I dont hold it against him. It just pisses me off. I hate that kinda poop. When you think because you are a better player that you DESERVE to be on the ice... thats a serious problem.

I want the guy who gives 110% every time he hits the ice.

If the reaction wasnt so glaring I wouldnt have even batted an eye. But it was that glaring. Get pissed off. Slam a stick or the door to the bench. Dont openly act disgusted with the guy who is taking your spot on the PP. There is a good reason you are being replaced.
- jak521

I think what you saw was carter looking at who he was replaced by and an eye roll more meant for the coach.

Like 'I can't believe you're replacing me on this line.'

Absolutely positive that he was greatly affected by inuries in the playoffs a a Flyer.
- MJL

Every playoff series???????

he didn't roll his eyes at his coach or himself, he rolled his eyes at his "lesser" teammate, i think is the point he's trying to make

just because you're in your 20s doesn't excuse ahole behavior, i've never understood that theory
- Don'tForgetTocchet

Bingo. It was all ME ME, and no TEAM.

I have seen that face 100 times growing up playing sports. When they stud gets taken out of the game, instead of getting pissed for messing up or whatever, its time to "scoff" at the back up/ lesser talent.

I had a run in with a player on my team my senior year in high school lacrosse over an incident SORT OF like that. We were up big, coach pulled a few of the starters.. A senior who never played varisty was put in for a JR who was our best player. Cocky bastard too. He says to the kid going in, "I got us a 6 goal lead, now dont blow it".

I never chewed a teammate out so bad in my life.

None of those guys had any of their best years with the Flyers.
- PhillySportsGuy

So, they were still great.

Handzus, Umberger and Carter had their best years in a Flyers uniform. You take those guys, I'll take my guys... let's play a game.

The 46 goal season was really an aberration.. that is until this season.

The problem I had with Carter was that he was never dominant as he could be. There were times (the PHX game I was at where they came back and won in OT) where he flat out dominated EVERY facet of the game.

And then there were times where he didnt seem to give his all. I think he relies too much on natural god given talent at times. If he had Richies heart and motor, he would be a top 5-10 talent in the NHL, season in and out.
- jak521

His shooting percentage was of the charts in the 46 goal Season. Everything was going in. It's not reasonable to expect that to continue. He's a 35 goal scorer realistically.
I think the expectations are the issue. I think he was expected to be more dominant then he was capable of being. He wasn't capable of being that dominant player that he showed at times. He was the player that he was. I don't think there was ever any issue of gving his all. So I don't agree with your take. He had plenty of heart here. He wasn't capable of being a top 5-10 talent then, and he's not now. Those expectations are out of whack.

Well we'll start with your comment that Carter can't win faceoffs.
- MJL

05/06 - 48.1%
06/07 - 45.4%
07/08 - 47.7%
08/09 - 48.3%
09/10 - 52.4%
10/11 - 54.7%
Lifetime as a Flyer - 49.1%

Definitely better the last 2 seasons, but fairly substandard his first 3, with a big drop in his 2nd year.

I think what you saw was carter looking at who he was replaced by and an eye roll more meant for the coach.

Like 'I can't believe you're replacing me on this line.'
- PhillySportsGuy

It was more like... "I cant believe you are replacing me with HIM on this line" The laugh was what pissed me off. He literally laughed. Gasp of disbelief/laugh =scoff to me.

So, they were still great.

Handzus, Umberger and Carter had their best years in a Flyers uniform. You take those guys, I'll take my guys... let's play a game.
- mayorofangrytown

I took G, Richards and Forsberg...

05/06 - 48.1%
06/07 - 45.4%
07/08 - 47.7%
08/09 - 48.3%
09/10 - 52.4%
10/11 - 54.7%
Lifetime as a Flyer - 49.1%

Definitely better the last 2 seasons, but fairly substandard his first 3, with a big drop in his 2nd year.
- jmatchett383

49.1% isnt a winner.........

Giroux is better than Briere at every aspect of the game. again love Danny B...BUT. Giroux is currently top 3 best in the league. No question. Briere never could hold that title.
- GOA88

He finished 14th last season. No question.

Also his shooting percentage is god awful.....just take a look at how many shots it took for him to get his goals.... just saying
- GOA88

And have you compared that to most of the top goal scorers in the League? How about to his teammates when he was here. If you did, you'd find that Mike richards missed the net a higher percentage of the time then Jeff Carter did.

His shooting percentage was of the charts in the 46 goal Season. Everything was going in. It's not reasonable to expect that to continue. He's a 35 goal scorer realistically.
I think the expectations are the issue. I think he was expected to be more dominant then he was capable of being. He wasn't capable of being that dominant player that he showed at times. He was the player that he was. I don't think there was ever any issue of gving his all. So I don't agree with your take. He had plenty of heart here. He wasn't capable of being a top 5-10 talent then, and he's not now. Those expectations are out of whack.
- MJL

So in 2 of his past 5 seasons he has been one of the most dominant goal scorers in the league... but he doesnt have the ability to be that dominant? He does. He has shown it. That is what is so damn frustrating about him.

You think he consistently shows the same amount of heart as a guy like Richards? Its not even close.

always love other people replying to posts stated they are inaccurate when it's your opinion.

