Do you beleive Bill that a player can mature and grow? And learn to be more disciplined. It was how many years ago that he was here? Things change. And Downie deserves to be given a chance as far as I'm concerned. Maybe from an emotional standpoint, you don't like the deal. But from a hockyey standpoint, it's a good deal.
- MJL

Downie has 36 pims this year. Discipline seems to be off the charts.

Joe.. never did I say he was a great player. I think he is a solid player.. yes, but not a great player..

Statistically over his last 77 games (thanks Plind for doing the homework yesterday)... He potted 14 goals and added 28 assists. 42 points in the NHL is likely nearly above average for a 2nd line player... But, believe what you wanna believe...
- jak521

He's mediocre just like the last two teams he's been on... That's great Colorado got off to a huge start... Let me know where they are in the spring... Prolly playing golf with our squad and watching the playoffs later.

Talbot was in no way shape or form a top 9 in terms of scoring... But he was an excellent pk specialist and checking forward let alone being quite durable... If they wanted downie they should have moved something like Rinaldo or got better for talbot.
- JoeRussomanno

Colorado wanted Talbot so they weren't going to accept someone else. Look, I LOVE Talbot and am very disappointed he was traded but that doesn't cloud my thinking that Downie can help the team. He makes the top 9 better.

You can sit here and tell me how great a player is, but if he don't deliver then he's only as good as the numbers and sow or has been playing quite a while now ... He's way overrated and he's injury prone and he takes dumb penalties... Ned I go on? But if you wanna sit there and believe a guy who barely pots a dozen goals is a top line forward then be my guest...
- JoeRussomanno

He had a shoulder injury he toughed out through the season and a knee injury last season. He's had fewer injuries in an 8+ year career than Giroux has had in the last two seasons but I never hear anyone calling him injury prone.

I'm really having a hard time looking at those stats and saying "yea he's the missing link..." Or "top 6 forward"...
- JoeRussomanno

top 9...remember a scout watching him in Jrs, "you win with guys like this". at this point, staying healthy is the big concern...

Downie has taken as many penalties as he has drawn thus far this season at even strength.

You can sit here and tell me how great a player is, but if he don't deliver then he's only as good as the numbers and sow or has been playing quite a while now ... He's way overrated and he's injury prone and he takes dumb penalties... Ned I go on? But if you wanna sit there and believe a guy who barely pots a dozen goals is a top line forward then be my guest...
- JoeRussomanno

Well he hasn't played a game yet in a Flyers uniform. Why not wait and see if he delivers? Or doesn't he get a chance to see if he can? How is he overrated. Calling Downie a top 9 player is overrating him? How exactly? Yes, you should go on Joe, because you haven't made a valid point yet in my opinion. The only thing that is clear is that you don't like Downie, and it's clouding objectivity.

Yet he keeps finding himself on the top line in Colorado and Tampa. It's not just throwing the three best players on the ice, you need to find a mix that works and often times a top line need someone to get their nose dirty.
- mayorofangrytown

Fair enough. Replacing Talbot and Rosehill with Downie, and Hall is an upgrade. We shall see how it plays out.

Well he hasn't played a game yet in a Flyers uniform. Why not wait and see if he delivers? Or doesn't he get a chance to see if he can? How is he overrated. Calling Downie a top 9 player is overrating him? How exactly? Yes, you should go on Joe, because you haven't made a valid point yet in my opinion. The only thing that is clear is that you don't like Downie, and it's clouding objectivity.
- MJL

I'm gonna root for him no doubt... I like having some edge but I think homer fired and missed big time...

Wow, and after Matt Duchene said losing him last year was the reason they played so poorly just over a month ago.
- mayorofangrytown

plenty of guys are integral to winning and their teammates know it and still don't like them.

Talbot was in no way shape or form a top 9 in terms of scoring... But he was an excellent pk specialist and checking forward let alone being quite durable... If they wanted downie they should have moved something like Rinaldo or got better for talbot.
- JoeRussomanno

You had me believing that your expectations were realistic until you said this.

He had a shoulder injury he toughed out through the season and a knee injury last season. He's had fewer injuries in an 8+ year career than Giroux has had in the last two seasons but I never hear anyone calling him injury prone.
- mayorofangrytown

Joe doesn't like Giroux, not sure this response will take.

giroux has been suspended more times over the last 4 years than downie

1

Joe doesn't like Giroux, not sure this response will take.
- BulliesPhan87

Never said I don't like giroux just the fact is he's over rated and over paid...

Downie has 36 pims this year. Discipline seems to be off the charts.
- PLindbergh31

Have to look and see where those penalties are coming from. Are they penalties that come from playing a hard game, and competing physically? Or are they penalties coming from play completely out of control like he did when he was first with the Flyers?

Joe doesn't like Giroux, not sure this response will take.
- BulliesPhan87

OMG QUIT CALLING HIM A ROCKET RICHARD WINNER

Never said I don't like giroux just the fact is he's over rated and over paid...
- JoeRussomanno

*soon to be overpaid

OMG QUIT CALLING HIM A ROCKET RICHARD WINNER
- -davies-

Uh ok

Fair enough. Replacing Talbot and Rosehill with Downie, and Hall is an upgrade. We shall see how it plays out.
- PLindbergh31

Pretty much this.

Laughton was going to be eating into Talbot's role next season and beyond as well... irrespective of what they decide to do w/ Downie after this year.

*soon to be overpaid
- BulliesPhan87

You got me there

I'm gonna root for him no doubt... I like having some edge but I think homer fired and missed big time...
- JoeRussomanno

Looking at the trade player for player, the Flyers clearly got the better, more talented player.

I'm gonna root for him no doubt... I like having some edge but I think homer fired and missed big time...
- JoeRussomanno

the plyrs involved don't fit that description

maybe in a couple of weeks some that do will be available.

Downie has 36 pims this year. Discipline seems to be off the charts.
- PLindbergh31

He had a game misconduct on one play and two fights. Twenty of those minutes didn't even leave his team short.

Do you beleive Bill that a player can mature and grow? And learn to be more disciplined. It was how many years ago that he was here? Things change. And Downie deserves to be given a chance as far as I'm concerned. Maybe from an emotional standpoint, you don't like the deal. But from a hockyey standpoint, it's a good deal.
- MJL

Apparently he's been a great contributor to his two most recent teams. Yet they have both found reason to shed him. That adds up to 3 chances by my math. But you're right, it can take some people a LONNNNNG time, even a lifetime, to mature. The Flyers have always loved bringing their ex-wives to the party anyways. Why should this surprise any of us I suppose.

OMG QUIT CALLING HIM A ROCKET RICHARD WINNER
- -davies-

I know he won't score a goal this year, because my expectations are reasonable.