I think there are 5 teams that are better than the Canucks in the west, and another 4 that could easily finish ahead of them in the standings, but I guess we'll see once the puck drops.

Better:
Chicago
LA
San Jose
Anaheim
St Louis

Equal(ish):
Edmonton
Minnesota
Phoenix
Colorado
- 1970vintage

I dont see how anaheim is better.
And until proven i think its a big stretch that any of edm, col or phoenix finished ahead of vancouver

Seems like Marwood's been banned for a day for out-trolling one of our regular trolls (Buflygien Ate Me).

Free Marwood!

Not with Bruce behind the bench.

He'll do exactly what he did in Washington - Great reg seasons followed by 1-2 round exits.

Hmmm that sounds so familiar...
- Mattjd123

I Still think they'll finish ahead of the Canucks in the Standings, and I doubt Vancouver would take a 7 game series against them. It doesn't matter what Anaheim does against the rest of the league, only against the Canucks.

BTW

NYR 1999–2000* Missed Playoffs (interim coach)
TB 2000–01* Missed Playoffs
TB 2001–02 Missed Playoffs
TB 2002–03 Lost in Second Round (NJ)
TB 2003–04 Won Stanley Cup (CGY)
TB 2005–06 Lost in First Round (OTT)
TB 2006–07 Lost in First Round (NJ)
TB 2007–08 Missed Playoffs (fired)
NYR 2008–09* Lost in First Round (WSH)
NYR 2009–10 Missed Playoffs
NYR 2010–11 Lost in First Round (WSH)
NYR 2011–12 Lost in Conference Finals (NJD)
NYR 2012–13 Lost in Second Round (BOS) (fired)

Nyr
- hugefemale dog77

Pretty sure it's a fake account...

I dont see how anaheim is better.
And until proven i think its a big stretch that any of edm, col or phoenix finished ahead of vancouver
- hugefemale dog77

Anaheim was better last year, I expect they will be better again, especially now that Vancouver will face the new Pacific Division foes more often. I said that Col, Edm and Phoenix were comparable, could go either way. Edmonton is another year older, they addressed some of their specific needs, Colorado should be healthier this year and Tippet will have Phoenix back to their trapping ways. Vancouver has addressed a huge problem, their coaching, but all they have done player wise is to shed salary to get under the cap. I don't think they'll suck, I just don't think they are as good as their regular season record indicated last year or the year before.

Pretty sure it's a fake account...
- Fosco

Steamer8
Vancouver Canucks
Joined: 07.26.2013

Edit, man I'm getting hungry, how long is this ban for anyway?

Your posting privileges have been revoked until July 26, 2013 @ 10:52 PM.

I don't think I'll make it

LA
SJ
Van

Chi
St.loo
Minny

Wildcard race
Anaheim
Dallas
Edm
Col
Nashville

I Still think they'll finish ahead of the Canucks in the Standings, and I doubt Vancouver would take a 7 game series against them. It doesn't matter what Anaheim does against the rest of the league, only against the Canucks.

BTW

NYR 1999–2000* Missed Playoffs (interim coach)
TB 2000–01* Missed Playoffs
TB 2001–02 Missed Playoffs
TB 2002–03 Lost in Second Round (NJ)
TB 2003–04 Won Stanley Cup (CGY)
TB 2005–06 Lost in First Round (OTT)
TB 2006–07 Lost in First Round (NJ)
TB 2007–08 Missed Playoffs (fired)
NYR 2008–09* Lost in First Round (WSH)
NYR 2009–10 Missed Playoffs
NYR 2010–11 Lost in First Round (WSH)
NYR 2011–12 Lost in Conference Finals (NJD)
NYR 2012–13 Lost in Second Round (BOS) (fired)
- 1970vintage

This doesn't mean shyt. Different players respond to different coaches Canucks culd easily flourish under Torts. I honestly could care less who it was the Canucks hired, just as long as AV is gone.

And lets face it The rangers don't exactly have a lot of "Character" guys. A bunch of underachieving bums.

The Canucks are a much more well rounded club that Torts should be able to utilize for the better

And if he fails, We'll still be entertained post game regardless.

If they trade franson it will be one of the biggest blunders of the post lockout era. I think he has a chance to be a premier top pairing d guy. Kadri also has some real skill. What nonis is doing is shocking right now. I just dont get what is happening and why. Kadri and Franson should have been the priority. I like the clarkson signing dont get me wrong (problem with the term) but signing bozak i thought was stupid and if they lose franson just wow.

They need to off load Liles ASAP or Phaneuf.
- Bluechip23

Yah, I don't get the whole "build from within" thing that have been talking about for years.

