What year was the lockout when crosby was drafted? The era of hockey we are currently in. Hockey is a different sport and how players were handled than it was in the 90's. Comparing hockey, even though it wasn't that long ago, to now is like comparing Ice Hockey to Roller hockey. Not even close.
- Glak18

so you're like a penguin fan and just started watching hockey when crosby started playing?

Name any team in the league worst or best. Pick a player and ask yourself could he still take over a game himself consistently on the worst team and still do that plus more on the best team? If yes, he is a franchise player in my mind. Is Kunitz a 40 goal scorer on any team in the league? The environment and situation has a lot to do with player stats, probably the most. The best do it no matter the situation. Could Giroux do that? Has Crosby gone through droughts of dozens of games where his play is criticized so much that Pittsburgh wonders if they should trade him? Franchise players don't ever have those moments.
- Glak18

not to sound biased, but holding giroux to crosby is pretty laughable to begin with. if that is the standard, he is doomed to fail.

but yes, giroux HAS the ability to take over games from time to time. but to be fair, there are tons of guys with that ability. its the ones who do it consistently that make themselves franchise players. maybe you and i are operating off of a different meaning of that phrase. crosby is the best player in the league right now. but there are a bunch of guys id say can be considered franchise players. i realize he doesnt have the size of these guys, but why cant giroux put up numbers such as guys like getzlaf and thornton? to me, its just a matter of if he has the mental makeup to do it.

well, people thinking coots is going to be datsyuk are fooling themselves and deserve to be disappointed. but i see no reason why he cant be right around what jordan staal is? and no, hes never going to be a 40 goal scorer, but thats a damn good player. those are the guys you win with. if anything, i think schenn has been the more disappointing of the two. i dont see him able to be a center. just dont see the vision or playmaking ability. but a top 6 20 to 25 goal winger? that is very possible. i dont know what people are expecting.
- stayinthefnnet

At least Schenn has put a few pucks in the net this season.

well, people thinking coots is going to be datsyuk are fooling themselves and deserve to be disappointed. but i see no reason why he cant be right around what jordan staal is? and no, hes never going to be a 40 goal scorer, but thats a damn good player. those are the guys you win with. if anything, i think schenn has been the more disappointing of the two. i dont see him able to be a center. just dont see the vision or playmaking ability. but a top 6 20 to 25 goal winger? that is very possible. i dont know what people are expecting.
- stayinthefnnet

You basically took the words out of my mouth on both players and opinion. That same opinions you have I had and continue have since the trade and draft both players came here. Too many people read articles about who the top prospects are and don't judge by their actual abilities they demonstrate on the ice. They assume someone else knows more than them and takes their opinions. Both Schenns have ALWAYS been knocked down because of their skating, that was LA's biggest gripe when he was developing him and the reason he was traded. Unfortunately he has been used wrong in Philly because of the player he was traded for.

You basically took the words out of my mouth on both players and opinion. That same opinions you have I had and continue have since the trade and draft both players came here. Too many people read articles about who the top prospects are and don't judge by their actual abilities they demonstrate on the ice. They assume someone else knows more than them and takes their opinions. Both Schenns have ALWAYS been knocked down because of their skating, that was LA's biggest gripe when he was developing him and the reason he was traded. Unfortunately he has been used wrong in Philly because of the player he was traded for.
- Glak18

i think those are very realistic expectations for both of those guys. and while it would be nice for you guys if somehow schenn became a 40 goal guy, it doesnt have to be so for them both to be deemed successes. those ceilings would be very valuable players on any contender.

not to sound biased, but holding giroux to crosby is pretty laughable to begin with. if that is the standard, he is doomed to fail.

but yes, giroux HAS the ability to take over games from time to time. but to be fair, there are tons of guys with that ability. its the ones who do it consistently that make themselves franchise players. maybe you and i are operating off of a different meaning of that phrase. crosby is the best player in the league right now. but there are a bunch of guys id say can be considered franchise players. i realize he doesnt have the size of these guys, but why cant giroux put up numbers such as guys like getzlaf and thornton? to me, its just a matter of if he has the mental makeup to do it.
- stayinthefnnet

