We have seen much worse... I still don't get all the hate for A Mack.. He isn't AS good as Isles think.. but he isn't as bad as u think either. Good Goaltending can solve a lot of problems. Nabby has been horrendous.

Our backline is desperate for some guys who can clear the crease AND skate.. the only one who comes close to that is hamonic. The rest of our guys are good players but need to be paired with a big Bodied solid D-man. We don't have that.. We have teams crashing the net every game. It has to be addressed... (sorry about last thread.. didn't realize u always like Neilsen.. ).

What is lost in all of this is just how well our fowards are playing. Most of the guys on here complaining about Moulson ... while I agree he needs to back check better and be MUCH better in his own end (Again these are problems that would be less obvious with a decent goalie and some crease clearing D-men)... u are not giving him enough credit for his ability to put the puck in the net. He goes to the net.. not around it or behind it.. and has good enough and quick enough hands to score. This is not an easy thing to find. We have had TONS of talented guys that could not do this extrememly important task. I could list 20 of them off the top of my head. I would be very upset to see Matt Moulson on another team. This isn't a Jason Blake that will neve score 30 again... he will score with another team..just as much.
- niteislander

I think you've completely missed the point that most of us have been making with Moulson. No one has disputed that he is an extremely effective goal scorer. No one has even said they don't want him here. The overall comment, or at least my point, has been I'm not sure I want Matt to be our top line forward for the next 4-6 years and given his skillset, he's not going to be near as much use anywhere else. Moulson is scoring on the power play right now which keeps his value high. The problem is he'll then not score for 10 games and be utterly usesless in every other facet of the game.
The constant comment from people is that '30 goal scorers don't grow on trees' though I'd contend that just like Jason Blake wasn't a true 40 goal scorer (or even 30) Moulson is unlikely to be a 30 goal scorer anywhere other than JT's wing. Elite players CREATE 30 goal scorers. Lemieux turned an AHL player into a 50 goal scorer. And while some may turn to PA as the example, PA went from one elite forward to another. Duchene is a monster (anyone see that goal he had?) That said, if you could have a guy in Moulson's place who could score 30 AND play defense, AND skate, AND pass effectively, you'd have to consider that upgrade. Therefore the question of extending him has to be taken into consideration with those shortcomines and accurate value

I think you've completely missed the point that most of us have been making with Moulson. No one has disputed that he is an extremely effective goal scorer. No one has even said they don't want him here. The overall comment, or at least my point, has been I'm not sure I want Matt to be our top line forward for the next 4-6 years and given his skillset, he's not going to be near as much use anywhere else. Moulson is scoring on the power play right now which keeps his value high. The problem is he'll then not score for 10 games and be utterly usesless in every other facet of the game.
The constant comment from people is that '30 goal scorers don't grow on trees' though I'd contend that just like Jason Blake wasn't a true 40 goal scorer (or even 30) Moulson is unlikely to be a 30 goal scorer anywhere other than JT's wing. Elite players CREATE 30 goal scorers. Lemieux turned an AHL player into a 50 goal scorer. And while some may turn to PA as the example, PA went from one elite forward to another. Duchene is a monster (anyone see that goal he had?) That said, if you could have a guy in Moulson's place who could score 30 AND play defense, AND skate, AND pass effectively, you'd have to consider that upgrade. Therefore the question of extending him has to be taken into consideration with those shortcomines and accurate value
- keaner17

But we wont. This is Garth we are talking about. Same thing with Amcac. Do we really believe he will upgrade him next season? Hickey will be moved to the first pairing.

I think you've completely missed the point that most of us have been making with Moulson. No one has disputed that he is an extremely effective goal scorer. No one has even said they don't want him here. The overall comment, or at least my point, has been I'm not sure I want Matt to be our top line forward for the next 4-6 years and given his skillset, he's not going to be near as much use anywhere else. Moulson is scoring on the power play right now which keeps his value high. The problem is he'll then not score for 10 games and be utterly usesless in every other facet of the game.
The constant comment from people is that '30 goal scorers don't grow on trees' though I'd contend that just like Jason Blake wasn't a true 40 goal scorer (or even 30) Moulson is unlikely to be a 30 goal scorer anywhere other than JT's wing. Elite players CREATE 30 goal scorers. Lemieux turned an AHL player into a 50 goal scorer. And while some may turn to PA as the example, PA went from one elite forward to another. Duchene is a monster (anyone see that goal he had?) That said, if you could have a guy in Moulson's place who could score 30 AND play defense, AND skate, AND pass effectively, you'd have to consider that upgrade. Therefore the question of extending him has to be taken into consideration with those shortcomines and accurate value
- keaner17

Name the players in the league that fit those catergories

But we wont. This is Garth we are talking about. Same thing with Amcac. Do we really believe he will upgrade him next season? Hickey will be moved to the first pairing.
- mighty13duck

I don't think it's likely we'll bring anyone in because it's not the model on how they're operating. Everything is being bread from within. Your eventual LW 1st line player is likely either Nelson or Moulson. RW Strome. The Isles will continually develop everything from within while signing plug and plays to hold the spots for whatever other prospects are expected to arrive in the near future. Now once the team is within reach of contendership, that may change. I'd hope that changes in 2015, which means a 5-6 year extension at $5-$6 million per season for Moulson needs to be considered very carefully. That's been the point all along.

