so many people put little thought into the position the flyers were at when they made that deal as well.

they had 6 forwards under 25 that had come off seasons of 25 goal potential

Giroux
Read
Vorachek
Simmonds
Schenn
JVR

and had NO physical defenseman under 25 that had the potential to play a top 4 shutdown role.

they traded from a perceived area of strength for something they wanted. at that point, i think we ALL figured those 6 could score at least 20, and some added Coutourier into the mix as well.

i liked the Schenn trade for that reason. he's not scoring goals, the NHL's most coveted stat, on the NHL's most viewed team. plus he's having a bad year.

EVEN IF those remaining under 25 forwards would stick to that potential pretty much the lot of us expected, i doubt as many Flyers fans would be female doging over the trade at this moment
- eshake

They had 3 solid, stay at home defensemen who were either 26 or 27 at the time and two of them had just signed 4 year extensions.

I don't mind adding Luke Schenn. I like him. But they should have gotten more for JvR and the fact is, it was far more pressing to replace Carle, who hit UFA a week later or to acquire a future replacement for the 36 year old Timonen that it was to add another stay at home defenseman.

Same thing that was said in Toronto, he's getting plenty of chances and his luck will turn around.
- mayorofangrytown

Well, it was JVR, a favorite whipping boy and Ranger fan, so he'd likely have been the target of the day every day.

is this directed at me??? because ill have you know i am not juding him in any way by this action he did as a kid so please stop directing things directly at me.
- Crimsoninja

JvR is playing well right now, but if there is anything we know about him it's that he can go long stretches without scoring. Is he suddenly Mr. Consistency? Maybe, but I'm going to wait another year before I assume that he's taken it to the next level.

Likewise with Schenn. He played well last year, and isn't playing too good this year. But neither is the team as a whole. If the Flyers as a team were playing good hockey then you can bet your bottom dollar that Schenn would look a lot better, as well.
- FlyerGuy

With JvR.. that is exactly what will happen.. Its typical of bigger players to deal with inconsistency early in their careers.. he is just showing the tip of the iceberg IMO.. he is gonna be a beast for a lonnggg time.

i dont get it we trade a old injured player for a younger player with higher upside and people rage

Yes, if everything goes exactly the Flyers way the trade could look good.

Reality: it's going the other way. There's a better chance that the small sample of Schenn being a top 4 defenseman was an aberration than JVR being a first line power forward with great hands.

Schenn's been a 15 minute or less defenseman for all but about 20 games of his career.
- mayorofangrytown

that said the best stretch of his career was in those 20 games when he was getting big minutes. I do feel as tho the more a player with talent plays, the better they are.

Yes, if everything goes exactly the Flyers way the trade could look good.

Reality: it's going the other way. There's a better chance that the small sample of Schenn being a top 4 defenseman was an aberration than JVR being a first line power forward with great hands.

Schenn's been a 15 minute or less defenseman for all but about 20 games of his career.
- mayorofangrytown

And Schenn's decreased minutes are a direct result of him not being in skating form for the Chief's system...if he gets his legs going again (not that he is blazing fast) his ice time will be back and I doubt he comes in any more seasons not ready...

i dont get it we trade a old injured player for a younger player with higher upside and people rage
- 2Real

We boo Santa too...

Yes, if everything goes exactly the Flyers way the trade could look good.

Reality: it's going the other way. There's a better chance that the small sample of Schenn being a top 4 defenseman was an aberration than JVR being a first line power forward with great hands.

Schenn's been a 15 minute or less defenseman for all but about 20 games of his career.
- mayorofangrytown

That is factually untrue.

Luke Schenn has played 5 complete NHL Seasons. He has averaged well over 20 minutes a game in 3 out of the 5 Seasons. And in the other two Seasons, he averaged over 16 minutes a game.

And Schenn's decreased minutes are a direct result of him not being is skating form for the Chief's system...if he gets his legs going again (not that he is blazing fast) his ice time will be back and I doubt he comes in any more seasons not ready...
- JW98FlyerFan

What about his time in Toronto?

that said the best stretch of his career was in those 20 games when he was getting big minutes. I do feel as tho the more a player with talent plays, the better they are.
- nastyflyergirl

I agree to an extent.. I think you are bound to get a few more bounces... I personally dont think Schenn is dynamic enough to be the player that we all hope he becomes..