That's why I kept using the word consistent. Ok Crosby is generational, which is rare to come by. AO is a franchise goal scorer, he has shown many flaws, but even in slumps the other team knows when he is on the ice. Franchise players aren't guys you hope improve or match what they did in the past, they just do it without question. One big year can show potential, but you don't tag a player franchise until you think back and say he's been doing this for 3 years now. Getzlaf and Thornton are great examples. Spezza is a great player, but I would pick tons of players ahead of him to build a team.

At least Schenn has put a few pucks in the net this season.
- Dkos

true. not that it totally justifies everything, but schenn was getting some pretty quality minutes with top 6 guys. couturier is pretty much out there with guys like adam hall and rinaldo. not too many offensive opportunities are going to arise from those shifts. i think coots does have a little more offensive potential than hes shown, but hes not going to be good enough to get blood from a stone.

i guess i feel relative to their usage and roles, coots has been better at his than schenn at his

so you're like a penguin fan and just started watching hockey when crosby started playing?
- 2Real

Really? You're that dense to not know the game is different now than in 2000? Actually I have only been following since 86. I know it's not as long as some of the grandpas on here, but I've been in hockey for a long enough time. I doubt you're even in your 30s.

That's why I kept using the word consistent. Ok Crosby is generational, which is rare to come by. AO is a franchise goal scorer, he has shown many flaws, but even in slumps the other team knows when he is on the ice. Franchise players aren't guys you hope improve or match what they did in the past, they just do it without question. One big year can show potential, but you don't tag a player franchise until you think back and say he's been doing this for 3 years now. Getzlaf and Thornton are great examples. Spezza is a great player, but I would pick tons of players ahead of him to build a team.
- Glak18

when he slumps, yes you know he is on the ice. but for bad reasons. which is what giroux is starting to lapse into. which he cannot allow to happen. he is definitely in the upper level of guys, but he isnt that exceptional in any one area (like OV with scoring) that he can afford to be a liability in other areas when he isnt producing points.

i think a lot of spezza's issues have been health related. if he was consistently healthy, i think he would be a decent comparable for what giroux should at least be. spezza, getzlaf, thornton all have it in them to be that 25 to 30 goal, 60 to 70 assist guy. no, maybe they arent "generational" but thats the point of generational guys. they are rare. after that, you have these next wave of guys that can carry a team.

true. not that it totally justifies everything, but schenn was getting some pretty quality minutes with top 6 guys. couturier is pretty much out there with guys like adam hall and rinaldo. not too many offensive opportunities are going to arise from those shifts. i think coots does have a little more offensive potential than hes shown, but hes not going to be good enough to get blood from a stone.

i guess i feel relative to their usage and roles, coots has been better at his than schenn at his
- stayinthefnnet

You also have to understand most Flyer fans just look at the box score to determine if they had a good game or not.

You also have to understand most Flyer fans just look at the box score to determine if they had a good game or not.
- Glak18

typical flyers fans are one of the main reasons i dislike the team. however, on here, the types of attitudes i dislike are typically far from the norm. so i try to not assume anything about anyone's point of view or opinion until ive heard it out

Really? You're that dense to not know the game is different now than in 2000? Actually I have only been following since 86. I know it's not as long as some of the grandpas on here, but I've been in hockey for a long enough time. I doubt you're even in your 30s.
- Glak18

i tell you you're wrong and you throw around personal insults
i know i wont his argument

Bottom line, the problems sit in the suites and inevitably it spread to the bench. It has been happening over a period of several seasons and will take as long to fix. What should be alarming to all fans is that mistakes, that will last a long time, are still being made and likely about to be committed again, in short order. The trade value of players drops daily, potential new coaches or GM's and even trading partners cast an increasingly cautious eye, regarding the franchise and owner that boasts, "we don't care what anyone thinks", and never have. Firing Lavi just a few games in was not a smart way to kick off the season either. How do you fire an owner? The only thing that might work is to stay home.