Flyers playing on the Island on October 26th...
road trip anyone?

It was more like... "I cant believe you are replacing me with HIM on this line" The laugh was what pissed me off. He literally laughed. Gasp of disbelief/laugh =scoff to me.
- jak521

I guess I'm defensive because I've been in that position where you disagree with a coach. I'm sure Carter felt he was giving a fine effort. He felt the benching was unwarranted.

Being in that position, I can tell you that Carter's reaction had more to do with the coach than the player. He wasn't putting Nodl down, but laughing at the idea that benching him will give him the kick in the butt that he needs.

And have you compared that to most of the top goal scorers in the League? How about to his teammates when he was here. If you did, you'd find that Mike richards missed the net a higher percentage of the time then Jeff Carter did.
- MJL

Mike Richards isnt a goal scorer per say.... Mike is a two-way forward with heart and one of the best penalty killers the flyers have ever had.

And have you compared that to most of the top goal scorers in the League? How about to his teammates when he was here. If you did, you'd find that Mike richards missed the net a higher percentage of the time then Jeff Carter did.
- MJL

The shooting percentage bit is/never was valid.

The fondest memory of that sort that I have of Carter was in a game against the Sens... I was sitting directly next to the Flyers bench. Carter got pulled off the ice during a stoppage in play... ONLY Carter... and Nodl was sent out in his place. He literally looks at who was coming on and scoffs, rolls his eyes shaking his head and got on the bench.

That poop pissed me off then, and still does today. I know MJL, I cant read faces...
- jak521

If you want to discuss that again, we can. It's silly, but whatever! I'm glad you can know what a player is reacting to, and why.

I took G, Richards and Forsberg...
- PhillySportsGuy

But, but... Dude? Forsberg never had his best year here. How do you justify that?

i understand you're trying to fight the good fight here, but we've all seen injured players elevate their game in the playoffs.
- Don'tForgetTocchet

We sure have. And we've also seen players who have been hampered by injuries. And a lot depends on what the injury is. When you have a two broken feet, haven't skated in a month, and try and come back and play, when your skating is clearly hampered. That's hard to voercome.

I guess I'm defensive because I've been in that position where you disagree with a coach. I'm sure Carter felt he was giving a fine effort. He felt the benching was unwarranted.

Being in that position, I can tell you that Carter's reaction had more to do with the coach than the player. He wasn't putting Nodl down, but laughing at the idea that benching him will give him the kick in the butt that he needs.
- PhillySportsGuy

I wish I could believe that train of thought.. seriously. But, being 25 feet from him when it happened.. i just cant. It wreaked of selfishness. Now, do I think that he and Nodl didnt get along? Not at all. They were actually pretty good buds on the team... going to the bar together occasionally and what not.. Hell I got a picture with the two of them together (about an hour before they were all traded), but that day he put himself above his team and teammate. I dont doubt it for a second. Theres a real reason it resonates with me even to today.

And have you compared that to most of the top goal scorers in the League? How about to his teammates when he was here. If you did, you'd find that Mike richards missed the net a higher percentage of the time then Jeff Carter did.
- MJL

12.2
6.5
11.2
13.5
10.3
10.7

That is Carters shooting percentage as a flyer from 05' to 11" Thats not off the charts by any stretch of the imagination.

So being disappointed about being taken out of the game is a bad thing? I hated being taken out of a game. I would roll my eyes at things coaches did. Is there anyone here who would rather have Nodl on the ice than Carter? It didn't mean he hated Nodl or blamed him or wouldn't cheer for him.
- PhillySportsGuy

The point really is that nobody can exactly know what a players reaction is for. maybe he was unhappy about his own shift, and that was the reason for his body actions. To think that anyone can know what a player is reacting to from the stands by his mannerisms is flat out rediculous.

And have you compared that to most of the top goal scorers in the League? How about to his teammates when he was here. If you did, you'd find that Mike richards missed the net a higher percentage of the time then Jeff Carter did.
- MJL

Carter:
05/06 - 23G/189S
06/07 - 14G/215S
07/08 - 29G/260S
08/09 - 46G/342S
09/10 - 33G/319S
10/11 - 36G/335S
Career Philly shooting % - 9.8%

Richards
05/06 - 11/168S
06/07 - 10G/130S
07/08 - 28G/212S
08/09 - 30G/238S
09/10 - 31G/237S
10/11 - 23G/184S
Career Philly shooting % - 10.2%

If you want to discuss that again, we can. It's silly, but whatever! I'm glad you can know what a player is reacting to, and why.
- MJL

It is a super human ability I have. Ya know, reading obvious body language. I was actually on Stan Lee's Super Humans TV show. Episode 11, I read the body language of Jeff Carter, my Mother, and a beautiful monarch butterfly.

We sure have. And we've also seen players who have been hampered by injuries. And a lot depends on what the injury is. When you have a two broken feet, haven't skated in a month, and try and come back and play, when your skating is clearly hampered. That's hard to voercome.
- MJL

he had several years like that, he didn't have two broken feet every year

flyers fans are almost always going to prefer the bergeron type over the carter type

i know i do