i hope it doesnt. and i get it: who knows what the exact situation will be when they get to that point. maybe they'll shed some salary elsewhere, something like that. i just mean that while i like the additions, all of these veteran deals have me worried about the cap situation for the upcoming years (there's only so much cap space per year)

EDIT: but such is life as a flyers fan. should be adequately prepared for it by now
- FlyerMike18

Here's my outlook on that. Every year we have the same concerns. But yet every year, they put a lineup on the ice, that on paper, looks to be a quality team. Lot's of factors involved there, in how it actually turns out. But the Cap has never stopped the Flyers from making the moves they want to make. And I don't think it will in the future, either. And contrary to popular opinion, the Flyers do know what they are doing in terms of handling the Cap. They don't always do what's popular, and sometimes there's a casualty or two. But overall, you have to love how this team is always trying to win.

Cleary is a hard working, well rounded player, who is coming from the best run franchise in the league (Detroit). Too many of you are stressing over the cap hit and length of deal, it's really not that big a concern to me.

By the 3rd year of the deal, the cap will probably be up to 75 million plus, so it shouldn't be that big a deal. Besides, take a look at history. How many other players will be either traded or injured by then? Probably quite a few, so what is the real issue?

A lot of people have an emotional attachment to Simon Gagne, I get that. However in reality, Gagne, at this point in his career, is a shell of what he used to be and the odds would heavily be against him being able to stay healthy for a full season. On the other hand, Cleary is a guy who has often had his best games in the playoffs and he brings more size and grit to the Flyers forward corps.

All in all, this is a good move and I look forward to seeing to Cleary in the orange and black.

Here's my outlook on that. Every year we have the same concerns. But yet every year, they put a lineup on the ice, that on paper, looks to be a quality team. Lot's of factors involved there, in how it actually turns out. But the Cap has never stopped the Flyers from making the moves they want to make. And I don't think it will in the future, either. And contrary to popular opinion, the Flyers do know what they are doing in terms of handling the Cap. They don't always do what's popular, and sometimes there's a casualty or two. But overall, you have to love how this team is always trying to win.
- MJL

Well put.

Exactly -- and it's versatile enough where, as someone astutely mentioned earlier, if L2 isn't strong enough defensively, you can easily flip-flop Simmonds and Read...and maybe have a vicious third line and more defensive ability on the second.
- AllInForFlyers

That was me. I would be a little concerned with defensive play if Simmonds and B Schenn are on the same line. I think Read would be a good offensive complement to Vinnie and Schenn and make the line more rounded. Meanwhile a 3rd line of
Cleary-Couturier-Simmonds would be a tough line to play against and should be very solid both offensively and defensively.

Here's my outlook on that. Every year we have the same concerns. But yet every year, they put a lineup on the ice, that on paper, looks to be a quality team. Lot's of factors involved there, in how it actually turns out. But the Cap has never stopped the Flyers from making the moves they want to make. And I don't think it will in the future, either. And contrary to popular opinion, the Flyers do know what they are doing in terms of handling the Cap. They don't always do what's popular, and sometimes there's a casualty or two. But overall, you have to love how this team is always trying to win.
- MJL

no doubt, and i totally understand that. i just can't help that it still keeps me up at night a little bit

and also 100% agreed: i'd much rather see them make their mistakes this way than the opposite way (being too conservative and balking at opportunities to improve the team). it scares me still, but it's certainly the better of the two options

with cleary in the fold, what are the project lines for the flyers?
- DDM-Coga

Hartnell - Giroux - Voracek
B. Schenn - Lecavalier - Simmonds
Cleary - Couturier - Read
Talbot - Hall - Rinaldo

13th forward: Rosehill

Timonen - L. Schenn
Coburn - Streit
Grossmann - Gustafsson

7th D: Gervais

Emery/Mason

Hartnell - Giroux - Voracek
B. Schenn - Lecavalier - Simmonds
Cleary - Couturier - Read
Talbot - Hall - Rinaldo

13th forward: Rosehill

Timonen - L. Schenn
Coburn - Streit
Grossmann - Gustafsson

7th D: Gervais

Emery/Mason
- bmeltzer

no Mesz (for now?)

Hartnell - Giroux - Voracek
B. Schenn - Lecavalier - Simmonds
Cleary - Couturier - Read
Talbot - Hall - Rinaldo

13th forward: Rosehill

Timonen - L. Schenn
Coburn - Streit
Grossmann - Gustafsson

7th D: Gervais

Emery/Mason
- bmeltzer

Any musical inspiration for that 3rd line

Here's my outlook on that. Every year we have the same concerns. But yet every year, they put a lineup on the ice, that on paper, looks to be a quality team. Lot's of factors involved there, in how it actually turns out. But the Cap has never stopped the Flyers from making the moves they want to make. And I don't think it will in the future, either. And contrary to popular opinion, the Flyers do know what they are doing in terms of handling the Cap. They don't always do what's popular, and sometimes there's a casualty or two. But overall, you have to love how this team is always trying to win.
- MJL

True...but it would be so much easier to take if they would just win a cup every once in a while.

Any musical inspiration for that 3rd line
- ob18

get the fogarty out of here

get the fogarty out of here
- Marc D

I should have expected this

Wait...are people really using injury history as a reason to prefer Gagne over Cleary? I think Cleary would have to somehow retroactively die last season to have a worse injury history than Gagne.

Depending on their point of view, and how much they value one type of player vs. another, there are some aspects of this deal folks may not like. I get that. But the injury history of Cleary relative to Gange should not one of them. About the only person that loses that comparison to Gagne is Carlo Colaiacovo.
- BringBack25

It won't be a week into camp before we hear about Carlo getting hurt.

