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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Never a Question of Resiliency, Practice Updates
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Giroux_Is_God
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: CLASS DISMISSED
Joined: 12.15.2011

Apr 21 @ 10:24 AM ET
My only concern was whether he could translate his remarkable anticipation over to the next level... signs look good so far.

I'll take a guy with a questionable toolbox but can think a step ahead at the top level, over guys like Chris Gratton who are blessed with everything but can't think their way out of a wet paper bag.

- Tomahawk

....I've waterboarded myself before. Me and my friend.

I wouldn't recommend it.
Marc D
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: best smile, 14 without fake tees
Joined: 03.28.2008

Apr 21 @ 10:25 AM ET
Bill points out in his blog that 4 of the 6 penalties were clear cut, one was borderline and one was a bad call.

The problem I had with the refs is there is no consistency between games.
In the first game the refs swallowed their whistles and let a ton of penalties go.
Blatant cross checks to more subtle hooking and interference calls that were clear penalties in the regular season. Then the rags go up 3-1 and the refs decide they better manage the game to not let it get out of hand, and they call a slew of penalties on the Flyers for extracurricular stick work.

Then yesterday they start out the game calling nearly everything. The first three penalties yesterday (2 on the Flyers followed by a call on Hagelin) would have been let go in the first game. They still seem to be letting some hooking and interference stuff go, but yesterday they seemed to "insert themselves" into the game.

Next game it could go back to "it's the playoffs, put the whistle away".

I know game to game variance from refs is nothing new.
I would like to see more consistency from the refs, especially when the result can hinge on a power play call.
steelydan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philly, PA
Joined: 04.16.2009

Apr 21 @ 10:25 AM ET
There were masses crying out for Mason after Game 1? Are we to assume that he would be able to stop rockets of cross-ice passes on a 4-minute PP? Emery was the one player least responsible for the Game 1 loss, and was most responsible for the Game 2 win.
- jmatchett383


Yes, there absolutely were masses crying for Mason after game 1. Go back to the GDT; it's not hard to find.

Mason would not have been able to stop every goal that Emery gave up, but his lateral movement certainly would've afforded him a better chance. No one expected Emery to make those saves and no one would expect Mason to make them. But Mason could have potentially saved 1 or 2 (and it would be top-10 worthy).

That's really here nor there. Emery played well in Mason's stead, but it's not as if he put up two shutouts and we took a 2-0 lead on the Rags. It's a tied series and the team could benefit from some "more solid" goaltending from a *healthy* Mason, as well as his ability to control the tempo of the Rags forecheck with his stick-handling skills. Like I said. Everyone is thankful that Emery backstopped the team to the well-needed split in MSG. That being said, Mason was the workhorse and deserves his spot back on the team.
Tomahawk
Ottawa Senators
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner bandwagon. Grab 'em by the Corsi.
Joined: 02.04.2009

Apr 21 @ 10:25 AM ET
That "hockey sense" is what I always remember detroit looking for in players once they get passed the first two rounds in drafting. Its how they ended up with Datsyuk and Franzen and Zetterberg. You never know how they will translate to the pro level, but guys that just have "it" always seem to end up doing alright for themselves.
- the deaninator


Yeah, Detroit doesn't seem to put much emphasis in raw skills, or even demonstrated production. They seem to prioritize hockey sense and mental plasticity over the usual stuff.
Moose_15
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Rat Patrol, PA
Joined: 02.15.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:26 AM ET
Crack the heads of a few hacks with pucks and sticks?
- wolfhounds


If it bleeds, it leads.
steelydan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philly, PA
Joined: 04.16.2009

Apr 21 @ 10:27 AM ET
Don't see how he can be healthy this soon, if he still had issues on Saturday.
- puckhead17


After 3 days? I don't see why not. If it's a concussion, then you're right; 3 days won't do much in terms of recovery.

If it's whiplash or something else (like many have suspected), then 3 days could be what he needed to go from 60% to 90%. (I refuse to use 100% because no player is really 100% after an 82-game season).
Moose_15
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Rat Patrol, PA
Joined: 02.15.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:27 AM ET
After 2 games, that's just absurd. Rangers are getting too much of a benefit of the doubt. The trend should reverse for game 3.
- wolfhounds



Typical MSG bullsh---
GOA88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 08.02.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:27 AM ET
I think people are quick to forget that Lindros didnt return until game 6 and he scored the teams only goal and also was what 0.6 secs from tying that game?!!! He then had the Flyers looking pretty dominant in game 7 after being flat for 2 straight games and then the Stevens hit happened. The team once again went flat. What happened to the us against the world mentality then? That was a very upsetting series but the one that makes me upset the most is the 2004 ECF. If they were healthy they were winning the cup that season.
BulliesPhan87
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: the lone wolf of hockeybuzz
Joined: 07.31.2009

Apr 21 @ 10:27 AM ET
....I've waterboarded myself before. Me and my friend.

