Well, the difference is, I'm looking at both the short and long term ramifications.

First off, I don't necessarily agree he'd be better served by playing 4th line in the NHL. In Couturier's case, he had a 96 point season after starting it off with mono, and not getting fully up to speed for a month or so. Couturier was dominating the QMJHL and clearly won a roster spot.

Laughton was the 2nd line center for his OHL team. He played well, but at the same time, he was still not even the best center on his own team. Another year in the OHL isn't going to stagnate his growth. If anything, it will give him an opportunity to play a much larger role. Which may well be better for his long term growth as a player, which would be better for the Flyers.

I also don't feel that just by being able to play in the NHL, his ticket should automatically be punched. IMO, It's debatable that he was one of the team's 12 best forwards during the preseason. That alone should give one pause.

That brings up the ELC. If Hall's gone, Laughton is the only real candidate to stay in the spot. Even if they do make a move like Adding a John Mitchell, they still have an open spot for Laughton to stick and play in a fourth line role, which means he'll spend a year off his ELC in a limited role in limited minutes.
- Jsaquella

We've had this discussion before. We disagree on this. I don't think a 4th Junior Season is very valuable for his development playing against players that he is bigger and stronger then. You get better by playing against tougher competition. If he's ready for the NHL, and he helps the team, even in a limited role, that's where I want him to play. Starting the EL deal is not an issue in my opinion.

Easier to replace Hall than Rosehill IMO.
- huks99

I disagree. Hall is the FLyers best faceoff specialist. Then G then Talbot. He helps keep G off defensive faceoffs. The coach just has to use the pieces properly.

We've had this discussion before. We disagree on this. I don't think a 4th Junior Season is very valuable for his development playing against players that he is bigger and stronger then. You get better by playing against tougher competition. If he's ready for the NHL, and he helps the team, even in a limited role, that's where I want him to play. Starting the EL deal is not an issue in my opinion.
- MJL

I'd agree if he had been a dominant player at the lower level. But he wasn't. He was a good player at the lower level, and showed progress. But there was still room to improve at the lower level.

I want him to develop into the best player he can be. Not just get him to the NHL as quick as possible.

The ELC is not the biggest reason I'm hesitant. It's a factor, but not the biggest one. The biggest factor is that I didn't think he was one of their 12 best forwards.

I'd agree if he had been a dominant player at the lower level. But he wasn't. He was a good player at the lower level, and showed progress. But there was still room to improve at the lower level.

I want him to develop into the best player he can be. Not just get him to the NHL as quick as possible.
- Jsaquella

I don't think it's about getting him into the NHL as quick as possible. It's about putting him in the best spot. Sending him back for a 4th Junior Season just so he can dominate, doesn't do him any good in my opinion. If he's good enough to play in the NHL, and he can help the team. He belongs in the NHL. Where he will be challenged. I respect your opinion, and it's shared by others. I just have a different viewpoint.

I don't think it's about getting him into the NHL as quick as possible. It's about putting him in the best spot. Sending him back for a 4th Junior Season just so he can dominate, doesn't do him any good in my opinion. If he's good enough to play in the NHL, and he can help the team. He belongs in the NHL. Where he will be challenged. I respect your opinion, and it's shared by others. I just have a different viewpoint.
- MJL

It's not just so he can go back and dominate, it's so he can get a ton of ice time, in all types of situations and continue his development by playing a ton of minutes.

Maybe playing 4th line is better, but IMO, he wasn't better than Hall in the preseason and keeping the best player makes the team better.

I clarified earlier that I meant to say the marketing was based on aging players...streit, lecavalier and emery......false hopes built around big $ in streit and vincent small $$ in emery
streit makes bruno g look like grossmann
he is soft as pudding (streit)
Honestly most people here dont trust the coach to do anything but continue to try to do the same wrong thing over and over
and its the same song with goaltending and d over and over
groundhog day in hockey
- Steelmanpa

But there's no marketing on Giroux and Couturier and Schenn and Schenn?

Please, stop.

It's not just so he can go back and dominate, it's so he can get a ton of ice time, in all types of situations and continue his development by playing a ton of minutes.

