Booner what are your thoughts on Burke returning as GM, or do you think that ship has sailed?
- AlexF

Never thought about it to be honest. All I can say is the potty mouth isnt a deterrent to the Canucks owner or else he wouldnt have steered Torts behind the bench...

A lot can change in a few years.

Also, one look at the teams record since Gillis took over will show how his moves positively affected this team.

I'd argue that yes his last 18 months have been sub-par, but I refuse to ignore his record. The guy built a winning team, and he'll have numerous suitors once he departs this job.
- Gullzy

How much of it can be credited to Gillis? Burkes drafted players like the Sedins, Kesler, Bieksa etc were all reaching their prime... Luongo wasnt Gillis. Gillis gets credit for adding depth to this team(years ago now) and to be accurate, his lack of forward depth has continued to show its ugly head over and over. For all we know, Nonis could have found the depth to do what Gillis did and beyond because Gillis has proven to most to be overrated now, rightly so.

Booner what are your thoughts on Burke returning as GM, or do you think that ship has sailed?
- AlexF

Is anyone actually discussing this?!

In what bizarro world is this even under consideration?

Never thought about it to be honest. All I can say is the potty mouth isnt a deterrent to the Canucks owner or else he wouldnt have steered Torts behind the bench...
- boonerbuck

Was Burke fired by the Aquillini's, or was it John McCaw and Stan McCammon?

Problem is, as the canuck blogger, you would have to provide your real name.
All those dark, disturbed confessions you've made will come back to haunt you.

But saying that, I'm excited about the stocking possibilities. So you got my vote!
- bloatedmosquito

I can live with that.

Was Burke fired by the Aquillini's, or was it John McCaw and Stan McCammon?
- james

If I remember correctly, they fired Burke and were dismissed themselves soon after, or one of them was soon after. Im foggy on it tho..

I would love to see someone like Pierre Lacroix come out of nowhere and take the GM seat.

Was Burke fired by the Aquillini's, or was it John McCaw and Stan McCammon?
- james

I believe it was my McCaw and McCammon and Nonis was fired by the Aquillini's. Could be wrong though, but that's what I can recall.

How much of it can be credited to Gillis? Burkes drafted players like the Sedins, Kesler, Bieksa etc were all reaching their prime... Luongo wasnt Gillis. Gillis gets credit for adding depth to this team(years ago now) and to be accurate, his lack of forward depth has continued to show its ugly head over and over. For all we know, Nonis could have found the depth to do what Gillis did and beyond because Gillis has proven to most to be overrated now, rightly so.
- boonerbuck

One word: Ehrhoff.

I don't agree with this. I'm no Gillis fan but he has made moves to provide depth. He's shown that he's not affaid to take a chance and pull the trigger. Nonis did (frank) all except stuff his face with popcorn.

The players Gillis traded for have had strong previous seasons (point totals). I think AV needs to take some of the blame for not putting these players in situations where they could succeed. We have no idea what kind of influences others have on his decision making process; owner, coach, etc.

Gillis was voted GM of the year by his peers. Don't you think they would know if Gillis was riding Burkes or Nonis' coattails?

As much as some people overrate Gillis, you underrate him.

If I remember correctly, they fired Burke and were dismissed themselves soon after, or one of them was soon after. Im foggy on it tho..

I would love to see someone like Pierre Lacroix come out of nowhere and take the GM seat.

- boonerbuck

McCammon fired Burke and then quite. Those two HATED each other.

Was Burke fired by the Aquillini's, or was it John McCaw and Stan McCammon?
- james

Burke wasn't fired, he was not offered a contract and walked.

Nice work Nucker.

Nice blog Nucker, like Marwood I took math/stat courses repeatedly, but it was because I loved them, so more stats please! For instance, would love to see what being "15th best" actually looks like compared to first best. The first 15 teams could be very close with a steep drop off after that, so the comparisons don't really mean much to me in this context.

Alex, I think what is missing in all of this is that while Tortarella is "known" as a defensive coach, defence is really the portion of the game when your team is without the puck. I fail to see how having a more aggressive forecheck (defence) can be anything but a good thing for increasing the offence. I also thought Nuckers reference to the increase in shot blocking of forwards was important. It is much less likely that a player is going to get injured blocking a shot from a forward than from a defenceman.