I don't think it's likely we'll bring anyone in because it's not the model on how they're operating. Everything is being bread from within. Your eventual LW 1st line player is likely either Nelson or Moulson. RW Strome. The Isles will continually develop everything from within while signing plug and plays to hold the spots for whatever other prospects are expected to arrive in the near future. Now once the team is within reach of contendership, that may change. I'd hope that changes in 2015, which means a 5-6 year extension at $5-$6 million per season for Moulson needs to be considered very carefully. That's been the point all along.
- keaner17

If we have no capable upgrade we sign him. Remember when nobody wanted PA and look at him now.

Name the players in the league that fit those catergories
- Isles316

I don't consider any of them likely signings, but UFA's next year:
Gaborak
Heatley
Vanek
Marleau
there's a pretty decent list of UFA's next year. It all depends on Moulson's asking price and flexability.
I'm not saying these guys excell in ALL of those categories, but they are IMO upgrades on Moulson.

We are 3-3-3 and complaining rangers are 2-5 and still think they are cup contenders...

If we have no capable upgrade we sign him. Remember when nobody wanted PA and look at him now.
- mighty13duck

I already touched on PA. The thing is, you have to question if there will be no capable upgrade in 4-6 years...not just next year. That was the situation with PA. If Strome comes up later this year and takes the RW spot with JT, PA is a distant memory.

I don't consider any of them likely signings, but UFA's next year:
Gaborak
Heatley
Vanek
Marleau
there's a pretty decent list of UFA's next year. It all depends on Moulson's asking price and flexability.
I'm not saying these guys excell in ALL of those categories, but they are IMO upgrades on Moulson.
- keaner17

Marleau and Vanek I would take. the other two no way. With that said Garth would never sign those guys

I already touched on PA. The thing is, you have to question if there will be no capable upgrade in 4-6 years...not just next year. That was the situation with PA. If Strome comes up later this year and takes the RW spot with JT, PA is a distant memory.
- keaner17

Pa signed for 4 years I believe his contract would be almost up. he wouldn't block Stromes development

I don't consider any of them likely signings, but UFA's next year:
Gaborak
Heatley
Vanek
Marleau
there's a pretty decent list of UFA's next year. It all depends on Moulson's asking price and flexability.
I'm not saying these guys excell in ALL of those categories, but they are IMO upgrades on Moulson.
- keaner17

Well that's not a lot of players in the entire league that are an upgrade. Most that are an upgrade aren't going to leave the teams they are on.

I think we are nitpicking on guys like Moulson/AMac when the biggest issue is the bottom 2 or 3 defensemen and goaltending. A couple of tiny moves to get a solid guy or 2 in here and this team can win a lot. 28 goals in 9 games and only 3 wins.

Marleau and Vanek I would take. the other two no way. With that said Garth would never sign those guys
- mighty13duck

We're not talking about what Garth would or wouldn't do. We're talking about what SHOULD be done.
Next year is a VERY deep year for UFA forwards. If we're talking about what SHOULD be done with a player like MM, I say try to sign him cheap, but if he has a high number demand (and he should), then there are plenty of other fish in the sea. This team has shown they will not overpay for anything and will only take long term deals if the money is responsible.
To me, I say if you want that top line to become the most dangerous line in hockey, throw some money at Vanek, promote Strome. To me, $7 million there, is much better spent than $5-6$ mil on Moulson

Pa signed for 4 years I believe his contract would be almost up. he wouldn't block Stromes development
- mighty13duck

PA is only in his second year....

Well that's not a lot of players in the entire league that are an upgrade. Most that are an upgrade aren't going to leave the teams they are on.

I think we are nitpicking on guys like Moulson/AMac when the biggest issue is the bottom 2 or 3 defensemen and goaltending. A couple of tiny moves to get a solid guy or 2 in here and this team can win a lot. 28 goals in 9 games and only 3 wins.
- Isles316

I'm not listing all of them...you can see them for yourself:
http://www.capgeek.com/free-agents

I agree with your second paragraph but also feel that long term extensions need to be considered very carefully for one dimensional players such as Moulson.

I'm not listing all of them...you can see them for yourself:
http://www.capgeek.com/free-agents

I agree with your second paragraph but also feel that long term extensions need to be considered very carefully for one dimensional players such as Moulson.
- keaner17

A three year deal worth $4 or $4.5 a year for a guy that scores 30 a year to me is a no brainer. He's a huge reason why the power play is so good.

