if pietrangelo is already on the cusp of being a norris candidate, any offer sheet to him isnt artificially raising his value. its paying him what he is worth, whether RFA or UFA. as has been mentioned, im sure STL will match, but theres no harm in trying.
- flyershockey

Karlsson is only making $6.5M. How is paying Pietrangelo $8M not overpaying?

I want my team to be in the mix for the Cup, I don't care who they pay, what they pay, how they pay or how they get their assets. I only care that every year they put the best team possible on the ice and use every legal avenue available to do so. If down the road that causes repercussions that harm your team then whatever team/gm you are talking about hasn't planned properly.
- Marshalle

You just don't understand. Given the Flyers' salary cap situation I'm not surprised.

Do you know exactly what he is seeking?
- AlexF

Well his QO would have been around a million. Since he passed on that I'm guessing he wants more.

I honestly don't know if he is worth much more than that.

He's can't stay healthy. He's the softest D Vancouver has. He hasn't shown he is an offensive threat. And he plays sheltered minutes.

Wrong.

If you pay him what he's worth it gets quickly matched and it's a pointless exercise. In fact, if you're just paying him what he's worth then it's unlikely that he will even sign the offer sheet and he'll just get that from St. Louis, unless they're really playing hardball, in which case he'll tell them about the offer sheet and they'll just offer him about the same.

The only way you can offer sheet a player and actually get that player (this is based on every offer sheet that has been signed to date) is if you offer significantly more than what they are actually worth. So much that the team doesn't mind losing a potential superstar for 4 mid to late 1st round draft picks.

As I stated previously, the Weber offer sheet was a good one. It was far from a foregone conclusion that Nashville would match due to them owing him $28M within the first calendar year, regardless of lockout, and the 14 year length of the contract. An offer sheet to Pietrangelo however, unless it is for well over $8M for the next 7 years, is pointless and will paint a target on the offending team's RFAs in the future. That being said, I would absolutely love to see the Flyers offer sheet him. I would love it even more if they highly overpaid for him. $8.5M for the next 7 years would be a nice addition to Philly's salary cap.
- KB3Point0

What someone is actually worth is what someone is willing to pay him/her.

Leafs fans think Phaneuf is better than Bieksa?! LOL!!!
Canucks have the deepest or second deepest Defensive line up in the league. Bieksa is a big part of that. Canucks right now have at least 3 d men that are better than Phaneuf. And that's not counting Tanev or Corrado who will be better than Phaneuf by Christmas if they keep developing the way they are.
- hankthetank

Deepest or second deepest, are you serious

Well his QO would have been around a million. Since he passed on that I'm guessing he wants more.

I honestly don't know if he is worth much more than that.

He's can't stay healthy. He's the softest D Vancouver has. He hasn't shown he is an offensive threat. And he plays sheltered minutes.
- IanEsplen

I originally thought he'd get around $1.75M. After what some of the other young D-men have signed for, I have a hard time seeing him getting more than $1.25M and I wouldn't be surprised to see it closer to $1M.

Lots of money for UFAs and D-men who can score. Way less for offensively challenged RFA D-men. Teams are showing at least a little restraint when it comes to these players now.

Do you know exactly what he is seeking?
- AlexF

No, but I'm assuming 2.5-2.75 and the Canucks are at 1.5-1.75.

Well his QO would have been around a million. Since he passed on that I'm guessing he wants more.

I honestly don't know if he is worth much more than that.

He's can't stay healthy. He's the softest D Vancouver has. He hasn't shown he is an offensive threat. And he plays sheltered minutes.
- IanEsplen

By this synopsis alone we should have let him walk and re-sign Alberts.

What someone is actually worth is what someone is willing to pay him/her.
- Marshalle

Ilya Bryzgalov. Danny Briere. Vincent Lecavalier. Scott Gomez. Wade Redden. Tomas Kaberle. Mike Komisarek.

Deepest or second deepest, are you serious
- HawkfaninBC

That's what she said.

No, but I'm assuming 2.5-2.75 and the Canucks are at 1.5-1.75.
- Scooby_Doo

I highly highly doubt he's seeking that much. That's ridiculous given the Muzzin and Weircoch contracts out there, not to mention what PK Subban is currently on.

