I don't think they will have the cap room to pay him that much next season. If he doesn't retire and insists on being paid that much they will have to replace him with a younger, cheaper and inferior player.
- Feanor

Well, the $7mm they have under the cap for next year is calculated BEFORE Pronger's LTIR exemption.

They will have "cap room", but it will be in the form of Pronger's cushion and be money spent over the cap

Lupul was extended to $4.25 AAV a year after he almost scored a point-per-game in 07-08, only to see his production fall the next season. He was traded before his extension kicked in.

JvR was extended to $4.25 AAV after his blowing up in the '11 PO's, and then fell back to earth the following season b/c of injuries. He was traded before his extension kicked in.

Both were part of decent hockey deals, but it's debatable whether or not either would have even been available if there wasn't some buyer's remorse with those extensions and the Flyers needing cap space to shore up other holes.
- Tomahawk

The JvR one can be debated, but Lupul was dealt to Anaheim as part of a huge package to land Pronger (and Anaheim seemed to have no issue accepting that horrible extension). That's happening every day of the week.

mason's had 4 bad yrs in a row, so we have to be realistic. if the flyers have middle of the pack goaltending, that would still be an improvement.
- isaiah520

Yeah, improving on 28th-ranked even-strength SV% shouldn't be too tall of a task... we hope.

Lupul was extended to $4.25 AAV a year after he almost scored a point-per-game in 07-08, only to see his production fall the next season. He was traded before his extension kicked in.

JvR was extended to $4.25 AAV after his blowing up in the '11 PO's, and then fell back to earth the following season b/c of injuries. He was traded before his extension kicked in.

Both were part of decent hockey deals, but it's debatable whether or not either would have even been available if there wasn't some buyer's remorse with those extensions and the Flyers needing cap space to shore up other holes.
- Tomahawk

I doubt they would have traded JVR for L Schenn if Pronger hadn't got hurt.

You're talking to a sometimes Eagles fan. I know from embarrassment
- Jsaquella

I know it got lost in the sauce because no one is paying attention, but how bout the Phils being swept at home by the Mets this weekend. That's ridiculous.

Well what are the Cap problems they have this Season of beyond?
- MJL

MJL,

The "problem" itself is running out of cap space. That is what everyone is always talking about when they say cap problems. Yes, we get what you are saying.. its not a "problem" that you can't sign every player in the league, its just part of the cap... nobody ever denied that.

The PROBLEM the Flyers run into when trying to sign a player is the CAP itself, therefore THAT is the cap problem. Its a GIVEN by almost everyone... its "understood" what people mean when they say "cap problems"... that being: the flyers cannot do this or that because of the salary cap that is in place = "cap problem"

So, while you consistently maintain that there is no problem, just the existence of a CAP, I'll argue that the existence of the cap is the reason the Flyers have a "problem" making certain moves. Surely, you understand that though?

The JvR one can be debated, but Lupul was dealt to Anaheim as part of a huge package to land Pronger (and Anaheim seemed to have no issue accepting that horrible extension). That's happening every day of the week.
- jmatchett383

Both are debatable, that's why we're debating it right now

I doubt they would have traded JVR for L Schenn if Pronger hadn't got hurt.
- Feanor

Even if JVR turns out to be a perennial 30 goal scorer, the trade made sense for the Flyers. They needed to add a defenseman somehow.

People can quibble with the return for JVR, but he was traded when his stock was at an all time low.

I know it got lost in the sauce because no one is paying attention, but how bout the Phils being swept at home by the Mets this weekend. That's ridiculous.
- PLindbergh31

They're playing out the string. Next year Amaro will pray for one more year out of Howard, Utley and Rollins rather than blowing things up.

Even if JVR turns out to be a perennial 30 goal scorer, the trade made sense for the Flyers. They needed to add a defenseman somehow.

People can quibble with the return for JVR, but he was traded when his stock was at an all time low.
- PLindbergh31

I really like LSchenn so I'm happy with the return. I just think that if Pronger had stayed healthy they would have resigned Matt Carle and kept JVR, or traded him for another forward.

They're playing out the string. Next year Amaro will pray for one more year out of Howard, Utley and Rollins rather than blowing things up.
- Jsaquella

The thing is Amaro shouldn't get next season. Phils have to be rebuilt I hope it's someone else doing the rebuilding. This team has had a good run.

I doubt they would have traded JVR for L Schenn if Pronger hadn't got hurt.
- Feanor

I also doubt that Jeff Carter and Mike Richards would have gotten traded if Giroux hadn't emerged as a potential superstar... but it doesn't change the fact that Homer has routinely traded guys he's freshly extended to hefty extensions that he suddenly found hard to justify against the cap at the time.

Both are debatable, that's why we're debating it right now
- Tomahawk

Arguing and debating are 2 different things. You can't debate that.

