Toews has Kane? Another 1st overall pick. A very comparable player to St. Louis. A conn Smythe winner. What Stamkos does not have is Duncan Keith or Brent Seabrook
- sbroads24

Not really. Kane usually plays second line until reunited in the playoffs. There are times Toews played with Stalberg, Kruger, and Frolik. So those players could get going.


Hey, another intangible.

Toews has Kane? Another 1st overall pick. A very comparable player to St. Louis. A conn Smythe winner. What Stamkos does not have is Duncan Keith or Brent Seabrook
- sbroads24

They've suck long enough they should have.

None... i'm confused before the test.. I'd skip school and head to the beach with a case of beer.
- wolverine19

Lolololololololol.

At least hand in a couple essays, and share the beer.

Lets try this a different way.


If you are in school and are required to do 10 essays.

1 essay you get 100 %. The other 9 essays you get 50's or maybe less.


Or


You hand in 10 essays that are all about 90% or higher.

Which situation is better for you?

Hahahaha. Sorry. Trying to think of ways to clarify.
- robhawks

Your basically saying that all the essays are just as important as one another. Like saying winning faceoffs is just as important as scoring goals. That doesn't really work

Your basically saying that all the essays are just as important as one another. Like saying winning faceoffs is just as important as scoring goals. That doesn't really work
- sbroads24

How do you score if you lose the Faceoff and the team clears the zone?

Sure. 2 way standouts that also happen to have Norris trophy defensemen on their rosters as well

Bergeron- Chara
Toews - Keith
Datsyuk - Lidstrom

If Stamkos is on CHI they still win the cup.
So answer me this. Since you should build around 2 way centers you would have taken Sean Monahan number 1 overall over Mackinnon then right?
- sbroads24

exactly

How do you score if you lose the Faceoff and the team clears the zone?
- robhawks

Paul Gaustad is great at faceoffs. Should he be a number 1 center?

Let me try a different analogy.

Person A goes for a job interview with "1" good ability

Person B goes for the same interview with many, many more abilities, attributes and so on.

Who do you hire?

I really have no dog in this fight. I would love either player to be a Sabre obviously. I would just take the goal scorer first if I'm building a team
- sbroads24

The past two years, playing without Kane, Toews is 5th in the league in GPG. Now Stammer is obviously first, but that's not a huge gap and its pretty clear Toews is an elite goal scorer in the NHL. They are exactly even in APG, both are pretty close to elite playmakers. The difference between the rest of their games, to me, is greater than the difference in goal scoring. There are only 3 goal scorers between Stamkos and Toews, but I'd say there 25 top 6 centers between them defensively. Even more for penalty killing, faceoffs, and possession numbers.

Yes because +/- is an important statistic. Thomas Vanek was a +47 one season... It's a team stat

Stamkos has a career 1.03 PPG
Toews has a career .91 PPG

Stamkos has 41 more goals in 35 less games than Toews. Stamkos is better offensively. Period no debate
- sbroads24

.1 PPG less for a guy who does everything else including kills penalties... All righty...

There aren't many metrics to measure individual defense, except to say that no one would ever put Stamkos even in the same stratosphere as Toews when it comes to that and about ten other categories.

But I guess it doesn't matter... you're just gonna come back and say points points points...

Toews has Kane? Another 1st overall pick. A very comparable player to St. Louis. A conn Smythe winner. What Stamkos does not have is Duncan Keith or Brent Seabrook
- sbroads24

Because they don't play together?

Paul Gaustad is great at faceoffs. Should he be a number 1 center?
- sbroads24

Once again. Not understanding. That's all Gaustad does.

Toews spews everything.

E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G




This is maddening.

.1 PPG less for a guy who does everything else including kills penalties... All righty...

There aren't many metrics to measure individual defense, except to say that no one would ever put Stamkos even in the same stratosphere as Toews when it comes to that and about ten other categories.

But I guess it doesn't matter... you're just gonna come back and say points points points...
- busmaster

Hey bus, you forgot something..........

Points.

Hahahahaha.

Let me try a different analogy.

Person A goes for a job interview with "1" good ability

Person B goes for the same interview with many, many more abilities, attributes and so on.

Who do you hire?
- robhawks

Person A because he will be the best person for the task that I want to hire him for.

Stamkos.

Person A because he will be the best person for the task that I want to hire him for.

Stamkos.
- rmiethaner

So you don't want a thriving business then?

By the way, Stamkos and Toews have the same metrics in terms of offence correlated with time played.

Who do you hire now?

Let me try a different analogy.

Person A goes for a job interview with "1" good ability

Person B goes for the same interview with many, many more abilities, attributes and so on.

Who do you hire?
- robhawks

If his 1 ability is the ability most sought after for said position, person A.

Once again. Not understanding. That's all Gaustad does.

Toews spews everything.

E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G




This is maddening.
- robhawks

Yes very maddening that you want to group goal scoring ability in with winning faceoffs. Very F'ing frustrating

Yes very maddening that you want to group goal scoring ability in with winning faceoffs. Very F'ing frustrating
- sbroads24

The original question is who do you start a team with.

Most people understand what it takes. I'm making faceoffs group with goals, assists, plus/minus, leadership, defence, everything. It's about the person who has it all.

How is that concept difficult to grasp?

what is it, exactly, that stamkos is lacking?

The original question is who do you start a team with.

Most people understand what it takes. I'm making faceoffs group with goals, assists, plus/minus, leadership, defence, everything. It's about the person who has it all.

How is that concept difficult to grasp?
- robhawks

Why is it difficult to grasp that some "abilities" or "intangibles" are much more important than others? Goal scoring is 100x as important as winning a faceoff and until you realize that there's no point going any further. Having intangibles is a fancy way of saying you do all the little things very well, things that make you an all around good player. Being an elite goal scorer is what makes you a superstar and league MVP. See the difference between intangibles (the little things) and goal scoring (the big thing) ??

what is it, exactly, that stamkos is lacking?
- Fountain-San

He's basically saying Stamkos is a bad player, except for the fact that he scored more goals than everyone

what is it, exactly, that stamkos is lacking?
- Fountain-San

The Indian head on his sweater?

The Indian head on his sweater?
- rmiethaner

He's basically saying Stamkos is a bad player, except for the fact that he scored more goals than everyone
- sbroads24

he typically gets more assists than most players too. loser.

he typically gets more assists than most players too. loser.
- Fountain-San

Yes but you need to win the faceoff first. Stamkos wins 0% of those. You also need a C on your sweater, Stamkos has an A