They finally start to develop their own guys and they want to push them to the back burner for guys who have done nothing for the team.

Kadri and Franson have already jumped through a lifetime of hoops for TO. I can't imagine they both don't run out of there the first chance they get and play their prime years elsewhere.

Steamer8
Vancouver Canucks
Joined: 07.26.2013

Edit, man I'm getting hungry, how long is this ban for anyway?

Your posting privileges have been revoked until July 26, 2013 @ 10:52 PM.

I don't think I'll make it
- 1970vintage

But why??

Yah, I don't get the whole "build from within" thing that have been talking about for years.

They finally start to develop their own guys and they want to push them to the back burner for guys who have done nothing for the team.

Kadri and Franson have already jumped through a lifetime of hoops for TO. I can't imagine they both don't run out of there the first chance they get and play their prime years elsewhere.
- IanEsplen

Franson was drafted by and played a 100+ games for the Preds.

The Leafs finally make the playoffs and so far this off-season they have managed to overpay for Clarkson and ignored two of their top 5 guys form last season.

This puzles me.

Shouldn't No. 1 priority been to lock up Franson and Kadri before tossing big money at Clarkson?

That's how I would have played it at least.


Thoughts?
- IanEsplen

Clarkson is a good addition for them. He's the type of forward they need. He's just not the type of forward anyone needs for the money they gave him. He'll probably play pretty well for the Leafs for years, but be cursed for making too much money the entire time.

If they trade franson it will be one of the biggest blunders of the post lockout era. I think he has a chance to be a premier top pairing d guy. Kadri also has some real skill. What nonis is doing is shocking right now. I just dont get what is happening and why. Kadri and Franson should have been the priority. I like the clarkson signing dont get me wrong (problem with the term) but signing bozak i thought was stupid and if they lose franson just wow.

They need to off load Liles ASAP or Phaneuf.
- Bluechip23

Nobody's taking Liles. The Canucks had a better chance of trading Ballard.

Steamer8
Vancouver Canucks
Joined: 07.26.2013

Edit, man I'm getting hungry, how long is this ban for anyway?

Your posting privileges have been revoked until July 26, 2013 @ 10:52 PM.

I don't think I'll make it
- 1970vintage

Yeah, I caved and had a burger for lunch.

I'll show my support in other ways....

#freetheCumberlandCrusader

Edler has his faults—mainly consistency.

It's funny, though, since Franson and Edler play nearly identical styles, and have nearly identical pros and cons.

I've even seen Franson's style described as a "right handed Edler" by more than a few fans.

But Franson has elite potential and Edler will never be a top pairing D, according to you...
- Fosco

I love Franson, but Edler's significantly better. Franson's potential is also quite high, but Edler's is even higher. Franson would sure look good as the right shooting D-man on Vancouver's PP though...

Franson was drafted by and played a 100+ games for the Preds.
- Marshalle

Yes, but at the same time he was also a young player the Leafs should have been looking to develop more and build around. This is the second off season in a row they have jerked him around.

50 PTS in 102 games and 12PTS in 19 playoff games, that's a guy that I'm nice to and want locked up long-term.

I love Franson, but Edler's significantly better. Franson's potential is also quite high, but Edler's is even higher. Franson would sure look good as the right shooting D-man on Vancouver's PP though...
- KB3Point0

I personally think edler has reached his ceiling. He's stated that he will never be 100% and he doesn't seem like hes playing with the urgency he did 2-3 yrs ago

Franson on the other hand still has room to grow.

I think there are 5 teams that are better than the Canucks in the west, and another 4 that could easily finish ahead of them in the standings, but I guess we'll see once the puck drops.

Better:
Chicago
LA
San Jose
Anaheim
St Louis

Equal(ish):
Edmonton
Minnesota
Phoenix
Colorado
- 1970vintage

Yeah, I disagree with this entirely. I don't think you're giving enough credit to the Canucks at all. IMO they are much better than EDM, MIN, PHX, COL. Minny was the only one to even make the playoffs last year and they were tied with Columbus.

I also think they're better than Anaheim. To me Anaheim is by themselves in the tier between the top and bottom. I think Vancouver, STL, LA, CHI, and SJ are the class of the conference.

Chicago's going to be very good again next year, but can you really expect similar output from Bickell, Crawford, Saad, Shaw? Also need Hossa, Sharp, etc. to stay healthy.

LA hit the perfect storm in 2012, bon't forget they made the playoffs in game #81 and missed zero games by D-men in the playoffs (first time it's happened in how long?). Very good team, but they're built to win 2-1, which also makes them vulnerable. They have some young kids that they will rely on (sound familiar Canucks fans?).

