it's maddening, isn't it?
- Fountain-San

unreal

how old is toews??25?

ill write down what stamkos has accomplished by age 25 and which aspects he excels at at 25 and get back to you on this one,

i am terrified to see what this guy can do in his prime...it is going to be a nightmare for everyone in the east >:]
- RileyB77

Toews' scoring has never regressed, and there's no reason to believe it will as he's hitting his offensive prime for a player who focuses on defense so much. Stamkos, it appears, is at the peak of his scoring prowess, based on his only .03 increase since his second year. Even if Stamkos does progress to being a 100 point player, Toews is well on his way to being an 85 point guy, and that 15 point difference, with most of it likely on the PP, isn't enough for me to choose the guy who is clearly less influential in every part of the game. I know betting is not permitted, but I like Toews' chances to win a Hart before Stamkos as well

Toews' scoring has never regressed, and there's no reason to believe it will as he's hitting his offensive prime for a player who focuses on defense so much. Stamkos, it appears, is at the peak of his scoring prowess, based on his only .03 increase since his second year. Even if Stamkos does progress to being a 100 point player, Toews is well on his way to being an 85 point guy, and that 15 point difference, with most of it likely on the PP, isn't enough for me to choose the guy who is clearly less influential in every part of the game. I know betting is not permitted, but I like Toews' chances to win a Hart before Stamkos as well
- rollpards19

stamkos had 97 pts in the 82 game schedule

im not one to argue souly on points...i think it is lame as (frank)

im also not one to ignore the points...

all i want to make clear is that stamkos has a lot more to his game than just scoring goals, i dont care who u take on ur team

people underrate every other aspect of his game... his speed is unreal..and his defensive game has improved significantly to someting that is actually good, and in time it will be even better

Toews' scoring has never regressed, and there's no reason to believe it will as he's hitting his offensive prime for a player who focuses on defense so much. Stamkos, it appears, is at the peak of his scoring prowess, based on his only .03 increase since his second year. Even if Stamkos does progress to being a 100 point player, Toews is well on his way to being an 85 point guy, and that 15 point difference, with most of it likely on the PP, isn't enough for me to choose the guy who is clearly less influential in every part of the game. I know betting is not permitted, but I like Toews' chances to win a Hart before Stamkos as well
- rollpards19

you cant say someone is at the peak of their developement at age 23...come off it

he put up 60 goals when he was 21/22 ....who the (frank) does that? lol

you arent just a "goal scorer" if you do that at age 21...

if you do that at that age you have a hell of a lot more to ur game than watching someone else battle for the puck and give you the picture perfect pass just so you can take the shot and finish it off..

you cant say someone is at the peak of their developement at age 23...come off it
- RileyB77

He's not at the peak of his development as a hockey player, but as a point producer I feel he probably is, as evidenced by his minimal increase over the last 4 years. Stamkos is really good, and has gotten severely underrated by some of my fellow Hawk fans on this board, because he's definitely a top 5 center. But I do think there are compelling arguments to select Toews to be the cornerstone of a franchise over Stamkos. I think part of the reason some vitriol exists when Hawk fans discuss Toews in relation to the game's best players, is that when you see all the things this guy does night in and night out, how many battles he refuses to lose just off sheer force of will, or his incredible one on one stickhandling skills, and how it leads to tangible results (incredible possession numbers, best forward on two SC teams) its hard to admit anyone but Crosby is better

He's not at the peak of his development as a hockey player, but as a point producer I feel he probably is, as evidenced by his minimal increase over the last 4 years. Stamkos is really good, and has gotten severely underrated by some of my fellow Hawk fans on this board, because he's definitely a top 5 center. But I do think there are compelling arguments to select Toews to be the cornerstone of a franchise over Stamkos. I think part of the reason some vitriol exists when Hawk fans discuss Toews in relation to the game's best players, is that when you see all the things this guy does night in and night out, how many battles he refuses to lose just off sheer force of will, or his incredible one on one stickhandling skills, and how it leads to tangible results (incredible possession numbers, best forward on two SC teams) its hard to admit anyone but Crosby is better
- rollpards19

There it is. I've been saying that for 10 pages. Nobody seems to get it. But wait, the next Stamkos fan is gonna say he scores more goals in 4......3......2......1.