They're playing out the string. Next year Amaro will pray for one more year out of Howard, Utley and Rollins rather than blowing things up.
- Jsaquella

To be fair, I don't know if anybody will take Howard in a trade, unless the Phils eat a LOT of salary. Even then, seems kind of unlikely.

Lupul was extended to $4.25 AAV a year after he almost scored a point-per-game in 07-08, only to see his production fall the next season. He was traded before his extension kicked in.

JvR was extended to $4.25 AAV after his blowing up in the '11 PO's, and then fell back to earth the following season b/c of injuries. He was traded before his extension kicked in.

Both were part of decent hockey deals, but it's debatable whether or not either would have even been available if there wasn't some buyer's remorse with those extensions and the Flyers needing cap space to shore up other holes.
- Tomahawk

I think anyone's available in the right deal, regardless of contract status.

Did their contracts play a part in getting dealt? Eh, maybe. Nothing's ever black and white, but both of these guys (JvR and Lupul) were dealt in pretty good hockey deals.

Arguing and debating are 2 different things. You can't debate that.
- jmatchett383

You don't think Murray had players higher on his asking list than Lupul, after they already traded him away once before?

The thing is Amaro shouldn't get next season. Phils have to be rebuilt I hope it's someone else doing the rebuilding. This team has had a good run.
- PLindbergh31

Amaro shouldn't have gotten to make the call on Sandberg...he should have been fired the same day as Manuel

I really like LSchenn so I'm happy with the return. I just think that if Pronger had stayed healthy they would have resigned Matt Carle and kept JVR.
- Feanor

The Pronger injury had a trickle down effect on this franchise. It was very unfortunate. I really feel for Pronger that his quality of life has been greatly affected. That upsets me more than the ramifications it's had on the team.

To be fair, I don't know if anybody will take Howard in a trade, unless the Phils eat a LOT of salary. Even then, seems kind of unlikely.
- BulliesPhan87

They probably won't...but the Phillies will be counting on him to produce at a fairly high level.

Amaro shouldn't have gotten to make the call on Sandberg...he should have been fired the same day as Manuel
- Jsaquella

I also doubt that Jeff Carter and Mike Richards would have gotten traded if Giroux hadn't emerged as a potential superstar... but it doesn't change the fact that Homer has routinely traded guys he's freshly extended to hefty extensions that he suddenly found hard to justify against the cap at the time.
- Tomahawk

I don't agree that JVR's contract was hard to justify. He was the 2nd overall pick and had put up decent numbers and they locked him up for six years before their franchise defenseman suffered a career ending injury. After that happened, they traded him for a defenseman.

There a number of ways that the Flyers can submit their roster on Sept 30th to be Cap compliant. At the most they would risk losing a player such as Gervais or Rosehill to a Waiver claim. Which wouldn't be the end of the World. The Flyers don't have a Cap problem. They will be Cap compliant, and have the neccessary flxibility to make in Season moves. They might not have a ton of cap space to use at the deadline, but things thend to change during an NHL Season. If anybody wants to see exactly how the Flyers can easily get under the Cap, I'd be happy to show them some likely scenarios. Anybody who thinks the Flyers have a Cap problem. I'd be happy to take a look at the eividence that they can provide that shows they have a Cap problem.
- MJL

I think we just have to define what some people call a problem and what some people don't. I think everyone here can agree and knows that the Flyers CAN and WILL get under the cap by game 1.

Where the term Cap Problem is coming from is 2 fold. First people are upset that because of trying to play too close to the Cap the Flyers lost out on a decent 3rd line winger. This has been confirmed by Homer, so there is no use argueing it. Second, some of us are more concerned about what will be available down the road in the season. Me; I would rather clear some Cap room now, that way I can add significant pieces before the TDL. I would rather not have to use Pronger's LTIR if I don't have to, as LTIR is not bankable.

I really dont have any issues with the contracts that any of our players currently have. Maybe Timonen hurt us a bit, but its only 1 year. The Pronger contract is really making life difficult, but there isn't anything that can be done about that. He was worth the contract, and no-one could predict this happening.

They probably won't...but the Phillies will be counting on him to produce at a fairly high level.
- Jsaquella

What's that saying, about wishing in one hand, and poopting in the other?

What's that saying, about wishing in one hand, and poopting in the other?
- BulliesPhan87

Exactly. They're going to be expecting 30 homers and 100+ RBIs out of him...they won't get it, in all likelihood.

His health is in decline. He can still produce in stretches, but he's probably not a feared guy that can carry a lineup for three or four weeks at a time anymore.

Where the term Cap Problem is coming from is 2 fold. First people are upset that because of trying to play too close to the Cap the Flyers lost out on a decent 3rd line winger.
- youarewrong

Missing out on Cleary was a good thing if the contract rumors were true. They shouldn't have offered him anything more than what Detroit gave him, or what St Louis just gave Morrow.