A three year deal worth $4 or $4.5 a year for a guy that scores 30 a year to me is a no brainer. He's a huge reason why the power play is so good.
- Isles316

3 to 4 year? what makes you think he'll take that? Moulson is in the prime of his career and if he has an agent slightly above that of window-licker status, he'll be looking for 5-6 years $30 million. That's the market for '30 goal scorers'. If he takes 3 years @ $4.5 million, we'll rename him Mother Theresa

3 to 4 year? what makes you think he'll take that? Moulson is in the prime of his career and if he has an agent slightly above that of window-licker status, he'll be looking for 5-6 years $30 million. That's the market for '30 goal scorers'. If he takes 3 years @ $4.5 million, we'll rename him Mother Theresa
- keaner17

Because he wants to stay. His wife's family lives where lives now. I'd be surprised if the Isles don't retain him, especially if he keeps up his current play. Guy is playing great right now.

I agree regarding Nabokov playing too many games- it's ridiculous. That said, if you were in the seats last night, you'd have seen a much smaller team get outmuscled by a lot bigger team repeatedly, in front of its own net. Repeatedly lost EVERY physical battle in front of its own net. Every one....that has to end dcb1
From the last thread. Very true. The Canucks played a very physical game. We looked tepid against them at times and couldn't match up to them physically.
- Cptmjl

With the exception of Fransy's "elbow" to Keslers shoulder/head followed by an outstanding impersonation of an injured person. At least the refs evened it out with the call on Sedin. I wonder tho, if the league is reviewing non-calls to the head, a la Grabner, why not for diving or embellishment? Kesler stayed on the ice for ensuing PP.

With the exception of Fransy's "elbow" to Keslers shoulder/head followed by an outstanding impersonation of an injured person. At least the refs evened it out with the call on Sedin. I wonder tho, if the league is reviewing non-calls to the head, a la Grabner, why not for diving or embellishment? Kesler stayed on the ice for ensuing PP.
- jmo16

He should get fined IMO. Doesn't have to be a lot but just a way the league can cut the bullpoop. The referee arm didn't go up right away. When he saw Kesler fake dying on the ice he called it then

With the exception of Fransy's "elbow" to Keslers shoulder/head followed by an outstanding impersonation of an injured person. At least the refs evened it out with the call on Sedin. I wonder tho, if the league is reviewing non-calls to the head, a la Grabner, why not for diving or embellishment? Kesler stayed on the ice for ensuing PP.
- jmo16

This is a great point. If the NHL wants to crack down on this diving crap, post game fines would go a long way

Because he wants to stay. His wife's family lives where lives now. I'd be surprised if the Isles don't retain him, especially if he keeps up his current play. Guy is playing great right now.
- Isles316

So you're confident he'll forgo possibly 3 years and $18 million dollars?
Players always want to 'stay'. Matt has a lot of friends around the league. I think he'd manage to move on easier than you think if it meant financial security.
If you're right and he's willing to make a huge financial sacrifice to stay, then by all means, 3 years is a great deal. I have my doubts.

I'm not listing all of them...you can see them for yourself:
http://www.capgeek.com/free-agents

I agree with your second paragraph but also feel that long term extensions need to be considered very carefully for one dimensional players such as Moulson.
- keaner17

Vanek is rumored for Minn and the rest are aging and will look for their last high paying contract

1 player that intrigues me is Stastny and a few others.

I don't consider any of them likely signings, but UFA's next year:
Gaborak
Heatley
Vanek
Marleau
there's a pretty decent list of UFA's next year. It all depends on Moulson's asking price and flexability.
I'm not saying these guys excell in ALL of those categories, but they are IMO upgrades on Moulson.
- keaner17

scratch heatley off that list, he's been god awful the last couple years and is absolutely not worth taking a flyer on

I'd also full expect every one of those to be locked up long term prior to july 1st except Vanek

scratch heatley off that list, he's been god awful the last couple years and is absolutely not worth taking a flyer on

I'd also full expect every one of those to be locked up long term prior to july 1st except Vanek
- Isles_since_6

You have to assume that the team wants to continue with them, the player wants to stay and the money is right for the cap. Lots of variables. Lots of players. It's something that I would consider, but don't expect Snow to.

That said, I can assure you, if Moulson doesn't come at a total bargin price, he'll be gone. He may be producing on the pp w/ JT, but when not on the ice with JT he does very little. From that point, the Isles mgmt can easily make the point that he needs to keep his price low. MM, should be looking for a career payday...there's no guarantee there will be common ground here.

I agree regarding Nabokov playing too many games- it's ridiculous. That said, if you were in the seats last night, you'd have seen a much smaller team get outmuscled by a lot bigger team repeatedly, in front of its own net. Repeatedly lost EVERY physical battle in front of its own net. Every one....that has to end dcb1
From the last thread. Very true. The Canucks played a very physical game. We looked tepid against them at times and couldn't match up to them physically.
- Cptmjl

look at this isles team.....they have to be the smallest in the league