He's not at the peak of his development as a hockey player, but as a point producer I feel he probably is, as evidenced by his minimal increase over the last 4 years. Stamkos is really good, and has gotten severely underrated by some of my fellow Hawk fans on this board, because he's definitely a top 5 center. But I do think there are compelling arguments to select Toews to be the cornerstone of a franchise over Stamkos. I think part of the reason some vitriol exists when Hawk fans discuss Toews in relation to the game's best players, is that when you see all the things this guy does night in and night out, how many battles he refuses to lose just off sheer force of will, or his incredible one on one stickhandling skills, and how it leads to tangible results (incredible possession numbers, best forward on two SC teams) its hard to admit anyone but Crosby is better
- rollpards19

you may feel he is but it is highly unlikely (almost impossible) to be at the peak of your production at age 23 after only 4 years in the league

you have your opinion and i love toews he is one of my favorite players..i know the drive he has i see the determination he has

you can build a franchise around both of these guys...

i dont really care who wins. im just letting people know (like the idiot who just commented below you) that stamkos has more to his game than just goals.. and he has determination too...how do you think he finds new ways to put up 50+ goals consistanty? he is determined, he finds new ways to score and determined nobody will stop him...its not about the goals though, that is just a result of pure talent and dedication...

there are people on this thread that have said you can build a franchise around toews but not stamkos, and im just here to say that that is absoloutely rediculous

yeah yeah he only scores cause of that 1 timer from the faceoff circle ..no no..he continuously finds new ways to score goals and that has to do with amazing vision, fantastic hockey sense, seeing plays develope before they do, or making the play by himself...he isnt just a goal scorer...the goals are RESULTS of all of these assets he contains

you may feel he is but it is highly unlikely (almost impossible) to be at the peak of your production at age 23 after only 4 years in the league

you have your opinion and i love toews he is one of my favorite players..i know the drive he has i see the determination he has

you can build a franchise around both of these guys...

i dont really care who wins. im just letting people know (like the idiot who just commented below you) that stamkos has more to his game than just goals.. and he has determination too...how do you think he finds new ways to put up 50+ goals consistanty? he is determined, he finds new ways to score and determined nobody will stop him...its not about the goals though, that is just a result of pure talent and dedication...

there are people on this thread that have said you can build a franchise around toews but not stamkos, and im just here to say that that is absoloutely rediculous

yeah yeah he only scores cause of that 1 timer from the faceoff circle ..no no..he continuously finds new ways to score goals and that has to do with amazing vision, fantastic hockey sense, seeing plays develope before they do, or making the play by himself...he isnt just a goal scorer...the goals are RESULTS of all of these assets he contains
- RileyB77

Name calling too. That's cool. It's above not below by the way. Read through the blog and you will see how many non-hawk fans and Tampa Bay fans continuously said the words goals and points.

By the way, Stamkos has great vision and scores so many ways.......uhm yeah, seems like everything you said relates to scoring and offence. Just saying.

you may feel he is but it is highly unlikely (almost impossible) to be at the peak of your production at age 23 after only 4 years in the league

you have your opinion and i love toews he is one of my favorite players..i know the drive he has i see the determination he has

you can build a franchise around both of these guys...

i dont really care who wins. im just letting people know (like the idiot who just commented below you) that stamkos has more to his game than just goals.. and he has determination too...how do you think he finds new ways to put up 50+ goals consistanty? he is determined, he finds new ways to score and determined nobody will stop him...its not about the goals though, that is just a result of pure talent and dedication...

there are people on this thread that have said you can build a franchise around toews but not stamkos, and im just here to say that that is absoloutely rediculous

yeah yeah he only scores cause of that 1 timer from the faceoff circle ..no no..he continuously finds new ways to score goals and that has to do with amazing vision, fantastic hockey sense, seeing plays develope before they do, or making the play by himself...he isnt just a goal scorer...the goals are RESULTS of all of these assets he contains
- RileyB77

