Offensively, no. But value-added to the team-wise? Why not? Holland isn't a defensively liability and isn't -8.
- twiztedmike

Holland also wasnt drafted by the microscopic centre of the hockey universe with the mind(frank) spotlight pressure that comes with it. I'd cut Kadri some slack...his problem is in his head right now...his ceiling is much higher than Holland's...and that's not cutting Holland up either, he's fit in well.

the guy has 16 points in a total of 49 career NHL games...lets not jump to conclusions. Geesh, the guy puts up a few points while playing in a top 6 role, and everyone thinks he can easily replace the guy who was #2 in scoring last year....

yes, Kadri is in a bit of a slump and needs to pick things up, but there is no way Holland just steps in and takes his spot.
- vermie22

Stats can always be manipulated to favour an argument...

in 2010, Kadri had 12 in 29 games
in 2011, Kadri had 7 in 21 games (19 in 50)

Quite similar point production...

More like what it will take to win a Tavares Sweeps if such a thing ever happened.
- 2gals1dane

Why are you guys talking about trading for JT when we have Bozak?

Let's move on to a more relevant topic:

Who was better: Patrick Roy or George Hainsworth?
- Atomic Wedgie

Sawchuk

Holland also wasnt drafted by the microscopic centre of the hockey universe with the mind(frank) spotlight pressure that comes with it. I'd cut Kadri some slack...his problem is in his head right now...his ceiling is much higher than Holland's...and that's not cutting Holland up either, he's fit in well.
- jimi james

And Holland is now in the microscopic centre of the hockey universe now.... and under the same pressure. To switch from no pressure to huge pressure; thats a massive culture shock and can't be any easier on him.

And Holland is now in the microscopic centre of the hockey universe now.... and under the same pressure. To switch from no pressure to huge pressure; thats a massive culture shock and can't be any easier on him.
- twiztedmike

From a scuba perspective, it's much harder to come from a huge pressure environment to a no pressure environment.

So think about that.

I'm out, ladies.

Stats can always be manipulated to favour an argument...

in 2010, Kadri had 12 in 29 games
in 2011, Kadri had 7 in 21 games (19 in 50)

Quite similar point production...
- twiztedmike

right, and he was labeled a bust at the time, and for some reason Holland is the Leaf's anointed #2.

I thought Ek was going to have a blog up by 2? That's what he tweeted....

for the record....i'm not the one who is suggesting a trade for JT.... so i'll leave your bolded comment to describe that person.

but back to your "Expendable" term (i'll forget you called it throwaway earlier). what exactly are you saying about expendables players? that because they are expendable by their team they have no value in a trade for something you need? or that you can only trade an expendable player for an expendable player?
because you talk as if they'd be of no value in this great trade scenario, but then you spin around and say that they have value... but they are expendable to the leafs? or maybe it was in response to another post, maybe one that suggested those 2 for jt? i dunno
again.... great initial post.... everyone else is a dummy.
- Rockhead_37

I'm saying that the Leafs have depth now, in those positions; ie we have a plethora of 2nd/3rd line centres (at different stages in their career, albeit, some are ready, some are about to be ready, some will be ready 1-2 years down the line; these players are Bolland, Bozak, Kadri and Holland)

And Leafs have depth at the D position. Reilly and Phaneuf are above Gardiner on the depth chart now, I think... (And you'll never see me advocating trading Gardiner - I think he's underrated at this point and trading him now is trading him at his lowest point in value)... We have guys like Franson, too. Also, Percy, and Finn who are good D prospects in the minors.

Please understand I'm not saying throw Gardiner and Kadri as throw-ins as a trade or give them away for virtually nothing, or less-than-their value. But also understand I'm trying to say that if you are trading for a player like Tavares, they are not the main pieces of the deal. They are "throw-ins" to even up the trade after the main pieces of the deal are completed (ie. Kessel would have to be a main piece)

And Holland is now in the microscopic centre of the hockey universe now.... and under the same pressure. To switch from no pressure to huge pressure; thats a massive culture shock and can't be any easier on him.
- twiztedmike

I dont think it's the same Mike..Holland doesnt have the same pressure on him that Kadri does...and by the way, Lupul was a throw in in that trade in order to get Gardiner...everything Lupul did was gravy up until he earned his next contract

I thought Ek was going to have a blog up by 2? That's what he tweeted....
- BoTtLePoLiCe

He meant PST. E5 = E2 on the west coast...