I wouldn't recommend it.

- Giroux_Is_God

why would you even try this

what's wrong with you
GOA88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 08.02.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:29 AM ET
why would you even try this

what's wrong with you

- BulliesPhan87

lol
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Apr 21 @ 10:29 AM ET
Yes, there absolutely were masses crying for Mason after game 1. Go back to the GDT; it's not hard to find.

Mason would not have been able to stop every goal that Emery gave up, but his lateral movement certainly would've afforded him a better chance. No one expected Emery to make those saves and no one would expect Mason to make them. But Mason could have potentially saved 1 or 2 (and it would be top-10 worthy).

That's really here nor there. Emery played well in Mason's stead, but it's not as if he put up two shutouts and we took a 2-0 lead on the Rags. It's a tied series and the team could benefit from some "more solid" goaltending from a *healthy* Mason, as well as his ability to control the tempo of the Rags forecheck with his stick-handling skills. Like I said. Everyone is thankful that Emery backstopped the team to the well-needed split in MSG. That being said, Mason was the workhorse and deserves his spot back on the team.

- steelydan


I didn't read the GDT, but anyone who was crying out for Mason due to Game 1 needs to get their eyes examined, because Mason wouldn't have won that game either. To me, Mason doesn't "deserve" anything right now, where as Ray Emery has basically been your best player in 2 games. So, how far does this go? Let's say Emery, as "the backup" wins this series and the next, and Mason's healthy for the ECF. Do you just throw Mason in because of some role attached to his name? To me, if you're the goalie and the team's winning, that goalie earns the start until he falters.
Giroux_Is_God
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: CLASS DISMISSED
Joined: 12.15.2011

Apr 21 @ 10:29 AM ET
why would you even try this

what's wrong with you

- BulliesPhan87

Curiosity.

Laid down with the towel laid on my face, and I held a wrench for the signal. Drop the wrench, then my friend stops with the water and rips the towel off.

I now understand why it's torture. It was a rather eye opening experience.

I refuse to be judged
Moose_15
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Rat Patrol, PA
Joined: 02.15.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:29 AM ET
Leading to 2 embellishment calls yesterday
- puckhead17



Oddly enough, I remember those claims being made about Vancouver players a few years back--coincidence? coaching?

"Take the fall, act hurt. Get indignant."
wolfhounds
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: dicky seamus, PA
Joined: 06.02.2009

Apr 21 @ 10:29 AM ET
I never used the word controversy. The other poster (GOA, I think) said sitting Mason would cause one.

My only thing is, you play with the guy you're winning with. A example would be the 2008 Phillies with Moyer and Hamels. Hamels was BY FAR the better pitcher. But, for whatever reason, the Phillies played better when Moyer was in the game. Hamels had a better ERA, a better WHIP, more shutouts, was basically better in every single category, except for the one that mattered: wins. The team won more games with Moyer on the mound.

So my point is, if a team is winning with a goalie, whether he's a starter or backup, keep him in until they stop winning, or he struggles badly. Maybe the team plays differently in some small way for Emery, and that way will be exploited or changed for the worse when Mason comes in. For whatever reason, aside from the East-West passes, Emery has been fantastic in net so far in a place we couldn't win in. I feel no need to pull him if Mason's back.

- jmatchett383


Sorry, didn't mean to put words in your mouth.

I guess we'll see what happens later today when Bill updates the blog after practice and go from there. If Mason doesn't get out on the ice, the question is likely answered.

I get your point, and agree with it to an extent, but in the Hamels/Moyer example, both had to play before you had your sample size. Meaning Mason would have to get into a playoff game before an accurate comparison could be made.

I think we'd all agree Mason is the better goalie, but we also don't know how he will handle the pressures of the playoffs. And we don't know what his injury was/is or how close he is to healthy. So I'm very glad we have Emery around. That said, Mason's puck handling would be a boon to the team, and it's not like Emery is stealing games for us, so I have zero issue with Mason getting the start when he's good to go.
flyersfan51
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: United States, NJ
Joined: 10.04.2006

Apr 21 @ 10:29 AM ET
Didn't Keith Jones reveal that the players went to Neilson and begged him not to put Eric in? Fun times.
- Tomahawk


why would they not want Eric to play?? dumb. If that's true, then they deserved to lose.
PhillySportsGuy
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: any donut with a hole in the middle can get (frank)ed right in its hole, NJ
Joined: 04.08.2012