St. Louis is a team every analyst loves. They're big, deep, and seemingly built for playoff hockey, except they don't have the top end scoring talent that the rest do. Also, are you getting the Halak & Elliott from 2012 or the Halak & Elliott from 2013?

San Jose has lots of top end forward talent. They continue to prove that there is no such thing as a "window" for good teams. They've failed worse than the Canucks in terms of capitalizing on how good they've been for the past decade. Their D is far from ideal. Can Niemi maintain the pace he set last season?

Anaheim just doesn't have the depth or youth to equal any of these teams over the course of an 82 game season. They have enough streaky talent that they could potentially win a series in the playoffs, but they rely too much on aging vets to go far. Their D isn't great and there are lots of question marks surrounding their goalies.

Vancouver's coaching change will likely be a huge lift, but could also go the other way. Huge question mark there. Can Kassian play with the Sedins? In limited time there last season he showed he could, but will he be able to put his game together more consistently this year? Will Kesler and Booth stay healthy? If they do then Vancouver should be able to address the issues of secondary scoring that plagued them last season. Will someone internally be able to take over the 3rd line center position? If they can then Vancouver will be a threat in the West, if they can't the Canucks will be lucky to win 1 playoff round.


Minnesota: fringe playoff team
Phoenix: lucky to be a fringe playoff team
Edmonton: still sucks
Colorado: really sucks

I personally think edler has reached his ceiling. He's stated that he will never be 100% and he doesn't seem like hes playing with the urgency he did 2-3 yrs ago

Franson on the other hand still has room to grow.
- vancity787

Edler's ceiling is way higher than he's playing at now. He might not get any better than he's played to date, but his ceiling is much higher. He certainly has the tools to be a better, more consistent, player.

I love Franson, but Edler's significantly better. Franson's potential is also quite high, but Edler's is even higher. Franson would sure look good as the right shooting D-man on Vancouver's PP though...
- KB3Point0

I'm a fan of Franson, but don't think he's currently as good, or has as much upside.

My comment was directed at chipper, who believes Franson has elite upside, yet a day ago claimed Edler would never be a top pairing D, and currently wouldn't play on Toronto's, or most of the league's top pairing.

Id split up the teams in tiers and I think the Nucks are in tier 2. Its a new season though and what happened last year doesnt matter. Everyone is 0 - 0 - 0 at the start of season.

Tier 1
Chi
Bos
LA
Pitt

Tier 2
STL
SJ
NYR
Van

Tier 3
Tor
Philly
Minny
Wash
Ana
- Bluechip23

Sorry, I couldn't get passed Pittsburgh in Tier 1 with CHI, BOS, LA!

This doesn't mean shyt. Different players respond to different coaches Canucks culd easily flourish under Torts. I honestly could care less who it was the Canucks hired, just as long as AV is gone.

And lets face it The rangers don't exactly have a lot of "Character" guys. A bunch of underachieving bums.

The Canucks are a much more well rounded club that Torts should be able to utilize for the better

And if he fails, We'll still be entertained post game regardless.
- vancity787

Yeah, my point was only that just because Boudreau lost in the first round with Washington after having great regular season success doesn't mean the same thing will happen in Anaheim. Because if the only measure of what a coach can do is what he has already done, Tortarella isn't much better.

LA
SJ
Van

Chi
St.loo
Minny

Wildcard race
Anaheim
Dallas
Edm
Col
Nashville
- hugefemale dog77

Anaheim still makes the playoffs in my opinion. I think the wildcard will come down to Edmonton, Dallas, and Phoenix

I'm a fan of Franson, but don't think he's currently as good, or has as much upside.

My comment was directed at chipper, who believes Franson has elite upside, yet a day ago claimed Edler would never be a top pairing D, and currently wouldn't play on Toronto's, or most of the league's top pairing.
- Fosco

Sorry, I wasn't disagreeing with you at all. I totally agree. Edler is better and has a much higher upside.

When you watch certain players for long enough you can get tunnel vision. That's how a lot of people see Edler. The mistakes he makes stick out and that's all they remember. I expect an all star year from him this year.

Sorry, I wasn't disagreeing with you at all. I totally agree. Edler is better and has a much higher upside.

When you watch certain players for long enough you can get tunnel vision. That's how a lot of people see Edler. The mistakes he makes stick out and that's all they remember. I expect an all star year from him this year.
- KB3Point0

Agreed 100%.

I've tried to explain this phenomena less effectively many times.

For all the heat Edler get's about turnovers, he's 2nd on the Canucks D in giveaway/takeaway ratio to only Tanev, who played sheltered minutes against inferior competition.

EDIT: and I knew you were agreeing. Just wanted to specify that I wasn't insulting Franson either.