Your right. Downie on the 4th line is wrong. So is Lecavalier on the 3rd line. I dont know why either has to do with Raffl being on the top line. You can fix the Downie and Lecavalier problem without hurting the top line at all... Watch..

Raffl-Giroux-Voracek
Schenn-Lecavalier-Simmonds
Downie-Couturier-Read
Hartnell-Hall-Rinaldo.
- youarewrong

Sticking Hartnell on the fourth line who's been producing far and away more than guys like Brayden Schenn, Vincent Lecavalier and even Michael Raffl is stupid.

the ducks are a hell of a fun team to watch. an obvious answer, but so are the blackhawks. i still cant help but enjoy hossa. and kane and toews are just flat out studs.

and yeah the canes are pretty boring to watch. jordan staal really hasnt done too much there yet.

yeah i dont have any huge rooting interest in anyone else. honestly, if i was allowed to select one team that would be guaranteed to win the cup but it couldnt be the pens, i would pick the coyotes.
- stayinthefnnet

I enjoy watching the Hawks because their defense is always so involved in the cycle. They, literally, skate circles around the other team.

If I could pick another team to win, it would be Winnipeg. They have shown such strong support to a new team that hasn't accomplished anything yet.

I think every team has experienced that. The Flyers went through a stretch where they were getting the best of the Devils for a while. It was towards the end of the Mike Richards/ Jeff Carter Era. After that trade, things went back to status quo
- PhillySportsGuy

its extremely annoying. but i will say this, boring hockey or not, i give the devils credit. not to step on anyone's toes, but talent wise, they are among the bottom of the barrel. and yet they hang in there and consistently turn in respectable seasons.

you really dont think so? its hard to say scoring in bunches though. not many lines in the league really pot 2 goals a night consistently.

id say just look at the scoring chances they generate. i dont think its a coincidence with raffl on there that they have spiked. if anything, id say its more that hartnell isnt on it.
- stayinthefnnet

You can say whatever you want, I don't agree with you.

Sticking Hartnell on the fourth line who's been producing far and away more than guys like Brayden Schenn, Vincent Lecavalier and even Michael Raffl is stupid.
- Schenn2shine

Hartnell has not been producing at even strength more than anyone in the top 9.

I enjoy watching the Hawks because their defense is always so involved in the cycle. They, literally, skate circles around the other team.

If I could pick another team to win, it would be Winnipeg. They have shown such strong support to a new team that hasn't accomplished anything yet.
- PhillySportsGuy

definitely. from top to bottom they are just a sick team. when its like keith, seabrook, toews, hossa, and sharp/kane out there they can literally do whatever they want.

id be fine with winnipeg too. those fans deserve it. if anything, id go with phoenix because i think one crazy run may be the only thing that could really generate enough interest for what has largely been a pretty good and unappreciated team. with the jets, i think those fans will remain ardent for a good long while

You can say whatever you want, I don't agree with you.
- Schenn2shine

So you think Giroux and Voracek's resurgence have nothing to do with Raffl? You think the same thing would have happened if Hartnell remained on the top line?

You can say whatever you want, I don't agree with you.
- Schenn2shine

and thats not an issue at all. disagreeing and discussing why is like 90 percent of the fun. its far from an exact science

Sticking Hartnell on the fourth line who's been producing far and away more than guys like Brayden Schenn, Vincent Lecavalier and even Michael Raffl is stupid.
- Schenn2shine

I dont think so. He adds about as much as Rinaldo does to the team at ES. Throw Hartnell on the 4th line. Give him PP time, and put him out there the shift after a PK with the other guys that dont PK... Hartnell-Schenn-Lecavalier. He will still get 12 minutes a game, but it will keep our other lines that are clicking together.

definitely. from top to bottom they are just a sick team. when its like keith, seabrook, toews, hossa, and sharp/kane out there they can literally do whatever they want.

id be fine with winnipeg too. those fans deserve it. if anything, id go with phoenix because i think one crazy run may be the only thing that could really generate enough interest for what has largely been a pretty good and unappreciated team. with the jets, i think those fans will remain ardent for a good long while
- stayinthefnnet

I don't think anything can help Pheonix. They have an NHL franchise simply because they are a huge city and even if a small segment watches, it is still more than the smaller cities.

So you think Giroux and Voracek's resurgence have nothing to do with Raffl? You think the same thing would have happened if Hartnell remained on the top line?
- PhillySportsGuy

I think Giroux and Voracek are two very good players and would have found their games regardless of who plays with them. Now we have to get the other lines going.

Everyone is gonna hate this but I would go back to...

Hartnell-Giroux-Voracek
Schenn-Lecavalier-Simmonds
Read-Couturier-Downie
Raffl-Hall-Rinaldo

I feel this restores balance to the line up and Raffl can move up anywhere in a pinch.
- Schenn2shine

Are you kidding me? That top line with raffl has been on fire... Dont fix what isnt broke.