I won't lie, I wasn't in favour of hiring Tortarella because of his reputation, but I am prepared to wait and see before judging him as a coach, especially because I have a feeling that some of the things I thought I knew about him aren't entirely true...

Burke wasn't fired, he was not offered a contract and walked.
- A_SteamingLombardi

This, and the bit above by BM. Not being re-hired is about the same as being fired...

Nice blog Nucker, like Marwood I took math/stat courses repeatedly, but it was because I loved them, so more stats please! For instance, would love to see what being "15th best" actually looks like compared to first best. The first 15 teams could be very close with a steep drop off after that, so the comparisons don't really mean much to me in this context.

Alex, I think what is missing in all of this is that while Tortarella is "known" as a defensive coach, defence is really the portion of the game when your team is without the puck. I fail to see how having a more aggressive forecheck (defence) can be anything but a good thing for increasing the offence. I also thought Nuckers reference to the increase in shot blocking of forwards was important. It is much less likely that a player is going to get injured blocking a shot from a forward than from a defenceman.

I won't lie, I wasn't in favour of hiring Tortarella because of his reputation, but I am prepared to wait and see before judging him as a coach, especially because I have a feeling that some of the things I thought I knew about him aren't entirely true...
- 1970vintage

Truth be told, that's been my position all along, my moments of debbie downer aside. We'll see what happens and hope for the best.

Nice work Nucker I wish I had the time to study that much. These 12-14 hr days are starting to kill me.

Truth be told, that's been my position all along, my moments of debbie downer aside. We'll see what happens and hope for the best.
- AlexF

Knowing what I know about a large proportion of the HB population, I'm waiting to make up my own mind about about "Spaz"

Nice work Nucker I wish I had the time to study that much. These 12-14 hr days are starting to kill me.
- thundachunk

love the avatar, is that an ode to Ian?

love the avatar, is that an ode to Ian?
- A_SteamingLombardi

Though he was bias to the extreme at times and had a few homer ideas here and there he put in the effort to get us new blogs consistently. I think we can all appreciate that. Change is good though. I do however think it would be good to add a bias counterpart for Todd. It makes for good banter. It could get pretty boring in here otherwise.

Though he was bias to the extreme at times and had a few homer ideas here and there he put in the effort to get us new blogs consistently. I think we can all appreciate that. Change is good though. I do however think it would be good to add a bias counterpart for Todd. It makes for good banter. It could get pretty boring in here otherwise.
- thundachunk

So Esplen is 100% gone from HB?

One word: Ehrhoff.

I don't agree with this. I'm no Gillis fan but he has made moves to provide depth. He's shown that he's not affaid to take a chance and pull the trigger. Nonis did (frank) all except stuff his face with popcorn.

The players Gillis traded for have had strong previous seasons (point totals). I think AV needs to take some of the blame for not putting these players in situations where they could succeed. We have no idea what kind of influences others have on his decision making process; owner, coach, etc.

Gillis was voted GM of the year by his peers. Don't you think they would know if Gillis was riding Burkes or Nonis' coattails?

As much as some people overrate Gillis, you underrate him.
- bloatedmosquito

Gillis had the option of hiring Quenville(or other replacements) and firing AV his first day as GM. Gillis then resigned AV down the road... hard to not look at MG when crediting AV for negative roster problems knowing this...

I may have not mentioned the couple of successful roster additions made(Hamhuis another) but just because a couple can be found doesnt dismiss that both Nonis and Gillis rode on Burkes work for the most part and it has continued. I don't know where you picked up that I thought it was Nonis,,, I was pretty clear that he did very little but add Luongo to the roster.... you have it backwards.

Gillis had the option of keeping Ehrhoff but let him walk. His best addition plays for someone else now. It was short lived. I've been talking about the core which apparently, Ehrhoff wasnt.

So Esplen is 100% gone from HB?
- vancity787

110%


If you're desperate he has a word press blog, google didn't find it, but someone posted a link in another thread... http://ianesplencanucks.wordpress.com

Gillis had the option of hiring Quenville(or other replacements) and firing AV his first day as GM. Gillis then resigned AV down the road... hard to not look at MG when crediting AV for negative roster problems knowing this...

