I agree. To this point, they have (seemingly) been unable to move Meszaros, which precludes them from signing Gagne. All I've talked about is, if they are unable to move Meszaros, should he be the 6th/7th defenseman. I don't buy the "he takes up more cap space so he should play" because last year, Jody Shelley was on the roster and took up more space than Matt Read, yet Read played over Shelley.
- jmatchett383

Awful example. Meszaros would be competing against Gustafsson. Read was never competing against Shelley.

You can think whatever you want. I'm not asking for Gagne to play on the top line with Giroux or be the focus on the Power Play. I expect Gagne to play the third line and fill in on special teams in case of slump or injury, the same as I expect to have Talbot on the 4th line and slide into the third line due to possible injuries to the top nine. It's a fact that Gagne is better then anything we have in our system. Bill pretty much wrote about it in his blog a matter of days ago.
- dingo8urbaby

It's not about thinking whatever I want. I'm giving you the reality of the situation. Why do you think the Flyers haven't signed Gagne yet? There is a Salary Cap in play here. It's not always about who is the better player over another. Lot's of factors involved here. If you want to ignore them, that's your choice. Like I said, the Flyers may eventually sign Gagne. They may not. But he's not the neccessity you claim it to be. That's just applying emotion to it.

Where do these assumptions come from?
- dingo8urbaby

They aren't assumptions so much as observations.

new blog

I thought a player's cap hit was split between the team putting him on waivers and the team claiming him.
- jmatchett383

No, that was never the case. What you're confused about is recall waivers. Which no longer exist.

Gervaise makes a few hundred grand difference. They can make that change there. They can send McGinn down and just go with 12 forwards for a while. There's a whole host of maneuvers that they can make. The Flyers are a Cap team, and always will be. Choices have to be made. And it's not always going to be ideal. That's the reality in a Cap environment. Like I said, lots of ways to skin a cat.
- MJL

If the goal is to ice the best possible lineup within the existing constraints, I'm not sure that retaining salary on Mez would be better than just keeping the player and going right into LTIR to start the year. There seems to be more options in that scenario, including moving Mez during the year when the market for him expands, or having it turn out that some other dman goes down and Mez ends up playing a pivotal, everyday role on the team.

They aren't assumptions so much as observations.
- johndewar

Based on what? Who said Gagne would be in the top 6 and why would he have to be?

new blog
- PhillySportsGuy

Thank Christ.

I was really hoping to see posts from Capgeek from people who can barely balance their own checkbook.

Fair enough. Would you be in favor of a 47/35 type of split between then two, barring injury?
- jmatchett383

Absolutely. As a matter of fact, if you keep both, it will give guys that would normally play through injuries the ability to take time off... cough timonen cough...

Thank Christ.

I was really hoping to see posts from Capgeek from people who can barely balance their own checkbook.
- johndewar

It's not about thinking whatever I want. I'm giving you the reality of the situation. Why do you think the Flyers haven't signed Gagne yet? There is a Salary Cap in play here. It's not always about who is the better player over another. Lot's of factors involved here. If you want to ignore them, that's your choice. Like I said, the Flyers may eventually sign Gagne. They may not. But he's not the neccessity you claim it to be. That's just applying emotion to it.
- MJL

I'm not ignoring anything. Gagne wants back in at a discount price and the Flyers would like to have him back. If they didn't why ask Gagne to wait? Why wouldn't Gagne sign elsewhere? Have you taken any of this under consideration? So what am I missing again?

If the goal is to ice the best possible lineup within the existing constraints, I'm not sure that retaining salary on Mez would be better than just keeping the player and going right into LTIR to start the year. There seems to be more options in that scenario, including moving Mez during the year when the market for him expands, or having it turn out that some other dman goes down and Mez ends up playing a pivotal, everyday role on the team.
- Tomahawk

That's definitely an option. And it could very well be the better option. But that's really my point. There's always options. Some better then others.

I'm not ignoring anything. Gagne wants back in at a discount price and the Flyers would like to have him back. If they didn't why ask Gagne to wait? Why wouldn't Gagne sign elsewhere? Have you taken any of this under consideration? So what am I missing again?
- dingo8urbaby

Who says the Flyers asked Gagne to wait? And Gagne wants to play for the Flyers. That's known. Doesn't erase the Cap issues in play. If the Flyers can't move Meszaros, how do they sign Gagne? How do they avoind placing Pronger on LTIR? It seems as though you're ignoring plenty.

I'm not ignoring anything. Gagne wants back in at a discount price and the Flyers would like to have him back. If they didn't why ask Gagne to wait? Why wouldn't Gagne sign elsewhere? Have you taken any of this under consideration? So what am I missing again?
- dingo8urbaby

... because the market is literally FULL of aging vets who are well out of their prime: Jagr, Prospal, Hejduk, Gomez, Morrow, Ponikarovsky, Lombardi, Connolly, Sullivan, Antropov, etc.

Who says the Flyers asked Gagne to wait? And Gagne wants to play for the Flyers. That's known. Doesn't erase the Cap issues in play. If the Flyers can't move Meszaros, how do they sign Gagne? How do they avoind placing Pronger on LTIR? It seems as though you're ignoring plenty.
- MJL

Why would Gagne wait without any insite of the flyers situation? Why would he wait if the flyers didn't want him. Bill wrote in his blog that the Flyers have asked the Gagne camp to be patient and that they have an agreement in place. Read it again.

