Hartnell played 22 minutes because they had 7 powerplays. The same reason LSchenn only played 14 minutes.
- Feanor

Giroux, Hartnell and B Schenn's ES time was up there w/ the D as well -- it wasn't just b/c of PP's.

Hartnell played 22 minutes because they had 7 powerplays. The same reason Giroux played 26 minutes and LSchenn only played 14 minutes.



God forbid he stick up for his teammate by hitting Fraser in the shoulder. He really deserved to be cross checked in the neck for that.
- Feanor

Giroux played 26:00 because the coach put him on both PP units for some time. That can't continue.

Giroux, Hartnell and B Schenn's ES time was up there w/ the D as well -- it wasn't just b/c of PP's.
- Tomahawk

The bench was shortened because of the game situaiton.

The bench was shortened because of the game situaiton.
- MJL

The Flyers were in the lead or tied for 40+ mins of the game, what are you talking about?

And Orr and Rosehill's icetime perfectly matches each other... coincidence?

Yeah, Couturier and Talbot could see more ice, but they weren't playing very well. Who do you turn to after that? You can't put the 4th-line out there at all, and that's why it's part of the reason the top 6-7 forwards get put out there so often at ES.

Anyone know if there will be a game on TV tonight I can watch?

Giroux, Hartnell and B Schenn's ES time was up there w/ the D as well -- it wasn't just b/c of PP's.
- Tomahawk

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Anyone know if there will be a game on TV tonight I can watch?
- JAKEw1234

I wouldnt mind watching McKinnon vs Jones tonight.

The Flyers were in the lead or tied for 40+ mins of the game, what are you talking about?

And Orr and Rosehill's icetime perfectly matches each other... coincidence?

Yeah, Couturier and Talbot could see more ice, but they weren't playing very well. Who do you turn to after that? You can't put the 4th-line out there at all, and that's why it's part of the reason the top 6-7 forwards get put out there so often at ES.
- Tomahawk

No it's not a coincidence. Why would you play either more? Why would either Coach in the situation of the game, play either player more.

The reason you gave for why Giroux played so much in the game, trying to blame it on Rosehill in the lineup, is simply false.

Let's look at some facts and I'll show you what I'm talking about.

In the 12/13 Season, Giroux averaged 15:46 of ice time per game at ES, and 3:40 of ice time per game on the PP.

In game 1, Giroux played 15:53 of ES ice time, and he had 9:34 of ice time on the PP. So tell me where the added ice time came from and why? The game situation, or because the Coach was afraid to play Rosehill?

Giroux and player such as Hartnell had elevated ice times due to the amount of PP's and the game situaton of the Coach shortening the bench in the 3rd.

Adam Hall had 2 shifts in the 3rd for 1:01 of ice time. Was the Coach afraid to play Hall also, or was that because of Rosehill also?

Flyers are a good team who played a good, unlucky game on Wednesday.

Brayden Schenn's going to have a big offensive season. Hopefully the coaching staff has more patience than the majority in here.

Big key will be goaltending. Don't need a Vezina winner. Just a guy that won't kill you with soft and/or untimely goals -- like Bryz was prone to.
- bradleyc4

fire dup

No it's not a coincidence. Why would you play either more? Why would either Coach in the situation of the game, play either player more.

The reason you gave for why Giroux played so much in the game, trying to blame it on Rosehill in the lineup, is simply false.

Let's look at some facts and I'll show you what I'm talking about.

In the 12/13 Season, Giroux averaged 15:46 of ice time per game at ES, and 3:40 of ice time per game on the PP.

In game 1, Giroux played 15:53 of ES ice time, and he had 9:34 of ice time on the PP. So tell me where the added ice time came from and why? The game situation, or because the Coach was afraid to play Rosehill?

Giroux and player such as Hartnell had elevated ice times due to the amount of PP's and the game situaton of the Coach shortening the bench in the 3rd.

Adam Hall had 2 shifts in the 3rd for 1:01 of ice time. Was the Coach afraid to play Hall also, or was that because of Rosehill also?
- MJL

He keeps going, and going....

No it's not a coincidence. Why would you play either more? Why would either Coach in the situation of the game, play either player more.
- MJL

You wouldn't, no matter the situation, and that's kind of the point.

