don't forget failing to bring back jagr for 1 or 2 more seasons. imagine giroux w/ 2 more years of jagr on his wing?....we don't have to imagine him without him there. not saying G won't snap out of it eventually, but i think Jagr was willing to come back here cheap (even last year and this year) and without a viable, proven option he should have had him here
- hogweed

jagr was a spent force at the end of last yr and they needed to bring in another scorer...one more in his prime.

really though, they were counting on schenn and coots to progress when they actually took steps back offensively. they also were counting on a few guys who had career yrs. i was concerned about that going into the season back then.

this yr, it's just a cluster(frank) of the brass not recognizing that lavi was toast and that they needed a total remake from a schematic perspective. it also looks like they over-rated their talent.

jagr was a spent force at the end of last yr and they needed to bring in another scorer...one more in his prime.

really though, they were counting on schenn and coots to progress when they actually took steps back offensively. they also were counting on a few guys who had career yrs. i was concerned about that going into the season back then.

this yr, it's just a cluster(frank) of the brass not recognizing that lavi was toast and that they needed a total remake from a schematic perspective. it also looks like they over-rated their talent.
- isaiah520

They did bring in another scorer, he went out last night with an apparent knee injury tip toeing in the corner.

It's scary, how can they even change & move players from a strength when other teams see how bad they are?

right now i would take streit over kimmo any day ... kimmo has looked horrible he is showing his age and it is proven by the obstruction penalties he keeps taking... he is getting out hustled and out skated... it was a bad resign... luke schenn... well toronto saw his problems that why they moved him they new what he was about....JVR that was a lavy choice i am sure any person can see his offensive potential just had to wait for him to blossom..oh wait he did after they traded him....homer is on his last legs stupid move after stupid move.... time for him to flow lavy out the door....... i think this team needs a wake up shake up... a trade to kick then in the a$$ maybe a brayden schenn or talbot being moved... a shake up to show them no one is safe ...
- flyer186

the coach getting canned is shake up enuf...besides, i don't think i want any more major trades made by this GM. the goalies have kept them in these games or else they'd completely be going off the rails.

They did bring in another scorer, he went out last night with an apparent knee injury tip toeing in the corner.

It's scary, how can they even change & move players from a strength when other teams see how bad they are?
- puckhead17

vinny was this yr and that was as a replacement for briere

don't see a major trade until the settle things down...zero leverage unless they trade w/ the likes of BUF

i understand the rationale for not bringing him back but having jagr next to him took G's game to a different level. i watched some devils' games this year and jagr looks better than most of our guys do. i think rumors of his demise were exaggerated

jagr was a spent force at the end of last yr and they needed to bring in another scorer...one more in his prime.

really though, they were counting on schenn and coots to progress when they actually took steps back offensively. they also were counting on a few guys who had career yrs. i was concerned about that going into the season back then.

this yr, it's just a cluster(frank) of the brass not recognizing that lavi was toast and that they needed a total remake from a schematic perspective. it also looks like they over-rated their talent.
- isaiah520

Schenn and Bunny were really looking together too. I don't know what it is about this team. I mean, I wish they had more speed and skill and I am not a fan of the 4th line but I really didn't think they would be this inept at scoring. Something just seems off chemistry wise. in the two games Berube has been in charge the team defense has looked a little better. We have that
- nastyflyergirl

They can't score because they don't have enough speed and skill.

Look at Phoenix's second goal last night. Oliver Ekman-Larsson made the kind of play that you have to have skill and hockey sense to complete -- realize the defensive player overcommitted, walk around the guy, then snap it to the far side, labeled for a corner.

That's a goal that maybe, just maybe, Mark Streit might be able to THINK about scoring. Not that he could do it. He might be able to see it in his head.

That's how far behind our roster is right now. We don't have enough players who have enough skill and hockey sense to make enough plays for us to even BEGIN to score goals.

I keep saying it because it's true. Every game they don't score isn't because they're not trying or their compete level isn't high enough.

It's because this team is skill-deficient and hockey-sense deficient. Until we embrace this, it won't change, because too many of us think that we're being outworked.

We're being out-skilled. We're being outsmarted. In many cases, badly.

what is said is its October 12th and I am sitting here wondering how deep the draft is this year.
- nastyflyergirl

Not you, too...Christ, it's turned into WIP in here; the defeatists have taken over. 5 games in - 2 of them under a new coach - and the season's a wash.

