JT has maintained virtually the same ppg since Vanek has joined. The line is the second highest scoring line in the NHL over the last dozen games....I'm just going to cut and paste this.
- keaner17

So Vanek hasn't made the line BETTER?

XxNYIxX

Lets all start rooting for us to get the #1 pick & these pr!cks will win the cup to spite the fan base!

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

whatever works

whatever works
- Cptmjl

Isles will come in last and lose the 1st overall to edmonton

Yep...
this is where no one holding the ownership and mgmt accountable allows them to focus on something three years from now without being called out on a sub par attempt to ice a decent product today.
I understand that the idea is to build something that will last and the best way to do so is to develop from within, but this is why we don't have that 'winning' culture everyone talks about. Because right now, losing is accepted. They don't have to trade Strome for a top pairing dman right now, just get us a top four guy to solidify the d a bit more and fire the damn coach. At the very least, fire the damn coach to see if we can adjust the system to something that works with this present group.
- keaner17

I think you're quasi giving them credit almost. I think the problem is they suck at their jobs and tons of people have been calling them out, TONS! You may not have been listening but there have been more people calling them out then not for a long time now. Before last year very few did more than snicker at this club. Last year made them easier to bash almost bcs now they were expected to build on it which they so obviously did not. Now of course you'll here more bashing but it's been going on since Snow was handed the keys.

1000%....WRONG

snow doesnt "lose" the trade until a there is a final result with vanek.
if vanek resigns with isles = win
if isles trade him at deadline = win
if vanek walks year end = lose

plain and simple.

to evaluate the trade NOW whether it was a "win" or "loss" (whatever that means) is ridiculous.

im not saying you cant evaluate whether the assets could have be used better or not- im saying evaluating the trade that actually happened cannot be complete until vanek signs his next contract
- LetsGoIsles

If he trades him at the deadline for a late 1st rounder, that's a win?

He would HAVE to get back ATLEAST a 1st rounder, a second rounder & something else.. for it to be a WIN.. correct?

XxNYIxX

They're better at 5x5 play. As for the power play...no way to judge that when we have Amac qbing the power play. Big difference between Vis shooting from the point and Amac missing the net by a country mile. So without question? I beg to differ.
- keaner17

not to mention that when moulson left the isles had 3+ years of chemistry building to get to the point that they were at...vanek has played about 20 games...not exactly a huge sample size to work with...they are still building and will only get better.

Yeah, signing players that can contribute long term to the club and were available a couple yrs ago and now are not. Great plan. If that's their actual plan(which I don't believe btw)it's beyond flawed. So now, in 2015, with all of these prospects playing up to their ceilings(which they won't be after getting tutored by Reasoner and Bouchrad)they are going to throw the missing pieces into the team? Come on man.
- Cptmjl

Well, frankly this is the only logical reason for why Garth has done things as he does. It's been the same mantra since we started this rebuild. Guys like PA on RW...replace PA with Boyes 1 year....replace Boyes with PMB 1 year. Those are stop gaps. It's all done to fill that role until the eventual prospect who was drafted to take that role is here.

I'm not telling you the plan is going to work..it's risky because it depends soley on the development of prospects which as you point out, hasn't been our strong point.

So Vanek hasn't made the line BETTER?

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

at 5x5,..yes he has.

not to mention that when moulson left the isles had 3+ years of chemistry building to get to the point that they were at...vanek has played about 20 games...not exactly a huge sample size to work with...they are still building and will only get better.
- LetsGoIsles

That's the hope!

I for one hope he resigns just so this team doesn't look any more foolish.

XxNYIxX

If he trades him at the deadline for a late 1st rounder, that's a win?

He would HAVE to get back ATLEAST a 1st rounder, a second rounder & something else.. for it to be a WIN.. correct?

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

not in my eyes...bc vanek > moulson

we get the better player (that costs something) the time with the isles also includes negotiation time to try to win him over to sign on long term, again that costs something.

Well, frankly this is the only logical reason for why Garth has done things as he does. It's been the same mantra since we started this rebuild. Guys like PA on RW...replace PA with Boyes 1 year....replace Boyes with PMB 1 year. Those are stop gaps. It's all done to fill that role until the eventual prospect who was drafted to take that role is here.

I'm not telling you the plan is going to work..it's risky because it depends soley on the development of prospects which as you point out, hasn't been our strong point.
- keaner17

I think this word describes why your theory is wrong . As for the second bold I 100% agree and I'm probably more concerned about that then how the matt Moulson trade affected Tavares's heart.