... because the market is literally FULL of aging vets who are well out of their prime: Jagr, Prospal, Hejduk, Gomez, Morrow, Ponikarovsky, Lombardi, Connolly, Sullivan, Antropov, etc.
- Tomahawk

This isn't a legit reason why the individual hasn't signed elsewhere.

Why would Gagne wait without any insite of the flyers situation? Why would he wait if the flyers didn't want him. Bill wrote in his blog that the Flyers have asked the Gagne camp to be patient and that they have an agreement in place. Read it again.
- dingo8urbaby

Who said he doesn't have insight to the Flyers situation? Gagne is waiting because he prefers the Flyers, and hasn't gotten an offer that he likes better. And you may need to read the blog again. It doesn't say there's an agreement in place. It says they have met and discussed the situation and salary demands. I've spelled out all the Cap implications for you. And I'll again ask you, if there is an agreement in place, what's the holdup?

This isn't a legit reason why the individual hasn't signed elsewhere.
- dingo8urbaby

Um, it's supply and demand.

Gagne's chances of landing w/ another team is extremely low right now... too many other comparable players in the market, some with less worrisome injury histories and dramatic drop-offs in production.

His best bet has always been to re-up w/ the Flyers because, at least here, he has history to help differentiate himself from the competition.

If the Flyers don't sign him before camp, he'll probably have no choice but to go somewhere (probably here) on a try-out.

Who said he doesn't have insight to the Flyers situation? Gagne is waiting because he prefers the Flyers, and hasn't gotten an offer that he likes better. And you may need to read the blog again. It doesn't say there's an agreement in place. It says they have met and discussed the situation and salary demands. I've spelled out all the Cap implications for you. And I'll again ask you, if there is an agreement in place, what's the holdup?
- MJL

You tell me. You have all the answers and yet you couldn't possibly know anymore then I do. The fact of the matter is there is mutual interest between Gagne and the Flyers and the opportunity is still wide open.

Edit

Gagne's agent and the team have agreed on a salary that is acceptable for both sides. That to me is a deal of dollars and cents is in place. Read Bill's blog again.

You tell me. You have all the answers and yet you couldn't possibly know anymore then I do. The fact of the matter is there is mutual interest between Gagne and the Flyers and the opportunity is still wide open.
- dingo8urbaby

It hinges on salary going out the door so they can max the LTIR exemption on day 1... Gagne's not going to be signing here anytime soon, even if there's a deal in place in principle. They have to move money out first.

It hinges on salary going out the door so they can max the LTIR exemption on day 1... Gagne's not going to be signing here anytime soon, even if there's a deal in place in principle. They have to move money out first.
- Tomahawk

So you agree there could be a deal in place in principle?

So you agree there could be a deal in place in principle?
- dingo8urbaby

The situation could be read in a couple of different ways:

1) Yes, they could actually have something done in principle, and are just waiting for the money to become available to make it final,

2) Gagne and Homer might have talked about what it would cost to keep him, in general terms, and they seem to have narrowed it down. However, Homer hasn't taken it any farther than that, and has simply told Gagne that they don't have the space to sign him right now and they'll circle back and check with him when/if the space opens up.

The situation could be read in a couple of different ways:

1) Yes, they could actually have something done in principle, and are just waiting for the money to become available to make it final,

2) Gagne and Homer might have talked about what it would cost to keep him, in general terms, and they seem to have narrowed it down. However, Homer hasn't taken it any farther than that, and has simply told Gagne that they don't have the space to sign him right now and they'll circle back and check with him when/if the space opens up.
- Tomahawk

I'm basing things are Bill's actual words.

I'm basing things are Bill's actual words.
- dingo8urbaby

Bill's actual words don't say anything about a deal being done:


"It is believed that Gagne's agent, Bob Sauve, and the team are agreed on a salary that is acceptable to both sides. However, that does not guarantee that the team will re-sign the 33-year-old former All-Star. "

"The Flyers have asked the Gagne camp to be patient while the team figures out its cap issues. Sauve has reportedly had exploratory talks with other teams in the event things fall through with the Flyers, but he and Gagne have not rocked the boat or (as Petr Svoboda did last year at the behest of client Jaromir Jagr) gone full speed ahead in seeking competing offers while the Flyers' general manager works on other issues. "

You tell me. You have all the answers and yet you couldn't possibly know anymore then I do. The fact of the matter is there is mutual interest between Gagne and the Flyers and the opportunity is still wide open.

Edit

Gagne's agent and the team have agreed on a salary that is acceptable for both sides. That to me is a deal of dollars and cents is in place. Read Bill's blog again.
- dingo8urbaby

I don't need to read Bill's blog again. You're misreading what that means. It means they know, if the Flyers sign Gagne, what salary is acceptable to each side. It does not say that there is an agreement is in place. The Flyers still have not decided if they will sign Gagne or not. Or else it would be done. That's when an agreement is in place.
It appears as if I do know more. Because I've spelled out the reasons why Gagne hasn't been signed to this point. If you choose to ignore that reality, that's you're choice. And as I've said multiple times, Gagne could still wind up with the Flyers. But it is far from a given.

And now I'm done with this.