Lavi was directly line matching Rosehill's line w/ Orr's line, so if Carlyle had played Orr even more sparingly, the Flyers 4th-line would have barely saw the ice at ES, pushing even more minutes on the other forwards.

Hartnell was +2:00 over his ES TOI/G average from last season. B Schenn was +1:20. Those are the LW'ers that are going to get overloaded if Talbot's line isn't playing well and Rosehill's line is never going to see the ice. Add the copious amount of PP time, and you have a recipe for dead legs in the 3rd-period.

With 7 PPs, you'd expect the bottom-six forwards to see the ice more to offset fatigue, but Lavi doesn't have enough players at his disposal to do that. The 4th-line is fringe, and there's nothing behind them except a kid that got sent back to Junior on game night.

You wouldn't, no matter the situation, and that's kind of the point.

Lavi was directly line matching Rosehill's line w/ Orr's line, so if Carlyle had played Orr even more sparingly, the Flyers 4th-line would have barely saw the ice at ES, pushing even more minutes on the other forwards.Hartnell was +2:00 over his ES TOI/G average from last season. B Schenn was +1:20. Those are the LW'ers that are going to get overloaded if Talbot's line isn't playing well and Rosehill's line is never going to see the ice. Add the copious amount of PP time, and you have a recipe for dead legs in the 3rd-period.
- Tomahawk

But wouldnt that also mean toronto's forwards would have to play more too, and they were facing a back to back situation. As a matter of fact, what a smart move by Lavi...

... or you might just be overthinking it a bit.

We're not going to get 7 powerplays in Montreal if it's a typical game up there, so let's see how the ice time shakes out after Saturday.

But wouldnt that also mean toronto's forwards would have to play more too, and they were facing a back to back situation. As a matter of fact, what a smart move by Lavi...

... or you might just be overthinking it a bit.
- youarewrong

Despite the 7 PK's, Kadri getting benched half-way through the game, and Orr and Ashton seeing around 6min, outside of Kessel, they still didn't have a single forward close to 20mins.

You wouldn't, no matter the situation, and that's kind of the point.

Lavi was directly line matching Rosehill's line w/ Orr's line, so if Carlyle had played Orr even more sparingly, the Flyers 4th-line would have barely saw the ice at ES, pushing even more minutes on the other forwards.

Hartnell was +2:00 over his ES TOI/G average from last season. B Schenn was +1:20. Those are the LW'ers that are going to get overloaded if Talbot's line isn't playing well and Rosehill's line is never going to see the ice. Add the copious amount of PP time, and you have a recipe for dead legs in the 3rd-period.
- Tomahawk

You ignored every point I made. It had zero to do with Rosehill in the lineup. The ice time would have been the same regardless of who was in that 4th line wing spot. 4th lines don't play much when the team is down a goal early in the 3rd. It is a completely normal situation, with the game the way it was, and the amount of PP's the Flyers had.

A Coach who is in the lead in the 3rd, is not going to play an enforcer, and risk the player getting a penalty. A Coach whose team is down a goal, is going to shorten the bench in the 3rd, and over play his top offensive players. That is normal. Rosehill is not the only play who was pretty much benched in the 3rd, due to the Coach shortening the bench.

Rosehill played 6:22 in the game. That is a normal amount of ice time for a 4th line Winger that doesn't kill penalties. Rinaldo played 9:33, and Hall played 8:48. Nothing wrong with any of those icetimes.

Despite the 7 PK's, Kadri getting benched half-way through the game, and Orr and Ashton seeing around 6min, outside of Kessel, they still didn't have a single forward close to 20mins.
- Tomahawk

But if you said that if they play Orr less then the Flyers play Rosehill less.... Wouldnt that mean that Toronto's top 3 lines would play more then?

I bet if you add up all the totals the Flyers forwards had the same amount of time as the Leafs forwards.

You ignored every point I made. It had zero to do with Rosehill in the lineup. The ice time would have been the same regardless of who was in that 4th line wing spot. 4th lines don't play much when the team is down a goal early in the 3rd. It is a completely normal situation, with the game the way it was, and the amount of PP's the Flyers had.

A Coach who is in the lead in the 3rd, is not going to play an enforcer, and risk the player getting a penalty. A Coach whose team is down a goal, is going to shorten the bench in the 3rd, and over play his top offensive players. That is normal. Rosehill is not the only play who was pretty much benched in the 3rd, due to the Coach shortening the bench.