Yep...
this is where no one holding the ownership and mgmt accountable allows them to focus on something three years from now without being called out on a sub par attempt to ice a decent product today.
I understand that the idea is to build something that will last and the best way to do so is to develop from within, but this is why we don't have that 'winning' culture everyone talks about. Because right now, losing is accepted. They don't have to trade Strome for a top pairing dman right now, just get us a top four guy to solidify the d a bit more and fire the damn coach. At the very least, fire the damn coach to see if we can adjust the system to something that works with this present group.
- keaner17

this is why it encourages me that the Barclays people are paying the Isles to play there - if the team puts out a lineup and record similar to this there will be people asking questions and putting feet to fire. Until then...we're stuck with this.

not in my eyes...bc vanek > moulson

we get the better player (that costs something) the time with the isles also includes negotiation time to try to win him over to sign on long term, again that costs something.
- LetsGoIsles

So im asking in your eyes... what are those rights worth?

What do you feel is the absolute least Snow can get for Vanek at the deadline and be considered a win?

XxNYIxX

I think you're quasi giving them credit almost. I think the problem is they suck at their jobs and tons of people have been calling them out, TONS! You may not have been listening but there have been more people calling them out then not.
- Cptmjl

I think you're completely wrong

As for sucking at their jobs...I can't dispute that. I think Wang is a lousy owner. I think Garth has done an average job at best, but also recognize the major obstacles he's faced in his position.

My comment was that they're perfectly comfortable to not make major moves to fix the present form of the team and make it a 'steady as she goes' concept and wait 3 more years for Reinhart, Pulock, Mayfield, Sundstrom and company to join because they don't have to answer to anyone.

That's the hope!

I for one hope he resigns just so this team doesn't look any more foolish.

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

AMEN...that was the concern I voiced about the trade on day one. This is Ryan Smyth all over again if he leaves and this team takes a huge hit to a PR image they've been trying to repair for 7 years.

I think you're completely wrong

As for sucking at their jobs...I can't dispute that. I think Wang is a lousy owner. I think Garth has done an average job at best, but also recognize the major obstacles he's faced in his position.

My comment was that they're perfectly comfortable to not make major moves to fix the present form of the team and make it a 'steady as she goes' concept and wait 3 more years for Reinhart, Pulock, Mayfield, Sundstrom and company to join because they don't have to answer to anyone.
- keaner17

Now it's three more years? What will it be three years from now?

at 5x5,..yes he has.
- keaner17

absolutely agree. That line isn't pinned in our own zone for minute long shifts, and Vanek can actually carry the puck into the zone and doesn't just sit in the crease and wait for JT and KO to go get it.

So im asking in your eyes... what are those rights worth?

What do you feel is the absolute least Snow can get for Vanek at the deadline and be considered a win?

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

NHL ready prospect and a 1st or 2nd rounder. If we can get a prospect who is valued along with recouping one of those picks, I'm satisfied.

not to mention that when moulson left the isles had 3+ years of chemistry building to get to the point that they were at...vanek has played about 20 games...not exactly a huge sample size to work with...they are still building and will only get better.
- LetsGoIsles

I have this feeling it's going to stop building sometime around the trade deadline?

absolutely agree. That line isn't pinned in our own zone for minute long shifts, and Vanek can actually carry the puck into the zone and doesn't just sit in the crease and wait for JT and KO to go get it.
- Isles_since_6

It's the only line not pinned in our zone

So im asking in your eyes... what are those rights worth?

What do you feel is the absolute least Snow can get for Vanek at the deadline and be considered a win?

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

IMO, and possibly only mine, the trade is a win if Vanek resigns. If he doesn't and we move him at the deadline then it's a loss. Regardless, I do not miss Moulson.

Now it's three more years? What will it be three years from now?
- Cptmjl

Good question...2 more now since I guess that's when we hit Barclay. This isn't some new concept. I've been saying this here for 3 years now and a couple of years prior to that at Yahoo.

I don't think Wang has any interest in doing anything but staying the course until he can turn a profit. It's what businessmen do.

NHL ready prospect and a 1st or 2nd rounder. If we can get a prospect who is valued along with recouping one of those picks, I'm satisfied.
- keaner17

OK well that is ALOT more then he just said...

So you feel that is the least we can get with it still being a win?

XxNYIxX

AMEN...that was the concern I voiced about the trade on day one. This is Ryan Smyth all over again if he leaves and this team takes a huge hit to a PR image they've been trying to repair for 7 years.
- keaner17

yet Snow looks like he did everything in his power to not facilitate Vanek resigning? He should've never made that trade if he didn't have the know how or knowledge to follow it up with something to solidify him resigning. It's beyond stupid, he should be fired for that alone forget about countless other reasons.

It's the only line not pinned in our zone
- Cptmjl

they still have bad shifts, but they're not pinned in forever because Moulson can't cover a man...we either get it out after 30 seconds or surrender a goal lol