Maybe playing 4th line is better, but IMO, he wasn't better than Hall in the preseason and keeping the best player makes the team better.
- Jsaquella

I agree he wasn't better then Hall. But apparently they feel he was better then Vandevelde or Raffl. Or there were other factors such as they wanted Raffl to get some AHL time to adjust to the smaller rink.
I don't think getting lots if ice time in all situation in Juniors is as good as playing in the NHL at any role, for his development. I think getting 4th line minutes in the NHL is much better for his development then getting top line minutes for a 4th Junior Season, playing against kids that he is bigger, stronger, and better then as a whole. If he's not ready for the NHL, then send him back. If he looks out of place before 9 games, send him back. But if he looks like he belongs, well then he belongs.

WHY was Hall waived....

I disagree. Hall is the FLyers best faceoff specialist. Then G then Talbot. He helps keep G off defensive faceoffs. The coach just has to use the pieces properly.
- jstross

U guys think hall is bobby f ING Clarke .....he is a 4th line player nobody wanted last year....signed with us for a very cheap deal...lucky to get any deal....IMO ....but just b/c he can win face offs doesn't mean anything....the flyers were gonna go in another direction at the end of last season and not offer any deal to hall....but u guys think he is this great irreplaceable player...I say bs.

I agree he wasn't better then Hall. But apparently they feel he was better then Vandevelde or Raffl. Or there were other factors such as they wanted Raffl to get some AHL time to adjust to the smaller rink.
I don't think getting lots if ice time in all situation in Juniors is as good as playing in the NHL at any role, for his development. I think getting 4th line minutes in the NHL is much better for his development then getting top line minutes for a 4th Junior Season, playing against kids that he is bigger, stronger, and better then as a whole. If he's not ready for the NHL, then send him back. If he looks out of place before 9 games, send him back. But if he looks like he belongs, well then he belongs.
- MJL

And if Hall is claimed, who is the 4th line center? VandeVelde? Talbot?

That plays into my dislike of the waivers on Hall. They lose Hall and then Laughton is the best option to replace him. That's why I called the move to waive Hall short-sighted.

And if Hall is claimed, who is the 4th line center? VandeVelde? Talbot?

That plays into my dislike of the waivers on Hall. They lose Hall and then Laughton is the best option to replace him. That's why I called the move to waive Hall short-sighted.
- Jsaquella

Well I guess this means Laughton's the 4th line center? Or am I missing something?

Easier to replace Hall than Rosehill IMO.
- huks99

whether we agree or not, i believe that this is how the flyers see it. they clearly value fighting ability, and i guess they think getting a cheap fighter like rosehill won't be so easy (i guess rosehill can be considered a value when compared to jody shelley)

clearly i think it's silly, but it is what it is i guess. hopefully he clears and it doesn't matter

U guys think hall is bobby f ING Clarke .....he is a 4th line player nobody wanted last year....signed with us for a very cheap deal...lucky to get any deal....IMO ....but just b/c he can win face offs doesn't mean anything....the flyers were gonna go in another direction at the end of last season and not offer any deal to hall....but u guys think he is this great irreplaceable player...I say bs.
- huks99

Nobody has come close to saying that Hall is a great irreplaceable player. Let's look at the situation. Because he was the only reliable faceoff guy on the team, Giroux had to take a ridiculous amount of faceoffs. Including in the defensive zone on defensive zone starts, and on the Penalty Kill. So you have your best offensive players taking far too many defensive zone starts, when he should be getting a lot more offensive zone starts. So if you have a faceoff guy like Hall, who can take some of those defensive zone draws instead of Giroux. And use Giroux for more offensive zone starts and situations then he did last year. Do you think that could make the Flyers a better team?

U guys think hall is bobby f ING Clarke .....he is a 4th line player nobody wanted last year....signed with us for a very cheap deal...lucky to get any deal....IMO ....but just b/c he can win face offs doesn't mean anything....the flyers were gonna go in another direction at the end of last season and not offer any deal to hall....but u guys think he is this great irreplaceable player...I say bs.
- huks99

He's not irreplaceable. But he is a good solid player that several teams wanted last year. Hall is not just a good face-off guy, but he's also a very capable penalty killer.

Jay Rosehill is a goon, who was playing in the AHL when the Flyers traded for him because Jake Voracek got into a fight. He is the definition of replaceable. It's dumb to waive a guy that can play and fill a role to keep a guy who's only hockey skill is being able to fight.

