Lark Voorhees.
- Stee-Dot

Meh.

you sound like UG

the matchups he got were far less difficult than the ones gunnarson faced

franson got a slumping seguin bergeron line while gunnar was defending lucic krejci horton etc.

you need to acknowledge this. it is fact.
- Dozzer

I was thinking the same thing. But you're Fransoning like honesthockey on a Gardner sandwich.

I guess Franson shut his line down better than Gunnar shut his line down, no? There is a reason the coach played Franson as much, and more than, Gunnar and it wasn't because Gunnar was more effective.

i think he may demand a trade if he feels like he is getting lowballed.. he wont do it publicaly.. but i could see it.
- Dozzer

Possible -- but we don't know if the negotiations have been acrimonious. We just know they haven't agreed. Happens to lots of players every year without trades being demanded or made.

Of course, if he's been reading these pages --------

i think he is just the latest installment of overhyped toronto d-men

schenn before him, and before that colaiacovo.. i could keep going
- Dozzer

I agree. I also agree that we need Gunnar more.
Different style of player, but he's the one we need more of.

I was thinking the same thing. But you're Fransoning like honesthockey on a Gardner sandwich.

I guess Franson shut his line down better than Gunnar shut his line down, no? There is a reason the coach played Franson as much, and more than, Gunnar and it wasn't because Gunnar was more effective.
- systemtool

Instead of continuing the discussion can we sum it up as:

You like Franson more for the Leafs than does Bruce?

dozzer's right; gunarsson is a very decent first pairing d-man (inspite of phaneuf, i would like to add), while franson is a second/third pairing defenseman who just had a good season last year on 3rd pair with a very responsible partner in fraser..
anything over 2m/y is too much for franson; would rather have leafs going after ian white for 1.5-1.8m 2y contract.. (white's still unsigned?)

I was thinking the same thing. But you're Fransoning like honesthockey on a Gardner sandwich.

I guess Franson shut his line down better than Gunnar shut his line down, no? There is a reason the coach played Franson as much, and more than, Gunnar and it wasn't because Gunnar was more effective.
- systemtool

K that was funny

and i could argue that the reason franson succeeded was because his line wasnt as good as the line gunnar was defending.

actually not even close to as much firepower.

more than one coach has used gunnar against the crosbys and ovies and staals of the league.. franson would look like a statue against guys like that.

Instead of continuing the discussion can we sum it up as:

You like Franson more for the Leafs than does Bruce?


- Colin Dambrauskas

The majority of us do, and it is getting tiresome.

Instead of continuing the discussion can we sum it up as:

You like Franson more for the Leafs than does Bruce?


- Colin Dambrauskas

That's wrong. Bruce likes Gunnarson more for the Leafs than does Tool. Please try to pay attention.

K that was funny

and i could argue that the reason franson succeeded was because his line wasnt as good as the line gunnar was defending.

actually not even close to as much firepower.

more than one coach has used gunnar against the crosbys and ovies and staals of the league.. franson would look like a statue against guys like that.
- Dozzer

Well, there have been only two coaches, no? So I guess if Ron Wilson did it, it has to be true. Couldn't help it!

i think he is just the latest installment of overhyped toronto d-men

schenn before him, and before that colaiacovo.. i could keep going
- Dozzer

thing is...the Leafs defense is only just starting to improve. Its been their weakness for years (system or not) and now that it is, certain players are standing out more than others and vis versa.

Every team needs a Gunnar, and a Franson, and a Frazer, and even a Phaneuf...you need a combination of all these types of guys to have a strong defense. You arent going to have 6 defensemen who all play a solid offensive game and are also very reliable defensively...

thing is...the Leafs defense is only just starting to improve. Its been their weakness for years (system or not) and now that it is, certain players are standing out more than others and vis versa.

Every team needs a Gunnar, and a Franson, and a Frazer, and even a Phaneuf...you need a combination of all these types of guys to have a strong defense. You arent going to have 6 defensemen who all play a solid offensive game and are also very reliable defensively...
- Colin Dambrauskas

Ahem. I thought we summed this up!?

That's wrong. Bruce likes Gunnarson more for the Leafs than does Tool. Please try to pay attention.
- Canada Cup

You guys complain of gunner and franson, why dont we just get rid of the problem since no one can play with him? Goodbye phaneuf for max value, sign hainsey for dirt cheap. Done and done.

What are possible trades or rumors regarding phaneuf and the return to the leafs?

The majority of us do, and it is getting tiresome.
- systemtool

just because you have majority doesn't mean you're right
See:

Bush, George W.
Religion.
Etc.

just because you have majority doesn't mean you're right
See:

Bush, George W.
Religion.
Etc.
- UsernameUnknown

It also doesn't mean you're wrong, but it sure leans heavily in favour of one more than the other. Besides, only hindsight proves who is right or wrong, so this is just a debate for the sake of it. Nobody is right, or wrong, today.

The majority of us do, and it is getting tiresome.
- systemtool

that i dont see the world the way you do?



i apologize, i had no idea you were omnipotent lol

You guys complain of gunner and franson, why dont we just get rid of the problem since no one can play with him? Goodbye phaneuf for max value, sign hainsey for dirt cheap. Done and done.

What are possible trades or rumors regarding phaneuf and the return to the leafs?
- Mapleleafs_91

Who am I complaining about?

thing is...the Leafs defense is only just starting to improve. Its been their weakness for years (system or not) and now that it is, certain players are standing out more than others and vis versa.

Every team needs a Gunnar, and a Franson, and a Frazer, and even a Phaneuf...you need a combination of all these types of guys to have a strong defense. You arent going to have 6 defensemen who all play a solid offensive game and are also very reliable defensively...
- Colin Dambrauskas

i am not saying bench franson.. lol.. just dont pay him more than a couple of mill

That's wrong. Bruce likes Gunnarson more for the Leafs than does Tool. Please try to pay attention.
- Canada Cup

Damnit!

that i dont see the world the way you do?



i apologize, i had no idea you were omnipotent lol
- Dozzer

Omnisicient

You guys complain of gunner and franson, why dont we just get rid of the problem since no one can play with him? Goodbye phaneuf for max value, sign hainsey for dirt cheap. Done and done.

What are possible trades or rumors regarding phaneuf and the return to the leafs?
- Mapleleafs_91

NOW we are talking
taking the bull by the horns

Who am I complaining about?
- Canada Cup

I dont know i just see alot of hate down this thread bro gunner bro franson. Gunner is OKAY, hes not the greatest 1st pairing defender he is no superstar hes like a ron hainsey for example ron hainsey aint a superstar but can log big minutes. Thats all gunner is good for is big minutes and playing a simple game defensively at times. This year he was absolute crap, all his other years were solid i dont care what anyone says this year was terrible worst year for him (hip probably).

Ahem. I thought we summed this up!?
- systemtool

Officially - summed.

Omnisicient
- Canada Cup

lol same thing different religion right?

that i dont see the world the way you do?



i apologize, i had no idea you were omnipotent lol
- Dozzer

In regards to the repetitiveness. Not whether we agree or not. Dont be so vain.