I may have not mentioned the couple of successful roster additions made(Hamhuis another) but just because a couple can be found doesnt dismiss that both Nonis and Gillis rode on Burkes work for the most part and it has continued. I don't know where you picked up that I thought it was Nonis,,, I was pretty clear that he did very little but add Luongo to the roster.... you have it backwards.

Gillis had the option of keeping Ehrhoff but let him walk. His best addition plays for someone else now. It was short lived. I've been talking about the core which apparently, Ehrhoff wasnt.
- boonerbuck

I'm not really interested in arguing the semantics of how successful Gillis is compared to Nonis/Burke etc. Certainly Burke did a lot of the work in assembling the team that went to the finals. I don't think that it is fair, however, to categorize Gillis as a failure simply because Burke did a lot of the work. Every organization who undergoes a management change sees the same thing. The new GM comes in, surveys the personnel and makes a decision on who the best people are moving forward. Because Burke "drafted" or "signed" a player does not mean that Gillis doesn't get credit for "re-signing" or extending them, or even for not trading them.

On the AV thing, I guess Gillis felt that AV was the best coach available, and he was pretty successful in his time in Vancouver. Would another coach have gotten this team over the hump? Perhaps we're about to find out...

For the record, hated AV, glad he's gone.

I'm not really interested in arguing the semantics of how successful Gillis is compared to Nonis/Burke etc. Certainly Burke did a lot of the work in assembling the team that went to the finals. I don't think that it is fair, however, to categorize Gillis as a failure simply because Burke did a lot of the work. Every organization who undergoes a management change sees the same thing. The new GM comes in, surveys the personnel and makes a decision on who the best people are moving forward. Because Burke "drafted" or "signed" a player does not mean that Gillis doesn't get credit for "re-signing" or extending them, or even for not trading them.

On the AV thing, I guess Gillis felt that AV was the best coach available, and he was pretty successful in his time in Vancouver. Would another coach have gotten this team over the hump? Perhaps we're about to find out...

For the record, hated AV, glad he's gone.
- 1970vintage

For someone not interested in the discussion, your post is anything but ... I had to scan the thread to see where anyone used the term failure. I see me sharing Gillis' success with Burke and Nonis in a lesser share. To me, that is totally fair... arguing against or using the term "Gillis built" seems a bit unfair to Gillis' predecessors... not that anyone really gives a poop. I wasnt the one who originally brought up Gillis predecessors btw. I just share a different opinion and thats why it stands out. Bloated misrepresented what I said as well... reading my earlier posts would clarify that.

For someone not interested in the discussion, your post is anything but ... I had to scan the thread to see where anyone used the term failure. I see me sharing Gillis' success with Burke and Nonis in a lesser share. To me, that is totally fair... arguing against or using the term "Gillis built" seems a bit unfair to Gillis' predecessors... not that anyone really gives a poop. I wasnt the one who originally brought up Gillis predecessors btw. I just share a different opinion and thats why it stands out. Bloated misrepresented what I said as well... reading my earlier posts would clarify that.
- boonerbuck

Ok, maybe failure was the wrong word. I'm just saying that because someone else "built it" doesn't mean that the person who inherited hasn't also done a good job with the same people.

Having said that, there is a lot (especially lately) that is less than desirable as well.

I'm not for or against Gillis, it was just that I don't buy the "Burke built it Gillis is a shmo" point of view.

Ok, maybe failure was the wrong word. I'm just saying that because someone else "built it" doesn't mean that the person who inherited hasn't also done a good job with the same people.

Having said that, there is a lot (especially lately) that is less than desirable as well.

I'm not for or against Gillis, it was just that I don't buy the "Burke built it Gillis is a shmo" point of view.
- 1970vintage

Again, you are misrepresenting what I've said. I never claimed any one GM built any team alone. People are arguing with me who's actually claiming other GM's can share the credit. I *asked* how much of it is Gillis????... I also admitted Gillis has added depth and that this team will shape up next season if he's still here or not.... debunking the tone of the replies coming my way. I see other posters on here saying Gillis built this team and Nonis built that team... not me... I also see someone saying this team wont move forward with Gillis...not me... For such a small thread I dont see how it can be so confusing who said what.... people are debating a pre conceived argument against without reading....