Larry Ziedel

It won't be a week into camp before we hear about Carlo getting hurt.


- tangent_man

Hartnell - Giroux - Voracek
B. Schenn - Lecavalier - Simmonds
Cleary - Couturier - Read
Talbot - Hall - Rinaldo

13th forward: Rosehill

Timonen - L. Schenn
Coburn - Streit
Grossmann - Gustafsson

7th D: Gervais

Emery/Mason
- bmeltzer

I don't know much about Cleary, but those lines look good to me. I'm hoping mad max shows up this year, not the max from last year. Him just seemed to be off last year, like most of the team.

The Flyers need to start looking into to guys with thicker skulls.

somebody with a working brain refresh me, i recall couturier and simmonds playing together at some point and i liked it... was it playoffs 2012?

I love Dan Cleary. Huge signing to me. He's a guy that knows what it takes, and brings huge grit to a third line that looked to be Gagne-Couts-Read, which is defensively responsible with some offense but soft. Cleary-Couts-Read is tougher to play against and is just as adequate offensively.

somebody with a working brain refresh me, i recall couturier and simmonds playing together at some point and i liked it... was it playoffs 2012?
- -davies-

http://www.leftwinglock.c...ayertype=F&gametype=ALL#A

last year for 2.1% of the time.

http://www.leftwinglock.c...ayertype=F&gametype=ALL#A

the previous year for 1.16% of the time.

http://www.leftwinglock.com/line-combos/index.php?season=2012&team=PHI&strength=EV&playertype=F&gametype=ALL#A

last year for 2.1% of the time.

http://www.leftwinglock.c...ayertype=F&gametype=ALL#A

the previous year for 1.16% of the time.
- ob18

wow who would guess that exists


i remember enjoying that 2.1%

wow who would guess that exists


i remember enjoying that 2.1%
- -davies-

That's a good site to use if you are in fantasy leagues, you can future break it down to power play or PK time.

That's a good site to use if you are in fantasy leagues, you can future break it down to power play or PK time.
- ob18

nice. i am debating whether or not to do a fantasy league this year.

Here's my outlook on that. Every year we have the same concerns. But yet every year, they put a lineup on the ice, that on paper, looks to be a quality team. Lot's of factors involved there, in how it actually turns out. But the Cap has never stopped the Flyers from making the moves they want to make. And I don't think it will in the future, either. And contrary to popular opinion, the Flyers do know what they are doing in terms of handling the Cap. They don't always do what's popular, and sometimes there's a casualty or two. But overall, you have to love how this team is always trying to win.
- MJL

Mike Richards, Jeff Carter, Joffery Lupul, James van Reimsdyk, Danny Briere, Ilya Bryzgalov. Love or hate these players, they were all move for specific reasons but for the most part they were all moved to create cap space. A contract such as the new one makes another player unsafe. On one hand we are lucky Homer gets players locked up early but it doesn't mean they see the end of these contracts regardless of age. When Richards and Carter were traded and Briere stayed, why is this? If these players were on an even playing field and we were in that same situation, would the result be the same? How much is their a guarantee that Giroux sees through his deal? I agree that the Flyers know what theyre doing but it does seem like choices are made in the spare of the moment. Our "core"" rarely sees things through.

At this point I have no choice but to be hopeful Dan Cleary does well here. Make no mistake, he's not Danny Briere in the playoffs. In fact Cleary will unlikely get the PP time he was getting in Detroit, which is where he made his living with the limited points he got last season. In my opinion there is one more spot on the PP open that I'm sure Laviolette will wanna give to Sean Couturier and Erik Gustafsson. I dont like the deal. Too much money, too many years. Cleary is turning 35 in December. Cleary's role is gonna be smaller here then it was with the Wings. It has been no secret that I wanted a vet on that third line. I wanted Gagne first because of his familiarity with the Club or Brenden Morrow who I feel showed stronger skill sets when he got to Pittsburgh but died off in the playoffs in a role Cleary is logically gonna be playing here. I feel Max Talbot could have played on the third line. He's younger and makes lesser money. I was okay with Laughton and McGinn playing the third line. I was okay with the options we already had. I'm just not pleased with this surprise option that could very well bite us in the Kiester, judging by past experience on this team. Pronger was a healthy player too when he got here. Even played an 82 game schedule, all four rounds in the playoffs and every Olympic game in 09-10 just for his body to fall apart the two next seasons. I think this is too much for a player going on to 35 and I don't like it.

Mike Richards, Jeff Carter, Joffery Lupul, James van Reimsdyk, Danny Briere, Ilya Bryzgalov. Love or hate these players, they were all move for specific reasons but for the most part they were all moved to create cap space. A contract such as the new one makes another player unsafe. On one hand we are lucky Homer gets players locked up early but it doesn't mean they see the end of these contracts regardless of age. When Richards and Carter were traded and Briere stayed, why is this? If these players were on an even playing field and we were in that same situation, would the result be the same? How much is their a guarantee that Giroux sees through his deal? I agree that the Flyers know what theyre doing but it does seem like choices are made in the spare of the moment. Our "core"" rarely sees things through.
- dingo8urbaby

i can't agree with the bolded statement (for all of them except for briere). i feel like those trades were all hockey moves first. the cap space gained was just a side issue. that's the way i saw it, at least

Not sure what to think about the signing. Good player but a long contract at a cap hit I'm not too comfy with having on the books. I guess the one positive it allows some of the younger players to take some extra time to develop further in the AHL rather than rushing them...which seems to have worked for Detroit.

I'm more concerned about getting under the cap before the start of the season. Every team in the NHL knows that we are in trouble we will be selling desperate.