I mean, MJL's not wrong -- you could find a couple of wingers to complement him, shield him when you have to. That's coaching, and roster management. I don't know, if he's going to stay here, that you shouldn't do that. Because you should always maximize your assets.

All I'm saying right now is that come Game 4 tomorrow, it's all hands on deck, as far as I'm concerned. And the pace of play is something that everybody who is in the lineup has to be able to handle, at some point and to some degree, and if you can't, and your linemates can't cover for you...then maybe sitting this one out is best for the team.
- AllInForFlyers

Not necessarily saying he is. But despite putting up solid goal and point totals, the team is generally getting outperformed when he is on the ice.

The biggest issue is do the Flyers have the pieces on hand to get the best out of what Lecavalier can still do?

Sorry; we were only talking about Richards because of a question that was asked a few pages back.
- AllInForFlyers

Yup and it was to that question I initially responded.
Their is no scenario where I take Richards , at his age, over Schenn , at his age.

Not necessarily saying he is. But despite putting up solid goal and point totals, the team is generally getting outperformed when he is on the ice.

The biggest issue is do the Flyers have the pieces on hand to get the best out of what Lecavalier can still do?
- Jsaquella

No. No, they do not.

Toronto could really use help at center, they were desperate enough to even try JVR there at one point. I could see the Leafs having some interest if the price is cheap enough.
- BiggE

schenn schenn for riley and franson

No. No, they do not.
- AllInForFlyers

They could play him with Giroux. Trouble there is, I'm not sure that helps the team as much as it does Vinny.

No. No, they do not.
- AllInForFlyers

Perhaps, but I'd try him with Read and Raffl before I'd say that for sure.

Not necessarily saying he is. But despite putting up solid goal and point totals, the team is generally getting outperformed when he is on the ice.

The biggest issue is do the Flyers have the pieces on hand to get the best out of what Lecavalier can still do?
- Jsaquella

Shuffle out some young cheap promising pieces. Bring in a Hemsky, dabble a little Ryder....and Voala! Flyers 2014 offseason set in motion.

They could play him with Giroux. Trouble there is, I'm not sure that helps the team as much as it does Vinny.
- Jsaquella

Therein lies the rub.

Really? Because if you look at the possession stats for his last season in Tampa Bay, they were trending the same way...Vinny's looking like a mistake.

Not just because of his stats, but he's really not a great fit for the other pieces on the roster. He's had struggles no matter what line mates he's had. He's limited to being a set piece shooter and doesn't feel comfortable playing on the wing. He's had issues keeping up to the speed of play.

It's a shame. I was all for Vinny and loved the signing initially. But he's been a major disappointment to me.
- Jsaquella

Possession stats are not the only metric to measure a player. And they shouldn't be used at all to measure a player any way.
If we look at the possession stats for game 2, the Flyers lost that battle significantly, but they won the game. The Flyers crushed the Rangers in the possession stats in game 3, but they lost the game. They are overblown.
Lecavalier is an offensive player. He's a scorer, and he has played well as a Flyers when he wasn't injured, and wasn't playing out of position. And I think there is merit to he's a player that needs to be in the right situation, with the right linemates to be successful. But the injury and the position change can't be discounted in looking at his season. And there is no doubt that he has to play better. It's said he's not alone in that, but he sure seems to be the focus.

They could play him with Giroux. Trouble there is, I'm not sure that helps the team as much as it does Vinny.
- Jsaquella

I don't think you can. Giroux could clearly play RW, because that's what he was drafted as, but do you flip Voracek to the left? He's been the best forward over the three games. So why would you flip him?

Vinny struggles on the wing, so putting him at LW and dropping Hartnell down, OK, yeah, you can do that and create Hartnell-Schenn-Simmonds, but the problem then is that Giroux's already not scoring...do you want to risk, then, L1 starting to give up goals due to Vinny's weakness and speed concerns on defense?

Man. It's tough. You might try it...but damn. That's...I'm glad I'm just some guy on a laptop, instead of the guy who has to make that call.

They could play him with Giroux. Trouble there is, I'm not sure that helps the team as much as it does Vinny.
- Jsaquella

Not sure is correct. And I'm not sure either. But I think if Lecavalier can play the right side with a playmaker like Giroux, he can produce. But I'm not a big fan of breaking up a top line in the playoffs. But I also think that Simmonds and Schenn can benefit from a puck carrying playmaking winger like Voracek. There is pros and cons. But to this point neither line is getting it done.

I don't think you can. Giroux could clearly play RW, because that's what he was drafted as, but do you flip Voracek to the left? He's been the best forward over the three games. So why would you flip him?

Vinny struggles on the wing, so putting him at LW and dropping Hartnell down, OK, yeah, you can do that and create Hartnell-Schenn-Simmonds, but the problem then is that Giroux's already not scoring...do you want to risk, then, L1 starting to give up goals due to Vinny's weakness and speed concerns on defense?

Man. It's tough. You might try it...but damn. That's...I'm glad I'm just some guy on a laptop, instead of the guy who has to make that call.
- AllInForFlyers

If Lecavalier went to the top line, he would have to play RW.

