That's fine, but to suggest he isn't a good player because he ddoesnt have a Stanley cup is beyond foolish

Ray Bourque would have been a bum if not traded to the A vs in his final season. Now he is a Hall of Famer?
- Bieksa#3

I never said he isn't a good player I said he isn't a great player. He didn't make the top 50 list so a lot of insiders feel the same way. He has some good qualities but has some issues also.

Most of that coming from fans who have time to kill on various message boards and need something to talk about. Patrick Kane is a Richard off of the ice, I'd still take him on my team anyday.

Him being injury-prone and missing games during the season is exaggerated, people act like he misses a huge chuck of games every other season. He's not going to be a first line player, but he's solid as a second liner.
- Nucker101

You are totally right... but we also know he plays injured for months at a time.

I think the word left out makes it a different suggestion altogether but Im pretty certain the ongoing debate as been wing or center... on the same line.

Then only one who has mentioned him as a 3rd liner is Bieksa#3 twice in the last few days. Immediately people started chirping about not believing people think he's a 3rd liner.... he's just trolling in absence of Ian. I would love to see a more offensive center there with Kesler on the wing but that doesnt exist on the roster so it is what it is until Horvat is ready to step in one day and be that player.

- boonerbuck

There are at least two others, but I'll let them chime in if they feel like it.

I'm not in the mood to get into one of these debates.

I think the word left out makes it a different suggestion altogether but Im pretty certain the ongoing debate as been wing or center... on the same line.

Then only one who has mentioned him as a 3rd liner is Bieksa#3 twice in the last few days. Immediately people started chirping about not believing people think he's a 3rd liner.... he's just trolling in absence of Ian. I would love to see a more offensive center there with Kesler on the wing but that doesnt exist on the roster so it is what it is until Horvat is ready to step in one day and be that player.

- boonerbuck

Yep I rip Kesler all the time. I say put him on the 4th line. Trade him to the Flint Tropics.

Again you always seem to out do yourself. Would you like some cheese with your

Apples and oranges. When Kesler wins a ConnSymthe and scores the Cup winning goal we can revisit the arguement.

Again right now Kesler is just a good player, not a beast.
- VANTEL

I would have said the same had Kane never won a cup. Same goes for other guys that fall into that category, I don't follow other teams close enough to know which players are speculated by their own fans as being bad teammates or people, despite none of us ever being in the locker room or even meeting the guy.

I never said he isn't a good player I said he isn't a great player. He didn't make the top 50 list so a lot of insiders feel the same way. He has some good qualities but has some issues also.
- VANTEL

The word game. He sucks at it.

Kesler for Hodgson?
- Nucker101

Nah

You are totally right... but we also know he plays injured for months at a time.
- boonerbuck

Well that's true, usually in the playoffs though and a lot of players are playing through some significant injuries during that time of the year. Kesler's have been more common and severe than any Canuck fan would like though.

I never said he isn't a good player I said he isn't a great player. He didn't make the top 50 list so a lot of insiders feel the same way. He has some good qualities but has some issues also.
- VANTEL

Just because he isn't in the top 50 doesn't mean he is invaluble to us. Top 50 isn't even 2 players per team.

I would have said the same had Kane never won a cup. Same goes for other guys that fall into that category, I don't follow other teams close enough to know which players are speculated by their own fans as being bad teammates or people, despite none of us ever being in the locker room or even meeting the guy.
- Nucker101

If Kane didn't have a Conn Symthe and a cup winning goal I would agree too ,but he does.

Just because he isn't in the top 50 doesn't mean he is invaluble to us. Top 50 isn't even 2 players per team.
- Bieksa#3

Exactly.

If Kane didn't have a Conn Symthe and a cup winning goal I would agree too ,but he does.
- VANTEL

Well does anyone know other players who fanbase speculate to be pad people/teammates? Name any good player and I'd still take them on my team. Tanner Glass was a great guy and apparently a very popular teammate, I wouldn't even want him as a 13th forward, I'd rather have a 4th liner who's a bit better on the ice but a total jackass off of it.

This isn't the NFL or NBA where character issues lead to serious crimes and suspensions.(not being racist, the evidence is in the numbers, but to be fair the NFL has 50+ man roster and 2 more teams).

Just because he isn't in the top 50 doesn't mean he is invaluble to us. Top 50 isn't even 2 players per team.
- Bieksa#3

I truthfully have no idea of how invaluable he is to the team ,because I am never in the dressing room. I have no idea how his teammates feel towards him.

Again I have said this will be the 3 rd time . He is a good player. I have yeat to say though he is great.

I truthfully have no idea of how invaluable he is to the team ,because I am never in the dressing room. I have no idea how his teammates feel towards him.

Again I have said this will be the 3 rd time . He is a good player. I have yeat to say though he is great.
- VANTEL

That's the thing though, he doesn't have to be great. He's a second line player(plays on the top PP unit though) and getting paid 5 million dollars(not elite/great player money IMO, just typical for very good, not-great players). If he was getting paid 6 or 7 million dollars then you'd expect top line production. I don't see what's so bad about a 2nd line center who gets around 25 goals and 25-30 assists. I agree with what Jeff O'Neill said on TSN the other night, that 41 goal season and that series against Nashville was the worst thing that's ever happened to Kesler in a way(not economically of course).

3 games for Stuart.

