It's not the issue of who the gem in the deal is, it's just a question of why the Leafs would do it.
Like Phaneuf or not, he's better than Bieksa.
Franson is better than Tavev.

Why do the Leafs make the trade?
- MrBen

Ive never hated on phaneuf. Most of the fans here do. I think he serves a purpose. He is not that good defensively but offensively he is very good. I think Fransen will be elite.

Gonna be like being forced to go back to an incredibly bad relationship
- Sheppy99

maybe, but at least the girl he's getting back with is hot.

It's not the issue of who the gem in the deal is, it's just a question of why the Leafs would do it.
Like Phaneuf or not, he's better than Bieksa.
Franson is better than Tavev.

Why do the Leafs make the trade?
- MrBen

30 NHL coaches would disagree with you.

No, no...pretty sure that was VANTEL's offer.

You don't like it?
- IanEsplen

I like it for the Canucks. It's a bad trade for the Leafs though.

30 NHL coaches would disagree with you.
- Scooby_Doo

Who are these 30 NHL coaches? All I know is phaneuf was invited to the team canada camp 4 years ago. So the coaches who were picking team canada disagree with you.

I seriously don't get how or why everyone thinks Cooter is so damn valuable. I mean if Flyers fans can demand the moon in return for him I should be able to do the same with Larsson. Both where pegged to go #1 at some point, both haven't dazzled anyone point wise, both fell in the draft and both contribute to their teams more then fans of other teams realise. What do you guys think? am I making any sense or have I missed the bigger picture here somewhere along the way ? lol
- blizzzard

Couturier, although he had a down year last year, has incredible hockey sense away from the puck for a 19-year-old. As an 18-year-old rookie, he held Evgeni Malkin to one goal in 6 playoff games (in head-to-head competition). He's touted as a future Selke candidate.

Larsson has been a healthy scratch several times, and his SEL production hasn't translated (yet) to NHL numbers.

Both are good players, but Couturier has accomplished a bit more when comparing their brief NHL careers.

It's not the issue of who the gem in the deal is, it's just a question of why the Leafs would do it.
Like Phaneuf or not, he's better than Bieksa.
Franson is better than Tavev.

Why do the Leafs make the trade?
- MrBen

likely 10 million + for Dion and Cody

Likely 6 million for Kev and Chris

and honestly, I would take Bieksa over Phaneuf even if the salaries were the same.

30 NHL coaches would disagree with you.
- Scooby_Doo

Phaneuf finished 11th in Norris Trophy Voting. Bieksa didn't make top 25.

30 NHL coaches would disagree with you.
- Scooby_Doo

I would prefer Bieksa, but Phaneuf should have more trade value. Bieksa's 32, Dion's 28. Dion provides more offense and an absolute cannon from the point, which is harder to find than a player who provides what Bieksa does.

maybe, but at least the girl he's getting back with is hot.
- IanEsplen

really? I think she's kind of old fat and outta shape and past her prime

I would prefer Bieksa, but Phaneuf should have more trade value. Bieksa's 32, Dion's 28. Dion provides more offense and an absolute cannon from the point, which is harder to find than a player who provides what Bieksa does.
- KB3Point0

Well said.

Who are these 30 NHL coaches? All I know is phaneuf was invited to the team canada camp 4 years ago. So the coaches who were picking team canada disagree with you.
- Bluechip23

How is 4 years ago evidence of anything? Phanuef was a great player his first 3 years in the leagues. Doesn't make him a great player today.

Phaneuf finished 11th in Norris Trophy Voting. Bieksa didn't make top 25.
- MrBen

LOL. I wonder if Toronto media had anything to do with that.

Ever notice how the Score Golf Rankings always list Ontario courses as the best in the country?

Phaneuf would be 5/6 d man on the Canucks, and 3/4 on most teams. Just happens he plays on a sh1tty team with sh1tty defensemen.

Phaneuf finished 11th in Norris Trophy Voting. Bieksa didn't make top 25.
- MrBen

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/tea...588&hubname=nhl-canadiens

Members of the Professional Hockey Writers' Association submitted ballots for the Norris Trophy at the conclusion of the regular season. The winner will be announced during the 2013 Stanley Cup Final.

Coaches have nothing to do with it.

Phaneuf finished 11th in Norris Trophy Voting. Bieksa didn't make top 25.
- MrBen

so...you're basing your opinions on who a better D-man is because he got votes from members of and organization that is largely based in and a round the city he plays in.

ooooookay.

There's no way in hell we'd trade Pacioretty for Edler.