So you think Giroux and Voracek's resurgence have nothing to do with Raffl? You think the same thing would have happened if Hartnell remained on the top line?
- PhillySportsGuy

i just think removing hartnell enabled them to thrive more. what exactly is hartnell's game at the current moment? im not saying he cant recapture it, but right now what exactly is his niche?

he certainly isnt based around speed. he's a liability for 2 guys with wheels such as voracek and giroux in that department. he doesnt really bang the crease anymore, which was his forte. he doesnt show the power to bull to the net like a lucic type. hes not the grinder winning a ton of board battles for loose pucks. he really just looks like a guy who is 2 seconds late to the zone which slows the entire play down and all but ruins opportunities for quick transition 2 on 1s, and then once in the zone just drifts around looking for the occasional one timer to shoot wide.

I think Giroux and Voracek are two very good players and would have found their games regardless of who plays with them. Now we have to get the other lines going.
- Schenn2shine

I think it's too much of a coincidence to say Raffl has had no part in their resurgence. Hartnell hasn't done anything this year at even strength. He doesn't even crash the net or create havoc like he used to. I don't remember the last time he started a scrum.

i just think removing hartnell enabled them to thrive more. what exactly is hartnell's game at the current moment? im not saying he cant recapture it, but right now what exactly is his niche?

he certainly isnt based around speed. he's a liability for 2 guys with wheels such as voracek and giroux in that department. he doesnt really bang the crease anymore, which was his forte. he doesnt show the power to bull to the net like a lucic type. hes not the grinder winning a ton of board battles for loose pucks. he really just looks like a guy who is 2 seconds late to the zone which slows the entire play down and all but ruins opportunities for quick transition 2 on 1s, and then once in the zone just drifts around looking for the occasional one timer to shoot wide.
- stayinthefnnet

If you look back at last night. The pass that led to Giroux's partial breakaway goal was by Raffl. It had to be right on the tape. There is no way Hartnell delivers a good pass in that spot. In fact, he probably winds up for one of his slap shot passes.

I think Giroux and Voracek are two very good players and would have found their games regardless of who plays with them. Now we have to get the other lines going.
- Schenn2shine

so if the objective is to get the other lines going, and the way to do that is to get raffl off of it and substitute hartnell, doesnt that kind of show that raffl is at least in some part a catalyst and hartnell a burden?

Are you kidding me? That top line with raffl has been on fire... Dont fix what isnt broke.
- JoeRussomanno

That's the thing, the top line isn't on fire. They had a really good game last night but not on fire. Wayne Simmonds had three games in a row where he scored two goals a piece. That's being on fire.

If you look back at last night. The pass that led to Giroux's partial breakaway goal was by Raffl. It had to be right on the tape. There is no way Hartnell delivers a good pass in that spot. In fact, he probably winds up for one of his slap shot passes.
- PhillySportsGuy

you dont have to convince me pal haha like i said, im hoping hartnell weasels his way back on that line and does the old ball and chain act.

so if the objective is to get the other lines going, and the way to do that is to get raffl off of it and substitute hartnell, doesnt that kind of show that raffl is at least in some part a catalyst and hartnell a burden?
- stayinthefnnet

Let me ask you this. Why is Downie not playing with Couturier and Read, which has been our most consistent line? I'm not asking you why Steve Downie is on the 4th line, I'm asking you why he's not on the third line with those two players?

That's the thing, the top line isn't on fire. They had a really good game last night but not on fire. Wayne Simmonds had three games in a row where he scored two goals a piece. That's being on fire.
- Schenn2shine

i feel weird defending the trio, but there really arent too many lines out there that seem to be generating more opportunities night in and night out right now than the three of them.

im a huge fan of simmonds, but that was a streak that he likely wont sniff again all year. actual goals are very fluky. the continuous presence of quality chances shows good continual pressure and is a good indicator of sustained success

I think it's too much of a coincidence to say Raffl has had no part in their resurgence. Hartnell hasn't done anything this year at even strength. He doesn't even crash the net or create havoc like he used to. I don't remember the last time he started a scrum.
- PhillySportsGuy

Only three of Hartnell's seven goals have been scored on the power play.

That's the thing, the top line isn't on fire. They had a really good game last night but not on fire. Wayne Simmonds had three games in a row where he scored two goals a piece. That's being on fire.
- Schenn2shine

Only 3 Flyers have ever had 3 straight games with multiple goals. By your definition, the Flyers have only had 3 players 'on fire' in their history.

Giroux has averaged about 2 points per game over his 9 game point streak. It coincides with Raffl being added to the line. Voracek also took off and had his 9 game scoring streak snapped last night.

Averaging 2 points per game over 9 games is 'on fire'

Let me ask you this. Why is Downie not playing with Couturier and Read, which has been our most consistent line? I'm not asking you why Steve Downie is on the 4th line, I'm asking you why he's not on the third line with those two players?
- Schenn2shine

if i am the coach of the flyers, he would be. a poster already listed what i would put the lines at.

although if i had that much sway, read would be on his way to pittsburgh, but i digress

dude must be doing something right bagging hilary duff
- stayinthefnnet

he comes from a very wealthy family

Only three of Hartnell's seven goals have been scored on the power play.
- Schenn2shine

So he's averaging 1 even strength goal every 10 games while playing on a line with G and Voracek for much of that time