He meant PST. E5 = E2 on the west coast...
- lumlums

You tell em Nigel.

right, and he was labeled a bust at the time, and for some reason Holland is the Leaf's anointed #2.
- vermie22

Holland's got 9 points in 20 games for the Leafs, better than Kadri's 7 in 21 games, in Kadri's 2nd season.

And Holland is now in the microscopic centre of the hockey universe now.... and under the same pressure. To switch from no pressure to huge pressure; thats a massive culture shock and can't be any easier on him.
- twiztedmike

the kadri/holland situation is similar to the gardiner/reilly one.
if you listen to media..... kadri and gardiner suck, the leafs cant trade them for a bucket of pucks and a water bottle or they would have already.... but reilly and holland are praised and trotted around as heros..... but make the same mistakes as the other two on a nightly basis.
if they former were traded to latter would be the new whipping boys....
like how the media portrays RC as having hate both of them.... yet one night on CBC RC and JG are on the bench having a good chat and on 24/7 RC is joking with kadri about his x-mas gift...

I dont think it's the same Mike..Holland doesnt have the same pressure on him that Kadri does...and by the way, Lupul was a throw in in that trade in order to get Gardiner...everything Lupul did was gravy up until he earned his next contract
- jimi james

Its not the same 'situation' but the point I'm trying to make; that a player's value 2 months ago is IRRELEVANT to his value today, is illustrated in both different situations.

You tell em Nigel.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

No problem Chad

the kadri/holland situation is similar to the gardiner/reilly one.
if you listen to media..... kadri and gardiner suck, the leafs cant trade them for a bucket of pucks and a water bottle or they would have already.... but reilly and holland are praised and trotted around as heros..... but make the same mistakes as the other two on a nightly basis.
if they former were traded to latter would be the new whipping boys....
like how the media portrays RC as having hate both of them.... yet one night on CBC RC and JG are on the bench having a good chat and on 24/7 RC is joking with kadri about his x-mas gift...
- Rockhead_37

We are straying from the original discussion. I agree with your post here.

No problem Chad
- lumlums

Good show Marmaduke.

He meant PST. E5 = E2 on the west coast...
- lumlums

A "KESSEL TRADE NOT IMMINENT (E2)" would have looked a lot better and less embarassing.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=23064

Holland's got 9 points in 20 games for the Leafs, better than Kadri's 7 in 21 games, in Kadri's 2nd season.
- twiztedmike

Yes Kadri is in a slump, but you don't give up on the guy for a slow 21 games...This is just like all the crazy trade Kessel now talk that was happening when he went on his 10 game no goal doubt.

I like what Holland has done, but I need to see more games from him before I say he is anything more than depth AHL callup for injury purposes at this time

We have all seen what Kadri can bring when on his game, and it is pretty damned good. Maybe RC and management need to realize that his perceived ego/confidence is what potentially makes him the better player he can be, and that constantly trying to berate him is having a negative impact.

Good show Marmaduke.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

Good game Deshawn

Lance Hornby @sunhornby

Gleason on speaking to Kulemin first time since breaking his noes in 2011 fight. "I said no hard feelings. I don't know if he understood."

Good game Deshawn
- lumlums

Hey. Im as bad at basketball as any white guy.

Lance Hornby @sunhornby

Gleason on speaking to Kulemin first time since breaking his noes in 2011 fight. "I said no hard feelings. I don't know if he understood."


- A_Tree

tomorrows headlines.... locker room rift....

Complete bs this "extra pressure in the Toronto market"… its a complete fallacy.

Its called being a pro athlete. Theres pressure everywhere.

Imagine Lebron James saying "no no too much pressure in Miami"... Big time players want the big time stage… Or Kobe not liking LA

If a pro athlete can't manage attention while being paid millions of dollars then go flip burgers.