30 NHL coaches would disagree with you.
- Scooby_Doo

Phaneuf is top 10 in minutes played in the league every year, has never had a good defensive partner (top pairing guy), never played in front of an elite goalie, the forwards in front of him have been very meh until recently and youre saying that Bieksa is without a doubt better than him?

As much as I hate the Leafs, I would love to have Phaneuf on my team. Give the guy a good d-man to play with, elite goalie and a good group of forwards (Vancouvers roster) and he will be great again.

really? I think she's kind of old fat and outta shape and past her prime
- Sheppy99

yah, but she still has all the moves and knows how to get the job done


we're still talking hockey right?

Phaneuf is top 10 in minutes played in the league every year, has never had a good defensive partner (top pairing guy), never played in front of an elite goalie, the forwards in front of him have been very meh until recently and youre saying that Bieksa is without a doubt better than him?

As much as I hate the Leafs, I would love to have Phaneuf on my team. Give the guy a good d-man to play with, elite goalie and a good group of forwards (Vancouvers roster) and he will be great again.
- Jaciems

He had Komisarek, whom Markov thrived with.
He had Beauchemin, whom Niedermayer thrived with.

Phaneuf is a disaster in his own end. He was on for every Bruins goal in game 7. He's dumb as a rock, and has ZERO hockey sense. I wouldn't want him on my team EVER.

LOL. I wonder if Toronto media had anything to do with that.

Ever notice how the Score Golf Rankings always list Ontario courses as the best in the country?

Phaneuf would be 5/6 d man on the Canucks, and 3/4 on most teams. Just happens he plays on a sh1tty team with sh1tty defensemen.
- Scooby_Doo

Someone explain this to me. Why as canucks fans can we not see the stats for what they are. leafs let in 25 more goals than the nucks over an 82 game season (13 goals over 48 games). Thats not a big difference. We all agree that Schnieds and Lu are much better than Reimer and Scrivens so the difference in the goals could be attributed to the Goalies. If its to the D being so strong then the goalies are equal. We cant have it both ways.

Well I see our daily dose of Vancouver vs Toronto is off to a bright and early start.

Couturier, although he had a down year last year, has incredible hockey sense away from the puck for a 19-year-old. As an 18-year-old rookie, he held Evgeni Malkin to one goal in 6 playoff games (in head-to-head competition). He's touted as a future Selke candidate.

Larsson has been a healthy scratch several times, and his SEL production hasn't translated (yet) to NHL numbers.

Both are good players, but Couturier has accomplished a bit more when comparing their brief NHL careers.
- jmatchett383

That's PDB though. Honestly he didn't deserve to be scratched he just got the shaft being the young kid making the least amount of dough. Salvador was scratched once last year A-train and Tallinder where hardly scratched and our 2 best defensemen all season where Green and Larsson. Pete just doesn't have the heart to scratch the old guys even though they where brutal. On top of that Larsson hasn't been given any PP time. Larsson also has a very high hockey I.Q and has smooth passes and he doesn't shoot the hardest but he makes smart shots that seem to get through. I just think people look at is stats and see he has been scratched and don't think much of him its been a total loyalty/ seniority thing since he has gotten here.

Couturier, although he had a down year last year, has incredible hockey sense away from the puck for a 19-year-old. As an 18-year-old rookie, he held Evgeni Malkin to one goal in 6 playoff games (in head-to-head competition). He's touted as a future Selke candidate.

Larsson has been a healthy scratch several times, and his SEL production hasn't translated (yet) to NHL numbers.

Both are good players, but Couturier has accomplished a bit more when comparing their brief NHL careers.
- jmatchett383

That's PDB though. Honestly he didn't deserve to be scratched he just got the shaft being the young kid making the least amount of dough. Salvador was scratched once last year A-train and Tallinder where hardly scratched and our 2 best defensemen all season where Green and Larsson. Pete just doesn't have the heart to scratch the old guys even though they where brutal. On top of that Larsson hasn't been given any PP time. Larsson also has a very high hockey I.Q and has smooth passes and he doesn't shoot the hardest but he makes smart shots that seem to get through. I just think people look at is stats and see he has been scratched and don't think much of him its been a total loyalty/ seniority thing since he has gotten here.

There's no way in hell we'd trade Pacioretty for Edler.
- Scabeh

Why not?

MTL has two NHL D-men signed past next season and that is assuming Subban re-signs. Why wouldn't they have an interest in Edler?

Feel free to counter

Wait, are people on here really arguing that Bieksa is better than Phaneuf? Or are you just saying, for the asking price/cap hit you'd rather have Bieksa?