Sure, they look like crap right now. Give Berube a little time. If this keeps up, there will be personnel changes on the roster. If that doesn't snap 'em out of it, maybe all really is lost. It just seems a little premature to lose all hope at this point.

vinny was this yr and that was as a replacement for briere
- isaiah520

Yes I know, he has looked good, but his injury comes as no surprise, Homer handing long contracts to guys with a ton of mileage on them, I hate this move.

Not you, too...Christ, it's turned into WIP in here; the defeatists have taken over. 5 games in - 2 of them under a new coach - and the season's a wash.

Sure, they look like crap right now. Give Berube a little time. If this keeps up, there will be personnel changes on the roster. If that doesn't snap 'em out of it, maybe all really is lost. It just seems a little premature to lose all hope at this point.
- tangent_man

they have at most, 10 gms to right the ship or their plyoff chances are nil. no more gimmes in the east anymore.

Not you, too...Christ, it's turned into WIP in here; the defeatists have taken over. 5 games in - 2 of them under a new coach - and the season's a wash.

Sure, they look like crap right now. Give Berube a little time. If this keeps up, there will be personnel changes on the roster. If that doesn't snap 'em out of it, maybe all really is lost. It just seems a little premature to lose all hope at this point.
- tangent_man

I don't get this line of thinking. If they were playing like San Jose, scoring six and nine goals a night and undefeated, wouldn't it be justified to discuss how good the team is?

When the opposite is true and you are playing not just like a lottery team, but one of the three worst teams in the league...no one can say that?

I don't get that.

Yes I know, he has looked good, but his injury comes as no surprise, Homer handing long contracts to guys with a ton of mileage on them, I hate this move.
- puckhead17

the downside was that it put schenn on the wing, where we could use a more natural scorer. they were looking to vinny to provide a blend of what we got from jagr/briere.

I don't think we are lacking the talent to be a good team, but I'm starting to question the mix of players. I'm going to see where stand at the end of the month.

The positives I saw:

The Flyers looked pretty good in the first period. Nearly dominant but they didn't score and had a fluky goal against so dominant is the wrong word.

Their forecheck was forcing turnovers from the Yotes defense at a good pace and led to some good scoring chances in the first.

G and Hartnell both were playing with good energy and G looked like he was the dominating forward on the ice at least for the first twenty.

Baby Schenn and Lacavalier also looked like they were a hair off from scoring several times. To me this line has/had potential and needs more time to learn to play with each other. With Vinnie hurt it is a set back.

Couts does look stronger and was pretty steady out there all night. Even when he was playing with Talbot (who on a good team is a 4th line player) and Rinaldo (who is a 4th line player) Couts seemed to generate scoring chances on offense.

Coburn got like 3-4 shots ON NET. That may equal his total for all of last season. (Hyperbole of course, but this is an improvement and I'll take it).

The goalie play was very good.

The team D. At least they looked like they were playing as a 5 man unit and there didn't seem to be the huge forward/D gaps. Isn't this adapting the system to the players skills set that we were all clamoring for? They don't have the skills to play the 60 minutes of 2-3 forecheckers deep, Lavi attack system. Kudos to Burube here.

Lots of negatives, I won't post them now.

the downside was that it put schenn on the wing, where we could use a more natural scorer. they were looking to vinny to provide a blend of what we got from jagr/briere.
- isaiah520

Right, I do understand, but does Jägr get 5 years? How about Iginla? Alfredson? Did Briere? I understand Vinny isn't quite as old as they are, but Christ, he has 16 years on his body, and check his most 3 recent seasons, he's missed a nice chunk of time in each.
I would have let Schenn center the 2nd line & rather had went with Mason Raymond at least, would have increased our speed, but that wasn't the sexy $$$ splash Homer falls in love with.

It's pretty bad when your a team that can use a CBO every summer if you were allowed to do so.

Bill Meltzer: Flyers Gameday: 10/12/13 @ Detroit; 2-1 Loss to PHO; Phantoms; Quick Hits
- bmeltzer

the recent comments made by TSN's Darren Dreger

Bill, what did Dreger say?

Grossman and L schenn.

These type of dmen have gone way of the do do bird and we have 2 of them


What good team has a dmen like these 2 in the league?

Grossman and L schenn.

These type of dmen have gone way of the do do bird and we have 2 of them


What good team has a dmen like these 2 in the league?
- Just5

We have 3 hal gill

Luke will be fine, he has more tools then the other 2

I don't think we are lacking the talent to be a good team, but I'm starting to question the mix of players. I'm going to see where stand at the end of the month.
- funmaster18

I understand what you just said, but to me, something Bill Parcells said resonates most when talking about this team:

"You are what your record says you are."

