I will counter that....... Kessel pre RC days was useless defensively. He was known mainly as a sniper, period. Under RC he started playing all 200' of the ice, and became a playmaker.

RC has his faults, but don't think Trotz would have more sucess with this group of defenseman. Aside from Phaneuf and Rielly, you can cast the rest of them out to sea, and they'd all sink.
- faceto27

Spot on!!

Thats exactly the point i'm making. You are blaming RC, and that Trotz is going to make this better with the mediocre talent it has.

Trotz, not only had Weber, but he had some stiff named Suter there. He also had a world class goalie.

Bottom line, he had his ass handed to him in the playoffs.
- faceto27

What is your point? I'm not blaming RC, but obviously....RC can't do much unless he has 2 Hall of Famer defenders on his back end. Trotz brought those guys along from when they were just getting into the league. He developed them correctly. Would it not be the perfect scenario for guys such as Rielly, Gardiner, Bernier, Kadri, etc....as well as our prospects. My point is, he actually brings the Predators youth along and turns them into full time NHLers. Randy Carlyle cannot do that correctly.

I'm odd? That's hilarious, you were the one posting pics of 14 year sluts wearing spandex claiming that those were pics of Weirdoh. So I think you should be claimed the King Of Odd in this thread. C'mon buddy, those pics were of underage girls.
- GCHonda

gross

What is your point? I'm not blaming RC, but obviously....RC can't do much unless he has 2 Hall of Famer defenders on his back end. Trotz brought those guys along from when they were just getting into the league. He developed them correctly. Would it not be the perfect scenario for guys such as Rielly, Gardiner, Bernier, Kadri, etc....as well as our prospects. My point is, he actually brings the Predators youth along and turns them into full time NHLers. Randy Carlyle cannot do that correctly.
- ThePresident

Not sure how you can say this.

I'm odd? That's hilarious, you were the one posting pics of 14 year sluts wearing spandex claiming that those were pics of Weirdoh. So I think you should be claimed the King Of Odd in this thread. C'mon buddy, those pics were of underage girls.
- GCHonda

gross
- Flyfreaky

You like it

You like it
- nbboy

What is your point? I'm not blaming RC, but obviously....RC can't do much unless he has 2 Hall of Famer defenders on his back end. Trotz brought those guys along from when they were just getting into the league. He developed them correctly. Would it not be the perfect scenario for guys such as Rielly, Gardiner, Bernier, Kadri, etc....as well as our prospects. My point is, he actually brings the Predators youth along and turns them into full time NHLers. Randy Carlyle cannot do that correctly.
- ThePresident

Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??

I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers.

Not sure how you can say this.
- honesthockey

What young player has flourished under him?

Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??

I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers.
- faceto27

i would fire nonis, rc and revamp the scouting and internal staff

What young player has flourished under him?
- ThePresident

Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry

Thats exactly the point i'm making. You are blaming RC, and that Trotz is going to make this better with the mediocre talent it has.

Trotz, not only had Weber, but he had some stiff named Suter there. He also had a world class goalie.

Bottom line, he had his ass handed to him in the playoffs.
- faceto27

I didn't realize, the Preds got 100 points four times under Trotz. Not bad considering they never had a Kessel/JVR combo. Leafs presently have a better offense than Nash. Offense is not the problem for the Leafs. If Trotz can teach the Leafs how to play better defense, along with their offense, the Leafs could be awesome.

i would fire nonis, rc and revamp the scouting and internal staff
- Flyfreaky

I'm not sure, i'm not ready to go to that extreme yet. I still need to see how the draft picks from the Burke/Nonis era pan out. We should start seeing them in the next two years.

Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??

I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers.
- faceto27

Patrick Hornqvist, Scott Hartnell, Nick Spaling is up there now, Wilson, Craig Smith, but realistically, they've developed far more defensemen and brought it in forwards from outside.

I didn't realize, the Preds got 100 points four times under Trotz. Not bad considering they never had a Kessel/JVR combo. Leafs presently have a better offense than Nash. Offense is not the problem for the Leafs. If Trotz can teach the Leafs how to play better defense, along with their offense, the Leafs could be awesome.
- GCHonda

Ahhhhhhh yes....... JVR. Another forward that flourished under RC.

Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry
- faceto27

dustin penner, chad kilger

Shanahan was Carlyles roommate at one point. Not sure he'd hang him out to dry. If he deems Carlyle is the problem and must go then he should have done it.
- honesthockey

Again, I don't think he's gonna storm onto the job and start dropping the axe. I think there'll be discussions with Carlyle and with management to figure out their vision, see if it matches, and see if it can work.

I'm just not that patient

I'm not sure, i'm not ready to go to that extreme yet. I still need to see how the draft picks from the Burke/Nonis era pan out. We should start seeing them in the next two years.
- faceto27

nonis seems to be the type of gm that sets the team during the off season and then rides it out until the next off season

not a good way to run a team

Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry
- faceto27

Even Cam Fowler

Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??

I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers.
- faceto27

Shea Weber and Suter are no Chris Pronger and Scott Neidermayer. Any team in the league with both Pronger and Neidermayer on the backend, yeah an instant Stanley Cup favorite.....again, RC is not responsible for it. Barry Trotz brought along Weber, Suter, and also had a pretty damn good track record with goalies. He obviously understands that it's most important to build from the net out. As far as forwards go, they did not have much....which is why it is so impressive that he was able to bring them to the playoffs 7 out of the last 10 years. He made it work with what he was supplied with. Can't say that about many coaches around the league, given his roster.

Patrick Hornqvist, Scott Hartnell, Nick Spaling is up there now, Wilson, Craig Smith, but realistically, they've developed far more defensemen and brought it in forwards from outside.
- Viktory

Seriously, the best you can come up with were those three players??

Honqvist best season is 53 points. Spaling best season is what something like 35 pts. And Hartnell best days are with the Flyers.

C'mon man

Again, I don't think he's gonna storm onto the job and start dropping the axe. I think there'll be discussions with Carlyle and with management to figure out their vision, see if it matches, and see if it can work.

I'm just not that patient
- lumlums

He didn't have to. Carlyle reports to Nonis.

Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry
- faceto27

I'm talking on the Leafs.

Shea Weber and Suter are no Chris Pronger and Scott Neidermayer. Any team in the league with both Pronger and Neidermayer on the backend, yeah an instant Stanley Cup favorite.....again, RC is not responsible for it. Barry Trotz brought along Weber, Suter, and also had a pretty damn good track record with goalies. He obviously understands that it's most important to build from the net out. As far as forwards go, they did not have much....which is why it is so impressive that he was able to bring them to the playoffs 7 out of the last 10 years. He made it work with what he was supplied with. Can't say that about many coaches around the league, given his roster.
- ThePresident

Weber and Suter will both be Hall of Famers. To think otherwise is silly.

As for the forwards..... is it they didn't have much? Or they didn't develop much??

After 15 years, you'd think he would have developed ONE, just ONE decent forward.

I'm talking on the Leafs.
- ThePresident

kadri and jake g