Don't think anyone actually said that. Of course both players are franchise players. People that have chosen Toews look at all facets of hockey. That's where Toews has the upper hand. It's my opinion, if you want to know what I base that on please start on page 1, hopefully you can get before reading it all because others haven't. I've been repeating and repeating and repeating.

you cant say someone is at the peak of their developement at age 23...come off it
- RileyB77

Wayne Gretzky's highest goal totals, in order of age:
Age 21 - 92 goals
Age 23 - 87 goals
Age 24 - 73 goals
Age 22 - 71 goals
Age 26 - 62 goals

He never had more than 55 in any other season.

Wayne Gretzky's highest goal totals, in order of age:
Age 21 - 92 goals
Age 23 - 87 goals
Age 24 - 73 goals
Age 22 - 71 goals
Age 26 - 62 goals

He never had more than 55 in any other season.
- Sandus

and i bet you gretzky himself would tell you he was better at age 26 than age 21

Hey everyone... Please have the same opinion as me, or else you are not a fan of the game, and you are wrong.

Everything you said is about goals.

Actually, Toews is highly regarded as the best player in the world not named Sydney.

I get it, goals and offense seems to be some people's viewpoint. Many people said, including me, that Stamkos is better offensively

Toews is a generational player. Toews is someone who (here we go again) excels at everything. Of course Stam has more goals, that's all he is required to do. Toews plays all situations on off/defs.

Something to consider, how would Stamkos numbers be if he played the type of defense/3 zone play that Toews does?



Once again, Stamkos is better offensively.

Toews is better all-round.


THERE IS MORE TO HOCKEY THAN GOALS.
- robhawks

Actually I said his all around offense is better if you read my comment, not just goals.

Thank you. A sign of intelligent life.

Actually I totally forgot about +/-. Another thing Toews excels at.

I posed a question a while back that no one has answered yet.......Can you name me something that Toews is not that great at?
- robhawks

Fighting.

Fighting.
- BoltsFan4Life

Also not a great skater, shooter, or good at growing facial hair

Also not a great skater, shooter, or good at growing facial hair
- sbroads24

he seems like a real sour puss too doesn't he? so stamkos definitely gets the edge in the personality department too.

he seems like a real sour puss too doesn't he? so stamkos definitely gets the edge in the personality department too.
- Fountain-San

haha he definitely doesnt win the "guy you'd like to have a beer with" sweepstakes. Facial hair is crappy too. I disagree that he's not a good skater or shooter though. When it comes to literally a shot only contest (the shoot out), hes got a sick release that beats almost 50% of goalies he faces. Sometimes he changes it up and dekes which doesnt work as well as his five hole shot.

haha he definitely doesnt win the "guy you'd like to have a beer with" sweepstakes. Facial hair is crappy too. I disagree that he's not a good skater or shooter though. When it comes to literally a shot only contest (the shoot out), hes got a sick release that beats almost 50% of goalies he faces. Sometimes he changes it up and dekes which doesnt work as well as his five hole shot.
- BlazinMike

lol he is too intense, he frightens me
i wouldnt want to be the one working in the penalty box with him in there

Don't think anyone actually said that. Of course both players are franchise players. People that have chosen Toews look at all facets of hockey. That's where Toews has the upper hand. It's my opinion, if you want to know what I base that on please start on page 1, hopefully you can get before reading it all because others haven't. I've been repeating and repeating and repeating.
- robhawks

Lets just say were lucky to have our guy, and you your guy. Comparisons are dumb

Also not a great skater, shooter, or good at growing facial hair
- sbroads24

Toews isn't a great skater or shooter?

That's news to me

I mean he doesn't have a kovalchuk wrist shot or michael grabner speed but come on

The only thing toews lacks is a one timer, and that's really because he is a true center who plays down low and around the net, not many legit top two centers really showcase a decent one timer

Mike richards, stamkos, and spezza come to mind, but not many others