Nobody has come close to saying that Hall is a great irreplaceable player. Let's look at the situation. Because he was the only reliable faceoff guy on the team, Giroux had to take a ridiculous amount of faceoffs. Including in the defensive zone on defensive zone starts, and on the Penalty Kill. So you have your best offensive players taking far too many defensive zone starts, when he should be getting a lot more offensive zone starts. So if you have a faceoff guy like Hall, who can take some of those defensive zone draws instead of Giroux. And use Giroux for more offensive zone starts and situations then he did last year. Do you think that could make the Flyers a better team?
- MJL

We share the same exact thoughts.

We do also have Vinny though. That helps.

Well I guess this means Laughton's the 4th line center? Or am I missing something?
- Giroux_Is_God

Right now, with Hall on waivers, they have 12 forwards:

Hartnell-Giroux-Voracek
Schenn-Lecavalier-Simmonds
Talbot-Couturier-Read
Rosehill-Laughton-Rinaldo

So, by default, he is.

And if Hall is claimed, who is the 4th line center? VandeVelde? Talbot?

That plays into my dislike of the waivers on Hall. They lose Hall and then Laughton is the best option to replace him. That's why I called the move to waive Hall short-sighted.
- Jsaquella

I dislike the possibility of losing Hall also. But I think Laughton is capable, although I don't think he'd be effective as Hall on draws or on the PK. I think they have something in the works. It may happen or it might not. They're obviously comfortable with risking Hall. If they lose Hall and it turns out that it's just for Cap space, then I won't be happy about it. But I'm going to let it play out and see what happens. Hall could still be in the lineup opening night.

Right now, with Hall on waivers, they have 12 forwards:

Hartnell-Giroux-Voracek
Schenn-Lecavalier-Simmonds
Talbot-Couturier-Read
Rosehill-Laughton-Rinaldo

So, by default, he is.
- Jsaquella

Seeing Rosehill in there makes me cry a little.

In similar news (mind you, I'm the biggest Phillies fan around...), I'm not kidding you fine ladies and gents when I say that I cried like a (frank)in baby for 10 minutes when Jeter and Pettite took Mo out of the game instead of Girardi.

Jeter said, "It's time to go, Mo..."

I lost it.

Right now, with Hall on waivers, they have 12 forwards:

Hartnell-Giroux-Voracek
Schenn-Lecavalier-Simmonds
Talbot-Couturier-Read
Rosehill-Laughton-Rinaldo

So, by default, he is.
- Jsaquella

That's just it. You know they're going to carry more then 12 forwards. Something is up.

Seeing Rosehill in there makes me cry a little.

In similar news (mind you, I'm the biggest Phillies fan around...), I'm not kidding you fine ladies and gents when I say that I cried like a (frank)in baby for 10 minutes when Jeter and Pettite took Mo out of the game instead of Girardi.

Jeter said, "It's time to go, Mo..."

I lost it.
- Giroux_Is_God

That was handled in a fantastic way. Very cool to see Jeter and Pettitte, as long time teammates, go get Mo.

That's just it. You know they're going to carry more then 12 forwards. Something is up.
- MJL

Yes, probably. They could recall Raffl or maybe add a guy like Mitchell via trade...Still, boils down to risking Rosehill or Hall, and I'd waive Rosehill everytime.

That's just it. You know they're going to carry more then 12 forwards. Something is up.
- MJL

D and a 2nd for a scoring winger....?

Homer loves dem 2nd rounders....

That was handled in a fantastic way. Very cool to see Jeter and Pettitte, as long time teammates, go get Mo.
- Jsaquella

3 out of the "core 4", no?

Posada was the other one I think?

EDIT: As a little lad of about 8 years I met Tino Martinez and Posada in Jim's.

/anecdote

D and a 2nd for a scoring winger....?

Homer loves dem 2nd rounders....
- Giroux_Is_God

If they could get a guy like Mitchell for Meszaros, it'd be a good move.

3 out of the "core 4", no?

Posada was the other one I think?
- Giroux_Is_God

Yep. They all came up together and stayed teammates for years and years. It might be Girardi's best move as manager in the last 4 years