I have seen Rinaldo's hitting force turnovers. Players just don't like to be hit by him.

I really don't have a problem with Rinaldo as a 4th line player. I think he adds much more to the team than takes away.
- PhillySportsGuy

I agree. Rosehill not so much

Yeah I have to admit I don't agree with this at all. I know Rinaldo needs to get that discipline back like he had last year and I do believe he can. I love that he hits everything. Some hits are obviously more important than others. For instance the ones when you create the turnover when you separate a player from the puck is different than one when the puck is already gone and you are just completing your check. I don't understand why all of a sudden a hit has become meaningless to people. I really don't agree
- nastyflyergirl

He nearly knocked McDonough out of the game against the Rangers... and then Kreider finished the job for him.

Having a hitter like Rinaldo on the ice has value, it gets the opponent thinking about him and can throw off their timing, etc.

It would be great if he could become a bit better defensively and cut down on penalties so he could play more then 4-6 minutes a game.

He's drawn more penalties than he's taken. He's had a rough stretch the last couple games, but over the last two seasons, he's been a solid 4th line player for this team. You need to look at more than just a few games.
- PhillySportsGuy

Oh come on. You know better than that...

He nearly knocked McDonough out of the game against the Rangers... and then Kreider finished the job for him.

Having a hitter like Rinaldo on the ice has value, it gets the opponent thinking about him and can throw off their timing, etc.

It would be great if he could become a bit better defensively and cut down on penalties so he could play more then 4-6 minutes a game.
- Marc D

I can sign on to this.

He should be stickhandling a la Carcillo vs. Toronto on every shift. Dumping the puck into a corner and punishing the defenseman with a hit is a sign that you are terrible offensively.
- jmatchett383

I just don't know what people want from the 12th man. This isn't team Canada. We can't have Richards and Bergeron playing on the 4th line.

I agree. Rosehill not so much
- nastyflyergirl

Now this I can get behind. If it's a choice between Hall (generally good of FO% over his career, can play PK and plays solid defense) or Rosehill (can play 3-5 minutes a night and fight), I'm going Hall.

Would you rather see Rinaldo in the penalty box twice a game, or in a coat and tie?
- PLindbergh31

I don't think the hits are meaningless at all. But he negates them by taking dumb penalties. He was improving in that area, but he has regressed. Can't have a guy who plays 5 minutes a game taking a few minor penalties. It totally defeats the purpose of dressing him.
- PLindbergh31

Not that I have any say in what the Flyers do but personally, I would allow Rinaldo to correct his lack of discipline he has been showing. he did it last year so I believe he can again this year. I'm sure Berube and/or Lappy has talked to him about it

I agree. Rosehill not so much
- nastyflyergirl

I think we all agree with that.

Raffl is Nodl, Nodl is Raffl.
- PLindbergh31

That's just extremely lazy comparison. 'Yes, let's just compare this Austrian with the only other Austrian that has suited up for the Flyers'...

I just don't know what people want from the 12th man. This isn't team Canada. We can't have Richards and Bergeron playing on the 4th line.
- PhillySportsGuy

No no no no NO...any player that doesn't score 20 goals, have a faceoff % of 55% or over, put up 30 assists and play spectacular hockey is a useless goon who hurts the team.

I can sign on to this.
- johndewar

The other thing is when he hits he is getting much better at keeping the actual hit legal.

He is staying on his feet and avoiding head contact, but still hits very effectively.

I think so, too. Also think he's got good two-way instincts (although he's had a turnover or two).

I fully expected him to have some NHL scoring difficulties but no problem scoring inn AHL, ala Mika Pyorala. The things that Raffl has in his favor over Pyorala are that he's four years younger than Pyorala was when he came over and is also physically stronger and a bit grittier.

There IS a bit of NHL offensive upside in Raffl but it's going to take time and patience to bring that out. The nice assist on Lecavalier's second goal the other night was a flash of his skills. He'll never be a big scorer at this level, however.
- bmeltzer

Agreed. He's displayed solid fundamental hockey sense and skills, good passing and vision, tenacious puck pursuit and forechecking, sound play in both ends of the ice, etc. Of course he's going to mess up once in a while because he is now playing against the best in the world as opposed to the best remaining in Europe. His age helps, but I'm still impressed with what he's done so far.