What about his time in Toronto?
- jak521

Don't care about Toronto...they traded him away, so no chance he was getting 20 on that team if they didn't value him...

The Schenn brothers suffer from the same problem. Theyre projected to be things they were never going to be. L. Schenn was never going to be Foote and B. Schenn was never going to be Richards.

Hyped up to increase trade value.

so many people put little thought into the position the flyers were at when they made that deal as well.

they had 6 forwards under 25 that had come off seasons of 25 goal potential

Giroux
Read
Vorachek
Simmonds
Schenn
JVR

and had NO physical defenseman under 25 that had the potential to play a top 4 shutdown role.

they traded from a perceived area of strength for something they wanted. at that point, i think we ALL figured those 6 could score at least 20, and some added Coutourier into the mix as well.

i liked the Schenn trade for that reason. he's not scoring goals, the NHL's most coveted stat, on the NHL's most viewed team. plus he's having a bad year.

EVEN IF those remaining under 25 forwards would stick to that potential pretty much the lot of us expected, i doubt as many Flyers fans would be female doging over the trade at this moment
- eshake

Great post and very well said.

Same thing that was said in Toronto, he's getting plenty of chances and his luck will turn around.
- mayorofangrytown

By some, but not by all. We all know that if JVR was here and slumping, he would get ripped. He got ripped here before he even played a game!

The Schenn brothers suffer from the same problem. Theyre projected to be things they were never going to be. L. Schenn was never going to be Foote and B. Schenn was never going to be Richards.

Hyped up to increase trade value.
- Flyersgod

So hyped at the age of 16-17 to increase trade value at the age of 20-22?

Yeah, that makes sense.

The Schenn brothers suffer from the same problem. Theyre projected to be things they were never going to be. L. Schenn was never going to be Foote and B. Schenn was never going to be Richards.

Hyped up to increase trade value.
- Flyersgod

I think you're right on Luke, but jebus I hope we haven't seen the best of Brayden... If so, man we need a re do on the Richards trade.

With JvR.. that is exactly what will happen.. Its typical of bigger players to deal with inconsistency early in their careers.. he is just showing the tip of the iceberg IMO.. he is gonna be a beast for a lonnggg time.
- jak521

And it's typical of young defenseman to deal with inconsistency early in their careers also.

So hyped at the age of 16-17 to increase trade value at the age of 20-22?

Yeah, that makes sense.
- Tomahawk

bro teams always draft guys in the top 5 as a longterm plan to trick other teams into thinking theyre good

The Schenn brothers suffer from the same problem. Theyre projected to be things they were never going to be. L. Schenn was never going to be Foote and B. Schenn was never going to be Richards.

Hyped up to increase trade value.
- Flyersgod

Do you honestly beleive that the hype that was written about from fans and analysts factored into the trades?

So hyped at the age of 16-17 to increase trade value at the age of 20-22?

Yeah, that makes sense.
- Tomahawk

Exactly!

What about his time in Toronto?
- jak521

Also, in Toronto, he had 4 seasons, 1 at 21:30 and 1 22:30, then 1 at 16:50 and 1 at 16:02 and they fip flopped year to year...sounds like they didn't know how to use him, but the key was he played almost every game...can't say that for too many of the D men we have had on the team...that is one thing that is not on the stats sheet, luke doesn't (knock on wood) get hurt and miss games...

Man, I forgot how good we was in junior.
- Tomahawk

Coming late so I realize this has already been beaten to death, but it was painful yesterday watching Sarah Baicker try to explain to people who Steve Downie was.

She clearly had never understood what Downie was, and tried to make this clumsy comparison to Zac Rinaldo.

I wanted somebody to walk over to her, calmly but firmly take the microphone out of her hand, and tell her that Steve Downie having a nasty temper doesn't make him Zac Rinaldo any faster than Nicklas Grossmann being a Swedish defenseman makes him Nicklas Lidstrom.

bro teams always draft guys in the top 5 as a longterm plan to trick other teams into thinking theyre good
- Crimsoninja

poop, we've got catch up to play.

Looking forward to Scott Laughton, i.e. Indestructible Eric Lindros 2.1

And it's typical of young defenseman to deal with inconsistency early in their careers also.
- MJL

Absolutely agree. More so with d-men actually.

The problem though, is you have to show flashes of a dynamic skill set.. and while Schenn has shown capable of being a steady NHL d-dman, he hasnt shown ANYTHING dynamic.