A #4 is a pretty good plyr...just usually not a gm changer
- isaiah520

Yeah, nobody's taking a dump on him -- he's one of my favorite Flyers.

Just need to temper the top-pairing expectations with some reality... the guys was lights-out against teenagers, but it's been a tougher slog in the show.

I'm not sure all the tools and qualities add up to anything more than a very good physical 2nd-pairing dman.

Everybody just agree to disagree and move on already.
- ob18

Wouldn't that kind of contradict the entire point of message boards?

How about Read and Couturier for both the Toronto Doghouse boys.
- mayorofangrytown

You talking about Kadri? I can't keep Carlyle's doghouse denizens straight.

Apparently you missed the portion of my post that said "for the right price"....as in, if they demanded Couturier or Schenn, or any other price deemed too extravagant, you say, "Thanks, but no thanks" and move on.

As for cap space, they have $7.5mm tied up this year in an injury prone Meszaros and a one dimensional Grossmann. If the Jets would take one of them as part of the deal, it would mitigate the cap implications greatly.

I'm not arguing that they need Byfuglien. I'm not saying that they HAVE to go out and trade for him right now. He wouldn't be my first choice. But to dismiss him out of hand is ignoring that adding him would likely improve the team.
- Jsaquella

I'm not dismissing him out if hand. I'm dismissing him on all the factors. What kind of player he is. The Cap implications. And the cost of acquiring him. It all adds up to a resounding no, in my opinion.

You talking about Kadri? I can't keep Carlyle's doghouse denizens straight.
- Tomahawk

yup, it's a growing club

Yeah, nobody's taking a dump on him -- he's one of my favorite Flyers.

Just need to temper the top-pairing expectations with some reality... the guys was lights-out against teenagers, but it's been a tougher slog in the show.

I'm not sure all the tools and qualities add up to anything more than a very good physical 2nd-pairing dman.
- Tomahawk

Expectations and potential are two different things. Every played doesn't live up to his potential. L. Schenn is already a top 4 defenseman in this League. I don't think it is correct in thinking that he has already maxed out his potential as a defenseman in this League at 23. There is still lots of room for growth there.

You talking about Kadri? I can't keep Carlyle's doghouse denizens straight.
- Tomahawk

Yeah, Carlyle has him playing 4th line minutes and the GTO is on fire.


People think it's crazy with the media in Philly. I love the media in Toronto. Way more knowledgeable but give a guy a couple minutes less a game and they're screaming at each other. Carlyle is fine but that stew misses Brian Burke in the worst way.

I've learn to take the whole NHL with a sense of humour listening to them 5 days a week.

They're trading everyone but Lupul and Bernier.

Yeah, Carlyle has him playing 4th line minutes and the GTO is on fire.


People think it's crazy with the media in Philly. I love the media in Toronto. Way more knowledgeable but give a guy a couple minutes less a game and they're screaming at each other. Carlyle is fine but that stew misses Brian Burke in the worst way.

I've learn to take the whole NHL with a sense of humour listening to them 5 days a week.

They're trading everyone but Lupul and Bernier.
- mayorofangrytown

and if you follow the Toronto boards & Leaf Nation, most of them hate Phaneuf & want him gone.

I'm not dismissing him out if hand. I'm dismissing him on all the factors. What kind of player he is. The Cap implications. And the cost of acquiring him. It all adds up to a resounding no, in my opinion.
- MJL

The problem is, you did dismiss him out of hand:

Byfuglien is a poor defender in my opinion. He's undisciplined, he runs around in his zone, and he cheats on the offensive end. Not the player we need in my opinion. In my opinion he's not the player you seem to feel he is.
The fitness issue just seals the deal. Zero interest in him as a player. I don't care if Winnipeg is giving him away. No thanks.
If you think that Byfuglien is the top two way defender that this team should build it's defense around, that's fine. I don't. So we'll agree to disagree.

When you say you have zero interest in him as a player, even if he was being given away, it's dismissing him out of hand. That's what I'm responding to.

and if you follow the Toronto boards & Leaf Nation, most of them hate Phaneuf & want him gone.
- puckhead17

We can only hope that Nonis agrees with this... Phaneuf is our only shot at adding a #1 caliber dman without trading half the team away... even though it's going to take a massive UFA overpayment to land him.

We can only hope that Nonis agrees with this... Phaneuf is our only shot at adding a #1 caliber dman without trading half the team away... even though it's going to take a massive UFA overpayment to land him.
- Tomahawk

Kimmo's $$ will do, but yeah, that would be an awesome dream!