That's the thing though, he doesn't have to be great. He's a second line player(plays on the top PP unit though) and getting paid 5 million dollars(not elite/great player money IMO, just typical for very good, not-great players). If he was getting paid 6 or 7 million dollars then you'd expect top line production. I don't see what's so bad about a 2nd line center who gets around 25 goals and 25-30 assists. I agree with what Jeff O'Neill said on TSN the other night, that 41 goal season and that series against Nashville was the worst thing that's ever happened to Kesler in a way(not economically of course).
- Nucker101

Since it is the 2nd line we are relating him to,

For seasons a large part of his offensive output has come from the 1st PP unit with the Sedins and in small part, short handed. If it were not for his special teams... away from his 2nd line, it would be far less flattering.

Since it is the 2nd line we are relating him to,

For seasons a large part of his offensive output has come from the 1st PP unit with the Sedins and in small part, short handed. If it were not for his special teams... away from his 2nd line, it would be far less flattering.
- boonerbuck

That's true and a fair argument. I'm going to look into writing a blog by comparing him to other centers around the league when it comes to 5-on-5 puck posession and production.

Hosea Cheung ‏@hosea24hours
Garrison jokes about goal being taken away - "I think Santo launched an appeal. I might re-do it. Re-appeal his appeal."

Hosea Cheung ‏@hosea24hours
More Garrison on Santorelli: "I've cooked that guy so many dinners, give him a ride to airport every single time ... No, it's good for him."

Farhan Lalji ‏@FarhanLaljiTSN
#Torts asked if they kept @D_Booth7 out in camp to protect him from himself: "ya, he's a wierd dude..."

That's true and a fair argument. I'm going to look into writing a blog by comparing him to other centers around the league when it comes to 5-on-5 puck posession and production.
- Nucker101

Thats a great topic. His value is less obvious in some areas but is there none the less.

Hosea Cheung ‏@hosea24hours
Garrison jokes about goal being taken away - "I think Santo launched an appeal. I might re-do it. Re-appeal his appeal."

Hosea Cheung ‏@hosea24hours
More Garrison on Santorelli: "I've cooked that guy so many dinners, give him a ride to airport every single time ... No, it's good for him."

Farhan Lalji ‏@FarhanLaljiTSN
#Torts asked if they kept @D_Booth7 out in camp to protect him from himself: "ya, he's a wierd dude..."

- Nucker101

Hosea Cheung ‏@hosea24hours
Garrison jokes about goal being taken away - "I think Santo launched an appeal. I might re-do it. Re-appeal his appeal."

Hosea Cheung ‏@hosea24hours
More Garrison on Santorelli: "I've cooked that guy so many dinners, give him a ride to airport every single time ... No, it's good for him."

Farhan Lalji ‏@FarhanLaljiTSN
#Torts asked if they kept @D_Booth7 out in camp to protect him from himself: "ya, he's a wierd dude..."


- Nucker101

Did they give the goal to Santorelli?

That's true and a fair argument. I'm going to look into writing a blog by comparing him to other centers around the league when it comes to 5-on-5 puck posession and production.
- Nucker101

Parts of Keslers game I really like. The thing I question is why can't they find him suitable linemates? Is it is game /style or is our talent pool really that weak?

Since it is the 2nd line we are relating him to,

For seasons a large part of his offensive output has come from the 1st PP unit with the Sedins and in small part, short handed. If it were not for his special teams... away from his 2nd line, it would be far less flattering.
- boonerbuck

Are the Sedins only 2nd line players if you discount their special teams points then?

2010/11 stats;

Daniel 104p - 42p on the PP = 40% of production is special teams.
Henrik 94p - 35p on the PP = 37% of production is special teams.

Kesler 73p - 30p on the PP 4p SH = 47% of production is special teams.

Relatively comparable.

The difference is that the Sedins got to play with each other at even strength, and Kesler got to play with Raymond (not superstar Leafs Raymond) and Samuelsson...

Kesler has NEVER had legit top6 line mates at even strength.

EDIT: Again, not saying that you claimed Kesler is only a 3rd liner without his special teams production with the Sedins, just posing a similar question in regards to the Sedins special teams production.

Are the Sedins only 2nd line players if you discount their special teams points then?

2010/11 stats;

Daniel 104p - 42p on the PP = 40% of production is special teams.
Henrik 94p - 35p on the PP = 37% of production is special teams.

Kesler 73p - 30p on the PP 4p SH = 47% of production is special teams.

Relatively comparable.

The difference is that the Sedins got to play with each other at even strength, and Kesler got to play with Raymond (not superstar Leafs Raymond) and Samuelsson...

Kesler has NEVER had legit top6 line mates at even strength.
- Fosco

other then sundin

Are the Sedins only 2nd line players if you discount their special teams points then?

2010/11 stats;

Daniel 104p - 42p on the PP = 40% of production is special teams.
Henrik 94p - 35p on the PP = 37% of production is special teams.

Kesler 73p - 30p on the PP 4p SH = 47% of production is special teams.

Relatively comparable.

The difference is that the Sedins got to play with each other at even strength, and Kesler got to play with Raymond (not superstar Leafs Raymond) and Samuelsson...

Kesler has NEVER had legit top6 line mates at even strength.
- Fosco

You also have to factor in zone start usage and quality of competition faced, Kesler doesn't as easy minutes as a lot of other top even strength point producers do around the league. I'm going to start looking at lot of comparable players for Kesler and see how he stacks up at even strength.