Only 3 of Franson, Phaneuf, Rielly and Gardiner will be on this team long term.

no point having 4 offensive Dmen (and yes, Phaneuf is also the top defensive dman, but he's the #1PP guy).

If they do sign Franson, then extend Phaneuf, they are likely trading either Franon or Gardiner the moment Rielly makes the NHL permanently (in a year or 2)
- Big_Lightnin

Me thinks Franson will ultimately be traded......... maybe sooner rather than later. All depends if the right deal comes along for Monsieur Nonis

I don't know why people don't understand this.
- burn

that said, given the way they talk about him now (management and Hughues) I would think they will expect him to force a spot in camp next year.

AHL time probably good for him, but depends where his game is.

I think Nonis will go forward without #3 as his anchor.



- robin_steele264

All depends on what #3 wants for a new contract.

well, If Rielly isn't in top 4, he shouldn't be on the team. Ever.

much better playing 30 mins a night in AHL in 2014 than 10-12 mins with Leafs.
- Big_Lightnin

Meh well see.... If he plays sheltered mins, especially defensive and huge pp mins wouldn't be a bad thing

Me thinks Franson will ultimately be traded......... maybe sooner rather than later. All depends if the right deal comes along for Monsieur Nonis
- faceto27

certainly possible.

End of the day, he's not a top pairing dman and likely never will be. Dion is.

Only 3 of Franson, Phaneuf, Rielly and Gardiner will be on this team long term.

no point having 4 offensive Dmen (and yes, Phaneuf is also the top defensive dman, but he's the #1PP guy).

If they do sign Franson, then extend Phaneuf, they are likely trading either Franon or Gardiner the moment Rielly makes the NHL permanently (in a year or 2)
- Big_Lightnin

They're not all the same type of offensive d-men. Gardiner and Reilly are similar, and Phaneuf and Franson are similar. There's this myth in the NHL of one type of offensive d-man who needs to be paired with a stay at home. Thing is the most successful pairing are offensive by nature:

Stevens/Neidermayer
Pronger/Neidermayer
Weber/Suter
Keith/Seabrook

Basically in each instance a smooth skater (PMD) paired with a big physical d-man who can lay the body but also can make a breakout pass and shoot like a mother (frank)er.

Now that the Leafs’ last arbitration case was settled, they have an opportunity (should they choose to take it) to create cap room by way of a regular, non-compliance buyout.

That window starts the morning of Aug. 2 and will expire on the morning of Aug .4. In that time, they could very well decide to buy out the remainder of Liles’ contract should they not be able to find a taker for his services.

All depends on what #3 wants for a new contract.
- faceto27

trade Dion, sign Hainsey for 4 years?

Gunnar-Hainsey
Gardiner-Franson
Ranger-Fraser
Blacker/Liles

I don't know why people don't understand this.
- burn

Because, i'm stubborn

Now that the Leafs’ last arbitration case was settled, they have an opportunity (should they choose to take it) to create cap room by way of a regular, non-compliance buyout.

That window starts the morning of Aug. 2 and will expire on the morning of Aug .4. In that time, they could very well decide to buy out the remainder of Liles’ contract should they not be able to find a taker for his services.
- faceto27

Don't think so. Leafs never actually went to arbitration. The Arbitratoin buyout period is for teams that had at least 2 arbitration awards to accept.

Leafs had zero arbitration awards to accept.

I don't believe they get this buyout period.

trade Dion, sign Hainsey for 4 years?

Gunnar-Hainsey
Gardiner-Franson
Ranger-Fraser
Blacker/Liles
- Big_Lightnin

Hainsey hasn't been a top pairing d-men ....was going to say years, but the correct answer is he's never been a good one.

At a cap hit of $3,875,000 for the next three seasons, the Leafs have a plethora of defencemen ready to play, as well others in the system. While a traditional buyout may be a route that teams will try to avoid, the Leafs could be left with no choice.

The Leafs could try to trade Liles while retaining part of his salary, but they have to try and find a willing partner and a lot of teams are squeezed for cap space, just like the Leafs are.

If Toronto can’t pull off another move, they only have until Aug. 4 to pull the trigger on a traditional buyout.

They would pay Liles two-thirds of his remaining balance owed and his cap hit to the team would be $1,291,666.67 annually for six years. This would, however, give the Leafs an additional $2,583,333.33 in cap space for this season, which would give them just under $7.2 million to work with.

