What about games 1-5?
- peddy-93

when bozak played much better than grabo and took most of the draws? what are you referring to?

You honestly think losing grabo was a loss? wow some leaf fans will never be happy.

he's a dumb hockey player, who is awful defensively. Hence, -10 in the playoffs. There's a reason bozak CONSISTENTLY leads the forwards in ice time on this team, unless you think carlyle is an idiot?

Bozak does so much more for the leafs (not saying another team, but with our roster) than grabo does it's not funny. And let's see how the face off #s look at year end. The last thing the leafs need is offense, which is all grabo can do.
- clark_griswold

you do realize grabovski is 35th overall in the faceoff dot with a win percentage 52.7%

bozak: 65th with a whopping 46.2%

before you go rambling on about how bozak is better in every other facet of the game you might want to go actually check your facts.

It cant be the third line. RC was an idiot for playing him on the 3rd. Mr Oates would never be that stupid.
- Bigzby

just looked it up, hes on the third line and doesn't even get any powerplay ice time. backstrom is on the first line and laich is on the 2nd line.

ya... cause he used to win faceoffs. that's it.

Grabo was -10 in the playoffs cause he was put out with checkers to try and shutdown he Krecji line, and he's not a checking center. Kulemin was -9 and he's the best defensive forward on the team after McClement.

Grabo is better defensively than Bozak. Carlyle thinks so too, that's why Grabo got all the defensive starts. (obviously Bozak being on KEssel's line has to do with this as well).
- Big_Lightnin

Had he been playing with OV ?? Think that would get him some extra room ?

when bozak played much better than grabo and took most of the draws? what are you referring to?

You honestly think losing grabo was a loss? wow some leaf fans will never be happy.
- clark_griswold

You honestly think giving Bozak 4.2 million a year is worth it? For what? The FO abilities he hasnt't shown this year? The career high of 47 pts? The apparently good defensive play when he actually isn't?

Look, I don't hate Bozak, but to think we kept a mediocre centre and paid him like a good one, is laughable.

you do realize grabovski is 35th overall in the faceoff dot with a win percentage 52.7%

bozak: 65th with a whopping 46.2%

before you go rambling on about how bozak is better in every other facet of the game you might want to go actually check your facts.
- Dozzer

it's 12 games into the season. By facts do you mean i should check corsi stats too? Because you seem to enjoy those alot too. How's that working for you? Look at some of the ridiculous stats after 12 games, I rest my case. Look at the last few years and then we can talk.

you do realize grabovski is 35th overall in the faceoff dot with a win percentage 52.7%

bozak: 65th with a whopping 46.2%

before you go rambling on about how bozak is better in every other facet of the game you might want to go actually check your facts.
- Dozzer

But we signed Bozak for his faceoff abilities!!!

to make everybody happy, Dion is gonna score 3 tonite, but also be a -3...so everybody wins

pretty sure carlyle had ALOT of influence in keeping bozak over grabo. Nonis all but alluded to that fact. Or you can just check their ice time from last year.
- clark_griswold

I'm pretty sure knowing Bozak would be cheaper had a lot to do with it too, and Grabo having the only bad season of his career since Bozak arrived.

But whatever. Anybody with eyes capable of watching hockey games and reading stats can see Grabo is better at every facet of the game and every skill required to play the game, with the possible exception of faceoffs, than Bozak.

what he wasn't better at is being friends with Kessel, and having a lower cap hit than Bozak...

I like the cap savings... but that's really the only benefit to the team of keeping Bozak over Grabo. However, given the cap situation, it's a pretty good reason.

Had he been playing with OV ?? Think that would get him some extra room ?
- bixll

some PP shifts.. but typically Grabo is the second/third line centre playing with chimera and ward

to make everybody happy, Dion is gonna score 3 tonite, but also be a -3...so everybody wins
- 10baci

so... 3 on the PP, 3 against even strength, and Leafs win 6-3

gotcha

it's 12 games into the season. By facts do you mean i should check corsi stats too? Because you seem to enjoy those alot too. How's that working for you? Look at some of the ridiculous stats after 12 games, I rest my case. Look at the last few years and then we can talk.
- clark_griswold

Of Grabo vs Bozak?

that's really not gonna help your argument

so... 3 on the PP, 3 against even strength, and Leafs win 6-3

gotcha
- Big_Lightnin

holy cow, of all the combos thats what i was thinking but didnt want to type it out

You honestly think giving Bozak 4.2 million a year is worth it? For what? The FO abilities he hasnt't shown this year? The career high of 47 pts? The apparently good defensive play when he actually isn't?

Look, I don't hate Bozak, but to think we kept a mediocre centre and paid him like a good one, is laughable.
- peddy-93

Why do Leafs fans not understand - the only reason Bozak was signed was to keep Phil happy

just looked it up, hes on the third line and doesn't even get any powerplay ice time. backstrom is on the first line and laich is on the 2nd line.
- Leaffan8113

So its not RC fault? We weren't misusing him? Where are all these Grabo defenders?