No, but I'm assuming 2.5-2.75 and the Canucks are at 1.5-1.75.
- Scooby_Doo

I bet both of those numbers are actually marginally lower. Canucks are probably looking at guys like Muzzin and Martinez in LA and thinking they shouldn't even have to pay that much ($1.1M) for Tanev.

Karlsson is only making $6.5M. How is paying Pietrangelo $8M not overpaying?
- KB3Point0

you can do that with so many contracts in the nhl. guys are signed at different times under different circumstances.

By this synopsis alone we should have let him walk and re-sign Alberts.
- AlexF

If he wants more than $1.5M they should let him sit and sign Alberts for $1M.

you can do that with so many contracts in the nhl. guys are signed at different times under different circumstances.
- flyershockey

Yup, and Karlsson signed just last summer, under much more favourable CBA conditions, a larger salary cap, after actually winning the Norris. Pretty good comparable actually. Karlsson's just better and deserves to be making more money.

If he wants more than $1.5M they should let him sit and sign Alberts for 600k.
- KB3Point0

fixed

They are screwed. Hence why I think they are shopping Phaneuf. Kadri my guess wants somewhere what Gagner got. Franson at least wants 3 - 4mil. Gunnarson who knows but leafs need to shed some cap. So much for leafs being in cap heaven and nucks dying in cap hell.
- Bluechip23

They could give kadri a bridge contract? or even say... 2.5 mill next and 4-5 the year after... cause dions ends after next season?

You just don't understand. Given the Flyers' salary cap situation I'm not surprised.
- KB3Point0

I do understand, I have no financial stake in the Flyers or any of the related companies so i don't care about it. How they ice a team that has a chance to go deep in the playoffs doesn't really matter to me as long as they compete every year. If they don't then i expect changes, if their present moves and how they affect any future moves, opportunities and expectations aren't managed properly then whomever it was that made those decisions has failed. I expect that every move the Flyers make has had both short term and long term implications fully thought out.
Expectations in Philly were very poorly managed last year and changes will be made. If they work is another story.

you can do that with so many contracts in the nhl. guys are signed at different times under different circumstances.
- flyershockey

That's true, but if the Blues were to sign him for over 6.5 per, they're paying for his potential, not past accomplishments. I don't doubt that he'll end up being a perennial Norris candidate but IMO he's not quite there yet.

Bieksa is behind Edler and Hamhuis... if he was our #1 like Phaneuf is in Toronto, he'd likely win the Norris every year.
- Scooby_Doo

He was also injured a bunch... that can't help the voting.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=428181

Oh man, this does not look good for Tanev.
- Scooby_Doo

well since Tanev had how many goals lol... he should get a 2/5th's haha That is the whole point.... How much do you pay for a defense man that is good defensively, Has a muffin of a shot and is soft?

This guy is 6'5" 205.......

I do understand, I have no financial stake in the Flyers or any of the related companies so i don't care about it. How they ice a team that has a chance to go deep in the playoffs doesn't really matter to me as long as they compete every year. If they don't then i expect changes, if their present moves and how they affect any future moves, opportunities and expectations aren't managed properly then whomever it was that made those decisions has failed. I expect that every move the Flyers make has had both short term and long term implications fully thought out.
Expectations in Philly were very poorly managed last year and changes will be made. If they work is another story.
- Marshalle

You might want to adjust these expectations then while you're at it.

I bet both of those numbers are actually marginally lower. Canucks are probably looking at guys like Muzzin and Martinez in LA and thinking they shouldn't even have to pay that much ($1.1M) for Tanev.
- KB3Point0

All depends on term. I could see him wanting 5 years 12m.

Karlsson is only making $6.5M. How is paying Pietrangelo $8M not overpaying?
- KB3Point0

Physicality?

All depends on term. I could see him wanting 5 years 12m.
- Scooby_Doo

Sure, he might want that, but it's very unrealistic. It would be a huge risk for the Canucks. Tanev has to know that too. He sees the contracts that other players in his situation are signing. As the summer has progressed I'm sure his expectations have dropped with every additional RFA D-man that has signed.