Don't think so. Leafs never actually went to arbitration. The Arbitratoin buyout period is for teams that had at least 2 arbitration awards to accept.

Leafs had zero arbitration awards to accept.

I don't believe they get this buyout period.
- Big_Lightnin

They do....... you don't need to actually go to arbitration to get the period.

They do....... you don't need to actually go to arbitration to get the period.
- faceto27

You are correct, it was addressed a few pages back.

All depends on what #3 wants for a new contract.
- faceto27

I don't thunk hes interested in a pay cut.

They're not all the same type of offensive d-men. Gardiner and Reilly are similar, and Phaneuf and Franson are similar. There's this myth in the NHL of one type of offensive d-man who needs to be paired with a stay at home. Thing is the most successful pairing are offensive by nature:

Stevens/Neidermayer
Pronger/Neidermayer
Weber/Suter
Keith/Seabrook

Basically in each instance a smooth skater (PMD) paired with a big physical d-man who can lay the body but also can make a breakout pass and shoot like a mother (frank)er.
- mykokes

I wasn't saying they all need to be paired with a stay at home, but if all 4 of those guys are in the top 4, there's going to be a lot of minuses on the team, and the PK will suck.

Need at least 1 stay at home in the top 4. or 2 Hybrid's. Dion's a hybrid. Franson and Gardiner are offense only. Rielly, we'll see, but let's assume he's offense only to start. D-game isn't there yet.

with every example you listed above - look at the teams 2nd pairing. Usually at least 1 pure stay at home D at #4.

I don't thunk hes interested in a pay cut.
- robin_steele264

he makes $5.5M this year. $6M long term is a raise

At a cap hit of $3,875,000 for the next three seasons, the Leafs have a plethora of defencemen ready to play, as well others in the system. While a traditional buyout may be a route that teams will try to avoid, the Leafs could be left with no choice.

The Leafs could try to trade Liles while retaining part of his salary, but they have to try and find a willing partner and a lot of teams are squeezed for cap space, just like the Leafs are.

If Toronto can’t pull off another move, they only have until Aug. 4 to pull the trigger on a traditional buyout.

They would pay Liles two-thirds of his remaining balance owed and his cap hit to the team would be $1,291,666.67 annually for six years. This would, however, give the Leafs an additional $2,583,333.33 in cap space for this season, which would give them just under $7.2 million to work with.
- faceto27

Not quite true ....and have we figured out if the Leafs can use a buyout given that they didn't actually go through with the arbitration?

he makes $5.5M this year. $6M long term is a raise
- Big_Lightnin

You might be able to convince him of this, but unfortunately he's got an agent.


A mean agent.

I don't thunk hes interested in a pay cut.
- robin_steele264

If he wants anything more than what he is already making, then this will be his last year wearing the proud and cherished maple leaf.

They do....... you don't need to actually go to arbitration to get the period.
- faceto27

gotta source?

everything I've seen says it is for teams that actually go to arbitration.

Not quite true ....and have we figured out if the Leafs can use a buyout given that they didn't actually go through with the arbitration?
- The Law

They can........ and unless Liles is traded. They will

They do....... you don't need to actually go to arbitration to get the period.
- faceto27

ah ha ...

and the buyout according to cap geek is ..

$875,000
$875,000
$2,375,000
$1,250,000
$1,250,000
$1,250,000

So an extra 3 million to get Franson and Kadri done this year. Year three is a little fugly though.

Lets hope they can make a trade.

At a cap hit of $3,875,000 for the next three seasons, the Leafs have a plethora of defencemen ready to play, as well others in the system. While a traditional buyout may be a route that teams will try to avoid, the Leafs could be left with no choice.

The Leafs could try to trade Liles while retaining part of his salary, but they have to try and find a willing partner and a lot of teams are squeezed for cap space, just like the Leafs are.

If Toronto can’t pull off another move, they only have until Aug. 4 to pull the trigger on a traditional buyout.

They would pay Liles two-thirds of his remaining balance owed and his cap hit to the team would be $1,291,666.67 annually for six years. This would, however, give the Leafs an additional $2,583,333.33 in cap space for this season, which would give them just under $7.2 million to work with.
- faceto27

nope.

it's just under 900k the first 2 years, then $2.3 M the 2nd or something.

not same hit every year.

gotta source?

everything I've seen says it is for teams that actually go to arbitration.
- Big_Lightnin

Was discussed in detail a few pages back with references. Bill Daly has confirmed this to be true. The Toronto media has also reported it to be true.

So, it must be true.