Oates is such a defense first guy, that must explain him on the 3rd line, he just doesn't fit the Washington way....

to make everybody happy, Dion is gonna score 3 tonite, but also be a -3...so everybody wins
- 10baci

Unlikely....How is Dion gonna score 3 when you're gonna be shutout by the mighty Bachman!

it's 12 games into the season. By facts do you mean i should check corsi stats too? Because you seem to enjoy those alot too. How's that working for you? Look at some of the ridiculous stats after 12 games, I rest my case. Look at the last few years and then we can talk.
- clark_griswold

you suck at this. you go off about how bozak is out playing grabo and then when the facts suggest otherwise you refer to years past to make your point

here's a little hint

last year or the year before do not matter anymore. grabo is also being coached by one of the greatest centres to play the game.. and surprise surprise he is doing well

fact is.. bozak doesnt hold a twig to grabo when it comes to hockey skill.. he just does what he's told better.. and carlyle is a my way or the highway coach.

that selection was made based on who was more obedient.

Of Grabo vs Bozak?

that's really not gonna help your argument
- Big_Lightnin

this mite have already been said, but didnt they include the relationship between Kessel and Bozak when management made their decision to let Grabo go? didnt they purposely resign Bozak to increase their chances of Kessel resigning?

You honestly think giving Bozak 4.2 million a year is worth it? For what? The FO abilities he hasnt't shown this year? The career high of 47 pts? The apparently good defensive play when he actually isn't?

Look, I don't hate Bozak, but to think we kept a mediocre centre and paid him like a good one, is laughable.
- peddy-93

To think Carlyle and obviously Nonis would think so highly of him.
The probably aren't aware of all the stats. Somebody get on the horn NOW!!!

you do realize grabovski is 35th overall in the faceoff dot with a win percentage 52.7%

bozak: 65th with a whopping 46.2%

before you go rambling on about how bozak is better in every other facet of the game you might want to go actually check your facts.
- Dozzer

grabo 3 game point streak since hes been given 2 new wingers

just looked it up, hes on the third line and doesn't even get any powerplay ice time. backstrom is on the first line and laich is on the 2nd line.
- Leaffan8113

kinda weird he has 5 PP points then eh?

He's on their 2nd PP.

you suck at this. you go off about how bozak is out playing grabo and then when the facts suggest otherwise you refer to years past to make your point

here's a little hint

last year or the year before do not matter anymore. grabo is also being coached by one of the greatest centres to play the game.. and surprise surprise he is doing well

fact is.. bozak doesnt hold a twig to grabo when it comes to hockey skill.. he just does what he's told better.. and carlyle is a my way or the highway coach.

that selection was made based on who was more obedient.
- Dozzer

I wish I could buy out my dog, and sign a new one.

it's 12 games into the season. By facts do you mean i should check corsi stats too? Because you seem to enjoy those alot too. How's that working for you? Look at some of the ridiculous stats after 12 games, I rest my case. Look at the last few years and then we can talk.
- clark_griswold

Last few years? Ok.

Bozak:
10/11 82 games, 32 pts, -29
11/12 73 games, 47 pts, -7
12/13 46 games, 28 pts, -1

Grabo:
10/11 81 games, 59 pts, +14 (also shut down line)
11/12 74 games, 51 pts, even (shut down)
12/13 48 games, 16 pts, -10 (RC's doghouse, playing with Orr, Brown a lot)

You honestly think giving Bozak 4.2 million a year is worth it? For what? The FO abilities he hasnt't shown this year? The career high of 47 pts? The apparently good defensive play when he actually isn't?

Look, I don't hate Bozak, but to think we kept a mediocre centre and paid him like a good one, is laughable.
- peddy-93

i like debating, i really do. But the problem with dion/bozak haters is they never have a counter solution. What should we have done?

funny, this was in the paper the other day:

. By-passing the man in the middle: It's interesting that Kessel's chemistry these days seems to be more with left winger James van Riemsdyk on Toronto's No. 1 line, rather than centre Tyler Bozak. Bozak, armed with a new five-year contract, is going along so far this season at a point-every-other-game clip. Some might say that makes him overpaid, but a quick look around the other league at what similar centres make suggests that's not really the case. He may never be the protypical No. 1 centre, but he does hold value as a good faceoff man - Toronto's best - and a dangerous penalty killer. Sometimes we spend a lot of time focussing on what players aren't rather than what they are. What Bozak is, clearly, is a good NHL player who has turned out to be one of the better players ever signed by any team as an NCAA free agent.

Of Grabo vs Bozak?

that's really not gonna help your argument
- Big_Lightnin

Already did the research