Perhaps, but I'd try him with Read and Raffl before I'd say that for sure.
- BiggE

You'd break up Couturier and Read? I'm not saying you can't, but then who are you playing with Couturier?

Possession stats are not the only metric to measure a player. And they shouldn't be used at all to measure a player any way.
If we look at the possession stats for game 2, the Flyers lost that battle significantly, but they won the game. The Flyers crushed the Rangers in the possession stats in game 3, but they lost the game. They are overblown.
Lecavalier is an offensive player. He's a scorer, and he has played well as a Flyers when he wasn't injured, and wasn't playing out of position. And I think there is merit to he's a player that needs to be in the right situation, with the right linemates to be successful. But the injury and the position change can't be discounted in looking at his season. And there is no doubt that he has to play better. It's said he's not alone in that, but he sure seems to be the focus.
- MJL

I like Vinnie, I just think that in the long run, B Schenn and Simmonds are the wrong wingers to play with him. Schenn and VL seem to gravitate to the same spots way too often and none of the 3 are particularly strong stickhandlers, playmakers or adept at carrying the puck up the ice.

I know I keep saying this over and over, but for life of me I don't understand why they don't try him between Read and Raffl. Or if they are determined to keep Read with Couturier, go with:

Raffl-VL-Simmonds
and
Schenn or Akeson-Couturier-Read

If Lecavalier went to the top line, he would have to play RW.
- MJL

Are you saying Voracek-Giroux-Lecavalier, then, or Hartnell-Giroux-Lecavalier?

You'd break up Couturier and Read? I'm not saying you can't, but then who are you playing with Couturier?
- AllInForFlyers

If it was up to me, I'd put Couturier out with Simmonds on the right and spot both Akeson and Schenn on the left.

I don't think the Rags have one dominant line that you need to spot Couturier and Read against, plus I think Akeson-Couturier-Simmonds is a nice blend of skill, size, offense and defense.

No.
- Flyersgod

hahahahahahahahahaha

Are you saying Voracek-Giroux-Lecavalier, then, or Hartnell-Giroux-Lecavalier?
- AllInForFlyers

Think people are saying Hartnell/Giroux/VL, to replicate some of the Hartnell/Giroux/Jagr magic.

You'd break up Couturier and Read? I'm not saying you can't, but then who are you playing with Couturier?
- AllInForFlyers

We needs offense. At this point you break everyone up and see who's got the juice.

Hartnell/Giroux/Read
Raffl/Vinny/Voracek
Simmonds/Coots/Schenn
Hall/Rinaldo/Akeson

Coburn/Streit
Amac/Schenn
Grossman/Timonen

If it was up to me, I'd put Couturier out with Simmonds on the right and spot both Akeson and Schenn on the left.

I don't think the Rags have one dominant line that you need to spot Couturier and Read against, plus I think Akeson-Couturier-Simmonds is a nice blend of skill, size, offense and defense.
- BiggE

Huh. Interesting.

I like Vinnie, I just think that in the long run, B Schenn and Simmonds are the wrong wingers to play with him. Schenn and VL seem to gravitate to the same spots way too often and none of the 3 are particularly strong stickhandlers, playmakers or adept at carrying the puck up the ice.

I know I keep saying this over and over, but for life of me I don't understand why they don't try him between Read and Raffl. Or if they are determined to keep Read with Couturier, go with:

Raffl-VL-Simmonds
and
Schenn or Akeson-Couturier-Read
- BiggE

All 3 players are in the same mold, they all like to go to the net. And none of the 3, as you point out, are players that carry and distribute the puck. They have a center that is a shooter, with two muckers and grinders that score from around the net for the most part. They don't compliment each other. But if you break them up, you mess up something else. My problem is that I think talking about fit is a legitimate argument. But talking about not being able to play anymore, or stating that he's not capable of scoring against top players anymore, is hyperbole when it comes to Lecavalier. He can still play, and still score in this League. In the right situation.

Are you saying Voracek-Giroux-Lecavalier, then, or Hartnell-Giroux-Lecavalier?
- AllInForFlyers

The latter.

I'd love the Flyers to start throwing pucks at the net from weird angles. Rangers have the most dangerous angles blocked off. When they collapse down low, throw it out front and see if you can hit some feet and put a hot potatoe thought in their heads.

Think people are saying Hartnell/Giroux/VL, to replicate some of the Hartnell/Giroux/Jagr magic.
- Tomahawk

Whoa...as Paul Holmgren puts it, "That's a stretch."

Jagr...not only have we discussed how that guy is just a different beast entirely, the guy was a lifelong RW with puck possession skills that may never be replicated.

Vinny has some attributes, but what I just typed...those aren't it.

Whoa...as Paul Holmgren puts it, "That's a stretch."

Jagr...not only have we discussed how that guy is just a different beast entirely, the guy was a lifelong RW with puck possession skills that may never be replicated.

Vinny has some attributes, but what I just typed...those aren't it.
- AllInForFlyers

Man... imagine next year when Jagr resigns with us....