Apr 21 @ 10:30 AM ET
Leading to 2 embellishment calls yesterday
- puckhead17


I hate that an embellishment call always comes with a regular penalty too. Its so rare that you see one player called for flopping.
GOA88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 08.02.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:30 AM ET
I didn't read the GDT, but anyone who was crying out for Mason due to Game 1 needs to get their eyes examined, because Mason wouldn't have won that game either. To me, Mason doesn't "deserve" anything right now, where as Ray Emery has basically been your best player in 2 games. So, how far does this go? Let's say Emery, as "the backup" wins this series and the next, and Mason's healthy for the ECF. Do you just throw Mason in because of some role attached to his name? To me, if you're the goalie and the team's winning, that goalie earns the start until he falters.
- jmatchett383

I think if it went that far you absolutely keep Emery in. I think most people are questioning Emerys ability to beat the Rangers 4 times. I am one of those people.
puckhead17
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Old Time Hockey
Joined: 08.14.2011

Apr 21 @ 10:31 AM ET
I hate that an embellishment call always comes with a regular penalty too. Its so rare that you see one player called for flopping.
- PhillySportsGuy



It is a stupid concept, it should be one, or the other, not both.
Giroux_Is_God
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: CLASS DISMISSED
Joined: 12.15.2011

Apr 21 @ 10:31 AM ET
I hate that an embellishment call always comes with a regular penalty too. Its so rare that you see one player called for flopping.
- PhillySportsGuy

WHY IS THIS A THING HOLY (frank)

If a player dives, he should get the only penalty. Perfect example is that AMac penalty. Isn't it logical that if a player dives, he dives because he wants to sell something that WASN'T a penalty
puckhead17
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Old Time Hockey
Joined: 08.14.2011

Apr 21 @ 10:32 AM ET
Oddly enough, I remember those claims being made about Vancouver players a few years back--coincidence? coaching?

"Take the fall, act hurt. Get indignant."

- Moose_15


Nice point, same coach.
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Newark, DE
Joined: 03.09.2010

Apr 21 @ 10:32 AM ET
I think people are quick to forget that Lindros didnt return until game 6 and he scored the teams only goal and also was what 0.6 secs from tying that game?!!! He then had the Flyers looking pretty dominant in game 7 after being flat for 2 straight games and then the Stevens hit happened. The team once again went flat. What happened to the us against the world mentality then? That was a very upsetting series but the one that makes me upset the most is the 2004 ECF. If they were healthy they were winning the cup that season.
- GOA88


I don't think many people forget that he came back in Game 6, at least not the people I talk to about it. But being 0.6 seconds from tying it doesn't ring a bell.

The "us against the world" mentality was shot the minute he came back, because it was now "us and our all-world superstar", and once that happens, and that superstar goes down (to say nothing on roster management to fit him in), then you have no mentality.
PhillySportsGuy
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: any donut with a hole in the middle can get (frank)ed right in its hole, NJ
Joined: 04.08.2012

Apr 21 @ 10:32 AM ET
Curiosity.

Laid down with the towel laid on my face, and I held a wrench for the signal. Drop the wrench, then my friend stops with the water and rips the towel off.

I now understand why it's torture. It was a rather eye opening experience.

I refuse to be judged

- Giroux_Is_God


Does it feel like you're drowning?
wolfhounds
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: dicky seamus, PA
Joined: 06.02.2009

Apr 21 @ 10:33 AM ET
Oddly enough, I remember those claims being made about Vancouver players a few years back--coincidence? coaching?

"Take the fall, act hurt. Get indignant."

- Moose_15


Things that make you go...

WTF!
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Apr 21 @ 10:33 AM ET
What a pleasant Easter surprise yesterday. With the exception of the cross ice passes that are leading to what amount to open net goals for the Rags, the Flyers are doing a good job keeping things to the outside. Emery played a really strong game yesterday. I would start him in game 3 giving Mason more time to recoup. If Emery plays well and the Flyers win again, keep riding him.

Felt really good for Akeson, he played a strong game 1 and was not to blame for the loss. He certainly looks like he belongs in the NHL.

One thing that really needs to improve or it's going to come back and bite them, have to stop taking so many penalties. It's one thing to take a penalty to prevent a scoring chance, but the stick infractions in the offensive zone have to stop.

- PLindbergh31


I dont mind them taking penalties as long as their drawing them too. 2:1 ratio isnt good. But if each team takes 4 or 5 penalties that type of broken up game is going to benefit the flyers due to their strong special teams
GOA88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 08.02.2013

Apr 21 @ 10:33 AM ET
I don't think many people forget that he came back in Game 6, at least not the people I talk to about it. But being 0.6 seconds from tying it doesn't ring a bell.

The "us against the world" mentality was shot the minute he came back, because it was now "us and our all-world superstar", and once that happens, and that superstar goes down (to say nothing on roster management to fit him in), then you have no mentality.

- jmatchett383

He literally scored to tie the game I believe but just short of time.....
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