Okay, but how much room will that leave for call-ups, and Cap space to aquire at the TDL?
- youarewrong

Flyers are likely going to have well over 3M of available Cap space to work with, once all the moves are made. And they likely won't lose a single player. This is dependent on whether or not the Flyers make any more signings between now and then.

They don't even have to do that.

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Vincent Lecavalier ($4.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Adam Hall ($0.600m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Chris Pronger ($4.941m)
GOALTENDERS
Ray Emery ($1.650m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $66,709,356; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $390,644
- Feanor

So your waiving Rosehill then? And sending Laughton back to Juniors? And hoping no injuries occur that Meszaros couldnt fill in for? Yea, i dont see a problem there.

It would leave plenty of space for call-ups as once Prongers goes on LTIR they will have 2-3 million in available space depending on the final roster. However there will be limited room for TDL acquisitions due to LTIR restrictions on prorating contracts. So if they want to add someone making significant money, they will have to shed salary. Of course that assumes that no other players get seriously injured and go on LTIR during the season which would give them much more space to work with.
- BiggE

There's no LTIR restrictions on prorating contracts, per se. The difference is that you can't bank LTIR Cap space. Space under the Upper limit, can be banked.

since cleary is clearly a wimp can we sign mason raymond

So then, its safe to say, it could be a problem. FOr example if Nashville decides to trade Shea Weber at the deadline, we wont have any Cap space to get him, and will have to trade a significant chunk of Cap to get him.... Right?

Sounds like a problem to me....
- youarewrong

What would the Flyers be trading for Weber? Does it make sense that some players off the current roster would be going in the other direction? Those players also have a Cap hit.

Flyers are likely going to have well over 3M of available Cap space to work with, once all the moves are made. And they likely won't lose a single player. This is dependent on whether or not the Flyers make any more signings between now and then.
- MJL

I'm not saying that they wont become Cap compliant by the time the season starts, but to not realize thier Cap situation isn't in the best shape is laughable, and.... ready.... flawd.

So your waiving Rosehill then? And sending Laughton back to Juniors? And hoping no injuries occur that Meszaros couldnt fill in for? Yea, i dont see a problem there.
- youarewrong

You only need to have that lineup to start the season. Then you can put Pronger on LTIR and have an extra ~$4.5 million to play with and can easily carry 13 forwards at a time.

I don't think Rosehill would be claimed, but you could send Couturier down for the first game if you were really worried about that.

So your waiving Rosehill then? And sending Laughton back to Juniors? And hoping no injuries occur that Meszaros couldnt fill in for? Yea, i dont see a problem there.
- youarewrong

The consensus all Summer has been that Rosehill stinks, adn shouldn't be on the team. And that Laughton should go back to Juniors. Now that's deemed a problem?

What would the Flyers be trading for Weber? Does it make sense that some players off the current roster would be going in the other direction? Those players also have a Cap hit.
- MJL

Thats not the issue. What if its Matt Read, Laughton, Morin, and first round picks... thats only 900k in cap hit if Laughton is back in juniors.... How BOUT DAT!

You only need to have that lineup to start the season. Then you can put Pronger on LTIR and have an extra ~$4.5 million to play with and can easily carry 13 forwards at a time.

I don't think Rosehill would be claimed, but you could send Couturier down for the first game if you were really worried about that.
- Feanor

You don't have to send Couturier down for the first game.

Thats not the issue. What if its Matt Read, Laughton, Morin, and first round picks... thats only 900k in cap hit if Laughton is back in juniors.... How BOUT DAT!
- youarewrong

Every trade made in the NHL has to be worked around the Cap. Might as well say they'll get Weber for Rosehill and Rinaldo, and say, see there's a Cap problem!

The consensus all Summer has been that Rosehill stinks, adn shouldn't be on the team. And that Laughton should go back to Juniors. Now that's deemed a problem?
- MJL

I like Rosehill. And I think Laughton should go back for 1 more year or juniors. But again, your moving away from the issue. You deflect better then a jedi against storm troopers.

Every trade made in the NHL has to be worked around the Cap. Might as well say they'll get Weber for Rosehill and Rinaldo, and say, see there's a Cap problem!
- MJL

So you are saying Bill and Homer are wrong?

