Perhaps if they dressed a 4th line that could (frank)ing play the sport of (frank)ing hockey, they wouldn't look so gassed.
- Jsaquella

+1

The one thing I will say, there are supposed to be energy guys on this team, that excel at the gritty game, and starting to get the emotions flowing.

Namely on offense being Hartnell, Simmonds, Rinaldo and Talbot. Rosehill if you play him.

The apparent on paper strength of this team, is letting it down.

My two MIA's of the game...

BSchenn. Non-factor. Not just tonight, but on the majority of nights. My belief that he does not have a bright future becomes more and more evident to me. I can't find one aspect of his game that he does well.

Timmo. But at least he has an excuse. He's fried.
- 77rams

Agree about tonight, disagree about most nights.

i think players like rinaldo play to how the team is playing
if the flyers are good rinaldo is "effective"
if they suck he's uselss
- 2Real

I'm becoming less and less of a fan of Rinaldo. I just don't see what he adds that couldn't better be given by a McGinn type of player.

The Flyers are playing better, but they need G to start scoring before even think about becoming a playoff team.
- wolfhounds

hartnell seems incapable of throwing anything but a cross ice pass...and trouble ensues.

When B Schenn is your 2nd line center your in trouble. No other way around it now.

Whoever said it said it best when you'd hope that Cooter and B Schenn would show glimpses of being real good players. Its just few and far between. Cooter is going to be a great 3rd line center for years to come. B Schenn just isnt a dynamic player
- Just5

I got my ass ripped apart when I suggested last year that Coots was going to be a second coming of Handzus. I stand by that statement.

The one thin about the fourth line? With a salary cap as big as it is, to not be able to employ NHL quality players is laughable. Holmgren may be out on his ass after this season, and deserves to be.

Even with a guy like Raffl. Yes he does good things, but he is just in a long line of guys that Holmgren loves to go after. Players who wont hurt you, but wont do too much to help you win. The fourth line is the main example. The way this team is built is on the head on Holmgren.

hartnell seems incapable of throwing anything but a cross ice pass...and trouble ensues.
- isaiah520

Where the hell is the Hartnell that used to throw big hits, be a dominant net presence, and instigate?

Where is that game in Simmonds.

When B Schenn is your 2nd line center your in trouble. No other way around it now.
- Just5

When Michael Raffl is your first line LW, you've got even more issues.

I know, I know...nice young player. Gets involved. Responsible defensively. But first line?

that was a severely depleted Ducks team that owned us the last 2 periods. we lost so many battles...
- isaiah520

That's just speed at work, young legs -- they had two first-round picks, young guys, in Peter Holland and Devante Smith-Pelly, on their fourth line, with Daniel Winnik. They can skate.

Cogliano, Palmieri, Nick Bonino...their support players can skate. They just squeezed us, bled us dry, kept coming.

Then they hit you with guys like Getzlaf and Perry down low or off the wall...damn.

We're just not at that level at the moment, with speed.

When Michael Raffl is your first line LW, you've got even more issues.

I know, I know...nice young player. Gets involved. Responsible defensively. But first line?
- 77rams

They should swap him and Read.

Read, Vinny & Jake(tonight at least) look like the guys that give the team the best chance to score.

When Michael Raffl is your first line LW, you've got even more issues.

I know, I know...nice young player. Gets involved. Responsible defensively. But first line?
- 77rams

Good old Nodl Syndrome. Raffl is a decent player, but belongs on a fourth line.

Perfect example is that feed from Giroux where he shoots it over the top of the net. Cant turn a mule into a mustang. Not to say this game is on Raffl by any means, but too many "secondary" players on this team with poor puck skills, without even looking at the defense.

hartnell seems incapable of throwing anything but a cross ice pass...and trouble ensues.
- isaiah520

hartnell sucks we should just dump him

JVR w/ #6 tonite...

When Michael Raffl is your first line LW, you've got even more issues.

I know, I know...nice young player. Gets involved. Responsible defensively. But first line?
- 77rams

Raffl played a very good game. It's not his job to stick a cattle prod up G's arse to shoot.

JVR w/ #6 tonite...
- isaiah520

I look forward to your updates the rest of his career.

Raffl played a very good game. It's not his job to stick a cattle prod up G's arse to shoot.
- jstross

Its not the point though. When you are playing a guy like Raffl on a first line, and have to essentially bench your whole fourth line for the game that's horrific.

Its unfair to Raffl, and his linemates. Every player matters on the team.

Berube has helped mask the glaring weakness on this team with the D, by having them tone down the attack. Basically, I think they are what they are. So be it Paul.

Good old Nodl Syndrome. Raffl is a decent player, but belongs on a fourth line.

Perfect example is that feed from Giroux where he shoots it over the top of the net. Cant turn a mule into a mustang. Not to say this game is on Raffl by any means, but too many "secondary" players on this team with poor puck skills, without even looking at the defense.
- flyer_nutter

Give the young man a chance. Raffl played very good hockey tonight. He didn't give the game changing turnover right to the opponent.

Raffl played a very good game. It's not his job to stick a cattle prod up G's arse to shoot.
- jstross

he played ok, he was not "very good"

Raffl played a very good game. It's not his job to stick a cattle prod up G's arse to shoot.
- jstross

Agreed. He did have a nice game.

Can't finish though. Maybe in time he will. Until he can, why is he learning the NHL game on the first line?

That's just speed at work, young legs -- they had two first-round picks, young guys, in Peter Holland and Devante Smith-Pelly, on their fourth line, with Daniel Winnik. They can skate.

Cogliano, Palmieri, Nick Bonino...their support players can skate. They just squeezed us, bled us dry, kept coming.

Then they hit you with guys like Getzlaf and Perry down low or off the wall...damn.

We're just not at that level at the moment, with speed.
- AllInForFlyers

we're just a couple notches below. the D skate in molasses...

Give the young man a chance. Raffl played very good hockey tonight. He didn't give the game changing turnover right to the opponent.
- jstross

Raffl played damn well. I am not on his ass, but he shouldn't be playing on the 1st line of an NHL team.

Might as well do that with a guy like Nodl or Pyorala. That's the point Im making here, with an unlimited cheque book, the fact that Holmgren is forced to play a guy like Raffl on the 1st line, and leave his coach with 3 capable forward lines is sickening.

Bad cap management is coming back to bite this team in the ass, and overpaying for mediocrity.

Holmgren hires an aggressive coach in Laviolette and gives him a team that in no way, shape or form can play that kind of style. Has to completely shift directions in making them a D first team. He built this poop, and we can all see the mix doesn't work. Overpaying for mediocrity, and aging players. Paul deserves to be out on his ass, and I will be happy when the day comes. Hextall looms.

This
- nastyflyergirl

Why? I could make the same statement about every single defenseman the Flyers have. They are going no where. Let Timonen finish out his career here without embarrassing him. He's been nothing but a warrior and class and while he isn't any good anymore, I'm not willing to bench him.

EDIT: Sorry, I hit quote on the wrong post. I'm an idiot.

I look forward to your updates the rest of his career.
- hereticpride

i'll pick my spots

Its not the point though. When you are playing a guy like Raffl on a first line, and have to essentially bench your whole fourth line for the game that's horrific.

Its unfair to Raffl, and his linemates. Every player matters on the team.
- flyer_nutter

The 1st line with Raffle has 4 or 5 goals in 3 games despite G having a total confidence problem. In fact, Raffl on the 1st line should make all the other lines better since 'supposed top line players get moved down'.