This isn't just five games. This goes all the way through preseason, and extends from last season.

Could things be different a week from now, a month from now?

Sure.

But I'll bet a paycheck that things won't be different if we have the same players.

If we have the same players, things will be right in line with what we've been seeing, because what we are seeing is what we have been seeing, and there is no reason to believe that will change.

I don't get this line of thinking. If they were playing like San Jose, scoring six and nine goals a night and undefeated, wouldn't it be justified to discuss how good the team is?

When the opposite is true and you are playing not just like a lottery team, but one of the three worst teams in the league...no one can say that?

I don't get that.
- AllInForFlyers

Nowhere did I mention that discussing how poorly they're playing, or what they could do differently, was a bad thing. I just don't get the whole "there's always next year" mentality when there are still 79 games to play.

Don't get me wrong, they're frustrating the hell out of me, too. But until they're mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, the season ain't over yet.

They can't score because they don't have enough speed and skill.

Look at Phoenix's second goal last night. Oliver Ekman-Larsson made the kind of play that you have to have skill and hockey sense to complete -- realize the defensive player overcommitted, walk around the guy, then snap it to the far side, labeled for a corner.

That's a goal that maybe, just maybe, Mark Streit might be able to THINK about scoring. Not that he could do it. He might be able to see it in his head.

That's how far behind our roster is right now. We don't have enough players who have enough skill and hockey sense to make enough plays for us to even BEGIN to score goals.

I keep saying it because it's true. Every game they don't score isn't because they're not trying or their compete level isn't high enough.

It's because this team is skill-deficient and hockey-sense deficient. Until we embrace this, it won't change, because too many of us think that we're being outworked.

We're being out-skilled. We're being outsmarted. In many cases, badly.
- AllInForFlyers

This team is built to rely too much on A) post-apex, declining talent (Vinny, Streit, Kimmo, Hartnell) and B) a lot of emerging talent that has yet to show any signs of consistency.

Who are the real in-their-prime, truly productive players? Giroux may be really the only show in town in that regard... and if even he's clutching his twig, you get an 1-4 start where you can't score any goals.

I still believe that there's enough "talent" on this team, but the biggest problem to me is that there are way too many guys who are lagging behind the play in all three zones, whether's it's due to timidity, foot speed, confusion, lack of confidence, what have you.

...let go of a puck mover, who despite his faults, was valuable plyr we have attempted to replace in some part by signing a past-his-prime streit. these transactions may be the final ones referred to in the epilogue of the homer GM tenure.
- isaiah520

On Carle, he is pretty close to exactly what this team could use.

In retrospect it is pretty easy to see this, but at the time no one here wanted the Flyers to give Carle the deal he got with Tampa Bay. The mistake was not getting a more friendly deal before he hit UFA. Maybe they tried, we cannot know the details.

Everyone sees now the offense failing to score, and lack of attackers in front of the net.
With a guy like Carle, he helped set up the attack, was able to set up goals with good passes, and by holding onto the puck allowed forwards to get in front and in scoring positions. Now the forwards are so busy trying to get the puck in the zone and get it off the boards that there is no one free to go to the net.

Carle also had the skill set to make a young defenseman play better. His time playing paired with Bourdon is one example. I don't think the current guys with the exemption of Kimmo can do this.

Carle had his warts, no use listing them. But given his age and puck skills I think he would have been better choice then resorting to a long deal with a past prime Streit.

It's going to be a long season for Flyer/Devils and maybe even Rangers fans.
- blizzzard

gonna be exciting watching the isles, jackets, and canes (frank)ing own the division





(and relax i know the penguins are still good)

the recent comments made by TSN's Darren Dreger

Bill, what did Dreger say?
- Marc D

"So @DarrenDreger just told us on TSN Radio that a Philly source openly wondered whether Luke Schenn can even play anymore. Hoo boy."

Not you, too...Christ, it's turned into WIP in here; the defeatists have taken over. 5 games in - 2 of them under a new coach - and the season's a wash.

Sure, they look like crap right now. Give Berube a little time. If this keeps up, there will be personnel changes on the roster. If that doesn't snap 'em out of it, maybe all really is lost. It just seems a little premature to lose all hope at this point.
- tangent_man

How ya doing TM?

I'm brewing a batch of ale today, calling it
Red October

"So @DarrenDreger just told us on TSN Radio that a Philly source openly wondered whether Luke Schenn can even play anymore. Hoo boy."
- isaiah520

who was the source I wonder...
Pittsburgh Panatchio?