I'm not saying that they wont become Cap compliant by the time the season starts, but to not realize thier Cap situation isn't in the best shape is laughable, and.... ready.... flawd.
- youarewrong

The problem is that you can't show that the Flyers Cap situation isn't in the best shape with actual facts. You can only claim it to be so, and then tell someone who has shown on this board, to have the highest level of insight into the Cap, and how it works, that their opinion is laughable. Let's look at the facts and find out.

So you are saying Bill and Homer are wrong?
- youarewrong

You're going to have to be more specific.

So you are saying Bill and Homer are wrong?
- youarewrong

You're going to have to be more specific.

Every trade made in the NHL has to be worked around the Cap. Might as well say they'll get Weber for Rosehill and Rinaldo, and say, see there's a Cap problem!
- MJL

I was asked to mention that the Flyers already lost Cleary and that's how the discussion started so continuing it and disregarding Cleary is avoiding the actual argument. It's like someone saying roll up the window of the car, the dog might jump out and you saying, it's okay it's not a problem. Then the dog jumps out the window and dies on the road and you say, see, there's no problem.

So then, its safe to say, it could be a problem. FOr example if Nashville decides to trade Shea Weber at the deadline, we wont have any Cap space to get him, and will have to trade a significant chunk of Cap to get him.... Right?

Sounds like a problem to me....
- youarewrong

(sighs)
Weber's cap hit is 7.9 million, of course they would need to move salary to get him. Plus I'm pretty sure Nashville is going to want some players back in that deal not just picks and prospects, so what is your point?

I like Rosehill. And I think Laughton should go back for 1 more year or juniors. But again, your moving away from the issue. You deflect better then a jedi against storm troopers.
- youarewrong

No, I moved directly towards the issue. What that poster suggested is just one possible way to get Cap compliant. There are other moves.

The problem is that you can't show that the Flyers Cap situation isn't in the best shape with actual facts. You can only claim it to be so, and then tell someone who has shown on this board, to have the highest level of insight into the Cap, and how it works, that their opinion is laughable. Let's look at the facts and find out.
- MJL

WOW someone thinks highly of themselves.....

You're going to have to be more specific.
- MJL

How about this from Bill's blog?

"As Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren acknowledged today, this whole mess could have been prevented if the Flyers weren't already over the salary cap ceiling (and temporarily maxed out at 50 contracts on the reserve list). "

WOW someone thinks highly of themselves.....
- youarewrong

Pretty sure he was referring to me.

I was asked to mention that the Flyers already lost Cleary and that's how the discussion started so continuing it and disregarding Cleary is avoiding the actual argument. It's like someone saying roll up the window of the car, the dog might jump out and you saying, it's okay it's not a problem. Then the dog jumps out the window and dies on the road and you say, see, there's no problem.
- youarewrong

None of your posts address the actual facts of the Flyers Cap situation. This is just another bad analogy. If you want to discuss the Flyers Cap, let's discuss the actual facts of it. Cleary decided to play in Detroit, where he wanted to be all along. The Flyers offered him a much better deal then Detroit did. If they currently have a Cap problem, how were they able to offer a 3 year deal for 2.75M a year to Cleary?

The problem is that you can't show that the Flyers Cap situation isn't in the best shape with actual facts. You can only claim it to be so, and then tell someone who has shown on this board, to have the highest level of insight into the Cap, and how it works, that their opinion is laughable. Let's look at the facts and find out.
- MJL

You are wasting your breath as am I, some people just don't get it.
Heck Detroit right now needs to shed some salary, I guess Ken Holland must be an idiot.

How about this from Bill's blog?

"As Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren acknowledged today, this whole mess could have been prevented if the Flyers weren't already over the salary cap ceiling (and temporarily maxed out at 50 contracts on the reserve list). "
- youarewrong

That is Bill's statement. Every single NHL team has the same restraints of the Salary Cap. No team, including the Flyers, has an unlimited amount of cap space to sign anyone they want. The Flyers could have chosen back in July to sign Cleary then, and not sign someone else. That is the whole point of the NHL Salary Cap. You can't sign every player under the Sun! To ignore that, is to ignore the whole reason the Cap exists.