That being said, I can agree he isn't a top line player, at least not yet, and probably never. But then again, neither is Talbot, so Berube isn't worried about anything but results.

Not that I have any say in what the Flyers do but personally, I would allow Rinaldo to correct his lack of discipline he has been showing. he did it last year so I believe he can again this year. I'm sure Berube and/or Lappy has talked to him about it
- nastyflyergirl

I'm sure he knows. It's not like he doesn't realize it's bad to take penalties against a good PP late in the game.

I think he needs to learn to take no chances late in games. Don't give the referee the opportunity to make a mistake by making a big hit. They target Rinaldo and he should be aware of that.

Now this I can get behind. If it's a choice between Hall (generally good of FO% over his career, can play PK and plays solid defense) or Rosehill (can play 3-5 minutes a night and fight), I'm going Hall.
- jmatchett383

I really love the 4th line that teams like Boston and Chicago throw out there

Agreed. I like what I've seen of him so far, but our top line is no Legion of Doom...
- wolfhounds

Yes, but most people agree that a trashcan could have had a hell of a career playing with Lindros and Leclair...I love Jonesy, but he is the poster child for they whole top line forward discussion when you have 2 amazing pieces in place...

I'm sure he knows. It's not like he doesn't realize it's bad to take penalties against a good PP late in the game.

I think he needs to learn to take no chances late in games. Don't give the referee the opportunity to make a mistake by making a big hit. They target Rinaldo and he should be aware of that.
- PhillySportsGuy

Maybe. But part of Rinaldo's game is walking that fine line. He's an asset to the team when he's playing that way. Which is why he's a 4th line winger; you don't want him out there more than he has to be when you're protecting a 1-goal lead. You want him out there to get some momentum and maybe rattle a few bodies in the first and second. Which does not make him a bad player, but a different player.

I really love the 4th line that teams like Boston and Chicago throw out there
- nastyflyergirl

Those teams have quite a bit of depth as well. I'd like to have a lot of the things Chicago and Boston have.

We have better sandwiches though.

At this point, I'd be content with a 4th-line that just doesn't routinely sabotage the team's chance of winning.
- Tomahawk

I think routinely is an exaggeration. I'd like a 4th line that can go out and hold it's own and provide a physical presence and provide some energy.

Yes, but most people agree that a trashcan could have had a hell of a career playing with Lindros and Leclair...I love Jonesy, but he is the poster child for they whole top line forward discussion when you have 2 amazing pieces in place...
- JW98FlyerFan

As long as that trashcan crashes the net.

That's just extremely lazy comparison. 'Yes, let's just compare this Austrian with the only other Austrian that has suited up for the Flyers'...
- PhillySteen

I don't want to speak for PLind, but I think he is maybe comparing how Nodl was viewed here on this forum to how Raffl is seen.

There were several who thought Nodl was going to pan out to be a solid NHL player and others didn't see his value. There were numerous arguments over Nodl.

I think people are seeing the same thing with Raffl, some like him and some think he is worthless.

It is kind of early for these labels. I really like what I've seen from Raffl so far and think he could have a role as a secondary player on this team.

Those teams have quite a bit of depth as well. I'd like to have a lot of the things Chicago and Boston have.

We have better sandwiches though.
- PhillySportsGuy

So you're saying you'd trade Hartnell for Hossa or Kane? And Schenn for Keith or Seabrook?
Blasphemy!

I really love the 4th line that teams like Boston and Chicago throw out there
- nastyflyergirl

Devs have a good one, too... Carter/Gionta/Bernier... energy AND the ability to actually play with the puck.

Not that I have any say in what the Flyers do but personally, I would allow Rinaldo to correct his lack of discipline he has been showing. he did it last year so I believe he can again this year. I'm sure Berube and/or Lappy has talked to him about it
- nastyflyergirl

Fair enough. I don't have issue with Rinaldo when he stays out of the box.

I can sign on to this.
- johndewar

Unlike the ObamaCare website. bada ba.