

"Better to get rid of declining players one year too soon than one year too late. " -- Bill Walsh

Well, Lecavalier had two injuries. One was a facial laceration and the other was a broken bone in his back, which was a good deal different than the degenerative back injury that LeClair had, which required surgery and led to a staph infection and further issues.

Lecavalier didn't have surgery. He didn't have a degenerative condition. Compaing him to LeClair is apples and oranges.

And yes, Lecavalier had two injuries. The back strain was actually the same injury as the broken bone. The initial diagnosis was scrapped when further exams revealed the fracture.
- Jsaquella

So this is what your telling me. On October 11th he left the game against Phoenix with the first signs of the bad back. Then on November 30th we find out after the game against Nashville the same lingering injury has returned. However by February 27th when we resumed the regular season, his back injury was healed without surgery?

That's a cute saying, but it isn't going to make Lecavalier skate faster.

His problems stem from his skating. I have yet to see a 34-year-old player who is slow, all of a sudden, get faster.

But since phrases seem to be in vogue, I'll offer these:

"You can't put tread back on a tire." -- Bill Parcells

"Better to get rid of declining players one year too soon than one year too late. " -- Bill Walsh
- AllInForFlyers

Derian Hatcher was an even worse skater and yet he saw the end of his contract and we made it work. Anything else?

Derian Hatcher was an even worse skater and yet he saw the end of his contract and we made it work. Anything else?
- SuperSchennBros

Sure; that was a different league, a different era.

Maybe you have forgotten just how Derian Hatcher's career ended: Playing defense as an older, slower playeron a defense that got strafed by a younger, faster Buffalo team.

Do you have anything else?

Sure; that was a different league, a different era.

Maybe you have forgotten just how Derian Hatcher's career ended: Playing defense as an older, slower playeron a defense that got strafed by a younger, faster Buffalo team.

Do you have anything else?
- AllInForFlyers

No, it wasn't a different league.

No, it wasn't a different league and a different area.
- SuperSchennBros

This league has changed. You can deny it, but slow players are becoming dinosaurs. You don't hear a single person ever say, "Yeah, we want to play slower, and find slower players, so we,can't keep up with teams."

He's slow. It's OK to say it.

So this is what your telling me. On October 11th he left the game against Phoenix with the first signs of the bad back. Then on November 30th we find out after the game against Nashville the same lingering injury has returned. However by February 27th when we resumed the regular season, his back injury was healed without surgery?
- SuperSchennBros

Yes, because it was a non-displaced fracture. Broken bones heal without surgery. Happens all the time. I've had three broken bones heal without surgery.

Derian Hatcher was an even worse skater and yet he saw the end of his contract and we made it work. Anything else?
- SuperSchennBros

Actually, Hatcher spent the final year of his contract injured and did not play a single game.

Also, huge difference between a stay at home defenseman playing John Stevens' system vs a "top 6" forward playing Berube's.

Again, it's about fit. Hatcher fit in Stevens' system. Lecavalier struggled badly to fit in Berube's

Actually, Hatcher spent the final year of his contract injured and did not play a single game.

Also, huge difference between a stay at home defenseman playing John Stevens' system vs a "top 6" forward playing Berube's.

Again, it's about fit. Hatcher fit in Stevens' system. Lecavalier struggled badly to fit in Berube's
- Jsaquella

You're just making my point. The Flyers allowed Hatcher to go as long as his knees would allow him to. What else could they do?

Yes, because it was a non-displaced fracture. Broken bones heal without surgery. Happens all the time. I've had three broken bones heal without surgery.
- Jsaquella

How long did these bones take to completely heal while playing a rather physically demanding sport?

This league has changed. You can deny it, but slow players are becoming dinosaurs. You don't hear a single person ever say, "Yeah, we want to play slower, and find slower players, so we,can't keep up with teams."

He's slow. It's OK to say it.
- AllInForFlyers

Derian Hatcher as a bigger slower player was allowed to finish his contract as a Flyer and play as long as his knees could go. The Flyers never washed their hands of him, they allowed him to go as long as he could because there was nothing else they could do with him. When Hatcher was beaten by Maxim Afinogenov it was early within his time as a Flyer. The Rules haven't changed much if at all in 6 years since he left the game. Vincent Lecavalier, Luke Schenn, Nick Grossmann, Scott Hartnell, Steve Downie. All not great skaters but we still pick them up.

You're just making my point. The Flyers allowed Hatcher to go as long as his knees would allow him to. What else could they do?
- SuperSchennBros

They let him go that long because he was still effective. Vinny hasn't been effective. That's sort of a huge difference.

Actually, Hatcher spent the final year of his contract injured and did not play a single game.

Also, huge difference between a stay at home defenseman playing John Stevens' system vs a "top 6" forward playing Berube's.

Again, it's about fit. Hatcher fit in Stevens' system. Lecavalier struggled badly to fit in Berube's
- Jsaquella

Exactly -- that is,what I meant. When a guy like Hatcher, who is not a bad person, has character, has size and strength...those things are fine in November against bad teams.

In May, against well-coached teams with speed and skill, you have to skate. It isn't rocket science. You can't lose races to 50-50 pucks. And because you can't interfere with players anymore, there is no hiding players who can't skate.

Slow players back in the day could hook guys, pull them back and slingshot themselves. If you can't do,that, and can't play defense, you are a liabilty

How long did these bones take to completely heal while playing a rather physically demanding sport?
- SuperSchennBros

Not sure. I'm not a doctor. I do know that bones can heal without surgery, but seeing as how I don't know the exact injury Lecavalier suffered, I can't say.

However, I do know he was medically cleared and stated that the back injury was not a factor in his poor play down the stretch or in the playoffs.

Going to have to go with the doctors who cleared him to play, and with the players who said the back didn't affect him.