Rosehill played 6:22 in the game. That is a normal amount of ice time for a 4th line Winger that doesn't kill penalties. Rinaldo played 9:33, and Hall played 8:48. Nothing wrong with any of those icetimes.
- MJL

If they don't dress Rosehill, and with last change, they could easily put Giroux's line out there against TOR's 4th-line to exploit the mismatch. Your 4th-line can then take the odd shift against the other team's 3rd-line, or higher if you can trust them defensively.

With Rosehill in the lineup, you're only able to do 4th-line vs 4th-line, because he's just that useless.

Enforcers generally get little to no ice in the 3rd period unless it's a blowout either way, so the score/situation is moot.

Despite the 7 PK's, Kadri getting benched half-way through the game, and Orr and Ashton seeing around 6min, outside of Kessel, they still didn't have a single forward close to 20mins.
- Tomahawk

Is Jay McClement being second to only Kessel in total icetime in the game normal? McClement played 18:40 in the game including 9:02 of SH ice time. Why did McClement play so much, and other forwards such as Lupul and JVR play less? Because of the PP's and the game situation.

Despite the 7 PK's, Kadri getting benched half-way through the game, and Orr and Ashton seeing around 6min, outside of Kessel, they still didn't have a single forward close to 20mins.
- Tomahawk

Cause 8 of them spent 2 minutes each in the box. That is 16 additional minutes to spread around....

Playing Schenn on the 2nd line, and Read on the 3rd line, doesn't ruin all the other lines. I think it balances out the lines better. I want Voracek on the top line. The Flyers played a significantly different style in game 1 system wise then they did all of last Season. So I don't see any lack of confidence in the system issues.
- MJL

I could live with Schenn on the 2nd line, I just dont want to see the one thing that worked previously not exploited-the first line ( aside from Hartnells injury last year- his body fat is down, thanks Sheena!)

lets revisit this after 10-15 games, if the results are the same- scoring problems, getting down and playing bad catchup with lousy breakouts, we will be talking about the new coach and his new system.

Someone else mentioned the drop back to Giroux on the rush, power play entry that isnt really working ? Any more throughts on that. Is it going to work any differently against other teams when they can watch films and easily defend against it by copying what the leafs did ?

If they don't dress Rosehill, and with last change, they could easily put Giroux's line out there against TOR's 4th-line to exploit the mismatch. Your 4th-line can then take the odd shift against the other team's 3rd-line, or higher if you can trust them defensively.

With Rosehill in the lineup, you're only able to do 4th-line vs 4th-line, because he's just that useless.
- Tomahawk

Simply not true. Having Rosehill in the lineup does not prevent the Coach from playing the Giroux line against the other teams 4th line. Most teams don't truly roll 4 lines. Nor does the 4th line match the other lines shift for shift. All you have to do is skip over the 4th line, which happens all the time, and play them when you get the matchup you want. If you want to prove Rosehill is useless, need to come up with a beter argument. This is the 3rd premise you've tried to use to criticize Rosehill as a player. Nothing wrong with him in the 13th forward/enforcer role.

Despite the 7 PK's, Kadri getting benched half-way through the game, and Orr and Ashton seeing around 6min, outside of Kessel, they still didn't have a single forward close to 20mins.
- Tomahawk

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- bradleyc4

Is that a woman spreading her legs?

I could live with Schenn on the 2nd line, I just dont want to see the one thing that worked previously not exploited-the first line ( aside from Hartnells injury last year- his body fat is down, thanks Sheena!)

lets revisit this after 10-15 games, if the results are the same- scoring problems, getting down and playing bad catchup with lousy breakouts, we will be talking about the new coach and his new system.

Someone else mentioned the drop back to Giroux on the rush, power play entry that isnt really working ? Any more throughts on that. Is it going to work any differently against other teams when they can watch films and easily defend against it by copying what the leafs did ?
- Steelmanpa

I don't think the Flyers executed that PP breakout well. The timing was bad. The other players can't be motionless waiting for Giroux to skate the puck up, and then Giroux is basically trying to stick handle through 4 defenders and his only option is to fire a low percentage shot at the net.

Nor does the 4th line match the other lines shift for shift.
- MJL

Every time 28 in white took the ice, 37 orange immediately jumped over the boards:
http://www.nhl.com/scores...rts/20132014/PL020004.HTM