Only watched the first two periods.

While the offense is a big concern, I do like the strategy of trying to generate goals from the point.

Huge problem is that the d-men never get the puck on net, or get it blocked. Really does hinder the ability to get second chances.

Only watched the first two periods.

While the offense is a big concern, I do like the strategy of trying to generate goals from the point.

Huge problem is that the d-men never get the puck on net, or get it blocked. Really does hinder the ability to get second chances.
- flyer_nutter

definitely from the kris letang school of thought there. totally frustrating.

Bottom line, the problems sit in the suites and inevitably it spread to the bench. It has been happening over a period of several seasons and will take as long to fix. What should be alarming to all fans is that mistakes, that will last a long time, are still being made and likely about to be committed again, in short order. The trade value of players drops daily, potential new coaches or GM's and even trading partners cast an increasingly cautious eye, regarding the franchise and owner that boasts, "we don't care what anyone thinks", and never have. Firing Lavi just a few games in was not a smart way to kick off the season either. How do you fire an owner? The only thing that might work is to stay home.
- TJ

Somewhat with you here. I dont think anyone here fears a bad season. Or having to make changes.

What I personally fear, is the kind of "fix" upper management decides to do. I dont trust them at this point. I do not believe the individual pieces here are complete trash, nor that the guys dont care. They do. Which on one hand makes me side with the players at this point. Its a bad mix, and management has put them in a position to fail.

typical flyers fans are one of the main reasons i dislike the team. however, on here, the types of attitudes i dislike are typically far from the norm. so i try to not assume anything about anyone's point of view or opinion until ive heard it out
- stayinthefnnet

That's stupid. You should just tell people they're stupid. That's what I do.

well, people thinking coots is going to be datsyuk are fooling themselves and deserve to be disappointed. but i see no reason why he cant be right around what jordan staal is? and no, hes never going to be a 40 goal scorer, but thats a damn good player. those are the guys you win with. if anything, i think schenn has been the more disappointing of the two. i dont see him able to be a center. just dont see the vision or playmaking ability. but a top 6 20 to 25 goal winger? that is very possible. i dont know what people are expecting.
- stayinthefnnet

not blowing it wide from 6 feet in front of a wide open net in a "must win" game, for starters. not to worry though, when he ends up on the penguins he'll be scoring from the red line. every time i see him and simmonds playing like they never saw a hockey rink before, i want to personally thank holmgren for furthering the career of mike richards.

At least Schenn has put a few pucks in the net this season.
- Dkos

what happened last week when he missed an open net from below the circles or tonight when he's all alone w/ the goalie and the puck comes to him? oh wait, is it yet another guy who can't handle the intensity of playing in philly or does he just stink?

this is what a good team does

down 3 - 1 get hustle goals from players like tyler kennedy and thomas hertl

give up another goal

get the tying goal by a diving tommy wingles from the far post

this is what a good team does

down 3 - 1 get hustle goals from players like tyler kennedy and thomas hertl

give up another goal

get the tying goal by a diving tommy wingles from the far post
- 2Real

Like watching the Seahawks game. Inevitable. Though a blown call later and Sabres won

New blog posted.

Bright spot: Scott Laughton is now tied for 9th in the OHL in scoring. He has 3 or 4 less games played than everyone above him in the rankings.
- JAKEw1234

He's been dominating games in every facet. He really ought to be in at least the AHL now, and you know how I feel about the age eligibility rule for that league.

Re: Paul Holmgren, I still think he's going to get the rest of this season and then things will play out accordingly.

this has to be the worst Flyer team I have seen and I started following the team in 1968
- vejim

If only because of Mason giving them a chance to win, I actually feel better about this team than last year's. The total lack of goal scoring and the tendency to make the big mistake on D -- even if the volume of them are clearly down from the latter Laviolette teams--- are still maddening.