That said, all we continue to see in the post season is failure after failure after failure. I used to get infuriated at the national media's love affair with Toews as a leader. It sickens me. However, when compared to 87, how can I blame them? Toews wins in the post season. His teams raise their level of play, Crosby's do not.


- Amanion

First off Toews is a great player and leader but to compare Toews post season success to Crosby's would be wrong to do. Yes Crosby has to step up and be a better player and leader but Toews IMO has had the better team around him than Crosby has had for a few years now. Chicago has Toews, Kane and Hossa and a hnadful of other good players. The Pens have Crosby and Malkin other than that really no one else to speak of. Yes they have some guys that have and can put up some decent numbers but no one like a hossa to be that third elite player like Chicago has. They've got better and more consistent goaltending. Crosby lead the league in scoring by what 18 points with really mediocre wingers. Not saying Kunitz and Dupuis are slouches but they're not elite or even very good players they are solid players. This is not to excuse Crosby from his play over all but I don't think Crosby has had the team around that Toews has had and still does.

Secondly,Lemieux complained during the clutch and grab era. He was just so talented he was able to over come a lot of the BS in the game at the time. He even went after Kerry Fraser because the refs much like now allow lesser talented/thug players to do whatever they want to the star players. I agree with you that the leagues greatest stage should be for the stars to shine and not to show how much the lesser talent can get away with thuggery and hold back the stars or the refs be in the forefront because they think they're bigger then the game. I'm tired of the whole the refs don't want to decide the game, well news flash when you don't make a call on a blatant penalty the ref is deciding the game. Heck the linesman can't even drop a puck for a face off without a 5 minute delay because they need to kick someone out of the face off and make sure the cameras are on them.

Paul, your biasness against the Pens organization and players continues to show. The only time you get any significant amount of comments on your blogs is when you're slamming a Pens player because you know it brings people out of the woodwork that can't stand the Pens or their players. Your biasness seems to show so much that I wonder if the Pens had a fair chance in the games you reffed.

Yes Crosby could be a better leader and has his faults without a doubt. I'll even admit that he initiates things from time to time but to suggest he has no reason to retaliate when officials allow him to get beat on all game long is foolish. Yes probably not the smartest thing to retaliate because refs tend not to see the five crosschecks he took but see the little retaliatory punch he gives back and call him for a penalty. I've never seen a star player in any league get abused as much as he does and get very few calls. Heck through nearly two playoff series he has only drawn 1 penalty and as you being a former ref if you've watched any of games you know that is a joke. It's funny how you don't call out the league or refs for not making calls when Crosby was getting crosschecked and beat on by Dubinsky in the first round and getting shots to the head and neck by Staal in the this second round. He may still embellish here and there but no more than most players and for you to say a ref should not call a penalty for a shot to the head because he may have embellished two games ago gives more credence to the people who think this league and refs are a joke.

Finally, I don't get the thinking of the league and or Refs. You mention the water bottle incident and say that's bush league stuff but you can't spray a goalie when you hockey stop in front of him but it's alright to spray your whole bottle of water on a player a star player at that and that's okay? You then say it's a concern about spearing players (which it is) but don't condemn Staal's crosschecks to Crosby's head and neck which the league is supposedly trying to do away with. I understand some of the criticism of Crosby not trying to justify some of the things he has done but as another poster stated the league especially in the playoffs should be showcasing the stars not allowing them to be brought down so the lesser talented players/teams have a chance.

Leadership goes further than the definition ... implicit in the concept is that the leader has an effect on those around him because of his behavior. So the leader telegraphs the philosophy he wants his group to embody. With that as my premise, Sidney Crosby plays really well but conducts himself in a childish manner. He doesn't project a persona that considers anyone but himself on the ice. IMHO, that's not what I'd consider good leadership. In comparison, Pavel Datsyuk oozes leadership from every pore...

Its funny because if you ask any player that ever played with him, including team Canada and Coach Mike Babcock they all say hes a great leader. Nice speculating though.
- Grinder47

Show me one instance when a player says something bad about another player.

First off Toews is a great player and leader but to compare Toews post season success to Crosby's would be wrong to do. Yes Crosby has to step up and be a better player and leader but Toews IMO has had the better team around him than Crosby has had for a few years now. Chicago has Toews, Kane and Hossa and a hnadful of other good players. The Pens have Crosby and Malkin other than that really no one else to speak of. Yes they have some guys that have and can put up some decent numbers but no one like a hossa to be that third elite player like Chicago has. They've got better and more consistent goaltending. Crosby lead the league in scoring by what 18 points with really mediocre wingers. Not saying Kunitz and Dupuis are slouches but they're not elite or even very good players they are solid players. This is not to excuse Crosby from his play over all but I don't think Crosby has had the team around that Toews has had and still does.

Secondly,Lemieux complained during the clutch and grab era. He was just so talented he was able to over come a lot of the BS in the game at the time. He even went after Kerry Fraser because the refs much like now allow lesser talented/thug players to do whatever they want to the star players. I agree with you that the leagues greatest stage should be for the stars to shine and not to show how much the lesser talent can get away with thuggery and hold back the stars or the refs be in the forefront because they think they're bigger then the game. I'm tired of the whole the refs don't want to decide the game, well news flash when you don't make a call on a blatant penalty the ref is deciding the game. Heck the linesman can't even drop a puck for a face off without a 5 minute delay because they need to kick someone out of the face off and make sure the cameras are on them.
- Guins6687

Fair enough, now explain why Toews has played better than Crosby in the last two olympics.

Paul, I couldn't agree more with your assessment. It's time Crosby grows up and takes his lumps. The sense of entitlement surrounding the Penguins star players, back to the days of Mr. Lemieux, has worn very thin and seems to have infected the team as a whole.
My anger with it is only compounded by the lackluster approach this team has taken into the playoffs the past five years. Losing is acceptable if you're beaten on even terms, but losing because you're outplayed, outhustled or just show up disinterested or ill-prepared is inexcusable.
By the way, if it wasn't already obvious, I am a longtime Pens fan, but will offer no apologies for their poor attitude, organizational mismanagement and embarrassing play.