I say dream because I think he stays in Toronto, one reason they are moving other bodies, or rumored to do so.

I would love a Couts for Gardiner, not sure if Toronto would do it, or Homer either, but we are, again, loaded with centers 4 at 25 or under plus Vinny.

The problem is, you did dismiss him out of hand:



When you say you have zero interest in him as a player, even if he was being given away, it's dismissing him out of hand. That's what I'm responding to.
- Jsaquella

No, it's not dismissing him out of hand. That opinion is based on a number of factors. Those factors in which I have expanded on in this thread. I have zero interest in him as a player. Regardless of the cost.

And Bill likely has the same opinion. When he made this comment today.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com...p?thread_id=110403&page=1

Any thoughts on the quarterly big buff to philly rumors? I have serious doubts about that one.
- Bearintheforest

Same view as before: Stay away from Byfuglien.
-Bill Meltzer

We can only hope that Nonis agrees with this... Phaneuf is our only shot at adding a #1 caliber dman without trading half the team away... even though it's going to take a massive UFA overpayment to land him.
- Tomahawk

If it took JVR for Schenn it's going to take significant pieces to land Double Dion.

But yeah, might be worth a look as a UFA. With the cap going up he's lining up for a big payday for sure.

We can only hope that Nonis agrees with this... Phaneuf is our only shot at adding a #1 caliber dman without trading half the team away... even though it's going to take a massive UFA overpayment to land him.
- Tomahawk

He's really the only potential option for a high minute two way defenseman available, without making a trade. Not a big fan. But what are the odds he makes it to Free Agency.

If it took JVR for Schenn it's going to take significant pieces to land Double Dion.

But yeah, might be worth a look as a UFA.
- hereticpride

Homer loves trading for rights... who knows.


Edit: BTW, LOL @ Double Dion. BAM BAM!

We can only hope that Nonis agrees with this... Phaneuf is our only shot at adding a #1 caliber dman without trading half the team away... even though it's going to take a massive UFA overpayment to land him.
- Tomahawk

They've been trying to get rid of Phaneuf for two years. They hate his contract and don't think he's a good captain. He might get to UFA if they are a solid playoff team come the trade deadline otherwise they'll move him then.

There is some talk of them resigning him but apparently money and term are both big issues.

They've been trying to get rid of Phaneuf for two years. They hate his contract and don't think he's a good captain. He might get to UFA if they are a solid playoff team come the trade deadline otherwise they'll move him then.

There is some talk of them resigning him but apparently money and term are both big issues.
- mayorofangrytown

Why don't they just name someone else Captain? Or maybe they feel that would cause a rift?

They've been trying to get rid of Phaneuf for two years. They hate his contract and don't think he's a good captain. He might get to UFA if they are a solid playoff team come the trade deadline otherwise they'll move him then.

There is some talk of them resigning him but apparently money and term are both big issues.
- mayorofangrytown

That may change with Carlyle as coach, he fits the description completely as one of his type of players

You talking about Kadri? I can't keep Carlyle's doghouse denizens straight.
- Tomahawk

Carlyle must be getting close to his expiration date.

They've been trying to get rid of Phaneuf for two years. They hate his contract and don't think he's a good captain. He might get to UFA if they are a solid playoff team come the trade deadline otherwise they'll move him then.

There is some talk of them resigning him but apparently money and term are both big issues.
- mayorofangrytown

Franson being on a 1-year deal and Gardiner struggling hampers Phaneuf making it to UFA, too.

The stars definitely need to do some aligning if we hope to have a shot at him.

Why don't they just name someone else Captain? Or maybe they feel that would cause a rift?
- MJL

Who's captain-worthy on that team? Kessel? Lupul? They're not exactly bursting with natural leaders over there.

I interrupt this debate to say Colorado is very fun to watch. as you were

Who's captain-worthy on that team? Kessel? Lupul? They're not exactly bursting with natural leaders over there.
- Tomahawk

Jay McClement comes to mind. And in the future, possibly Dave Bolland and Clarkson. But they're both probably too new to the team at this point.

Why don't they just name someone else Captain? Or maybe they feel that would cause a rift?
- MJL

It's not the team I'm talking about, it's the media and the fans. Even if the team wanted to change captains who would they give it to? One of the new guys? Not one of the kids, they aren't there yet. Kessel is the last one you'd want for Captain and Lupul, while they love him, can't stay in the lineup for more than a handful of games at a time.

I interrupt this debate to say Colorado is very fun to watch. as you were
- nastyflyergirl

you have to say that or the coach will punch you